Hopefully he'll be forced to sell his collection

[benchod]

I say let it ride Leon,
I have to hand it to Bruce; I almost never read this section of the board but this post got me over here.
Good. bad, or ugly Bruce starts entertaining threads.
Personally I thought his post was ironically hilarious on so many levels.
I'm pretty sure Keith would never need to squeeze two nickels out of Bruce. Bruce would also probably be the first one to wet himself if he ever got the chance to see Keith's collection.

BTW I'm also sure Keith probably receives a lot worse, hateful comments than what Bruce said.

[Rob D.]

Knowing that the groundlings are being solicited to help decide his fate might be punishment enough for Bruce.

[barrysloate]

I'm not going to say publicly whether or not Bruce should be suspended; that's not my call. But I will say that Bruce's sole purpose for linking the news story about Keith was to mock his liberal politics, and to make a political comment of some sort. Although Keith is a major collector and has posted on this board, the only hobby connection Bruce made was he hoped this would cause Keith financial hardship, and in some convoluted thought process, Bruce hoped to be able to buy his collection on the cheap (which of course he wouldn't, since many others would offer far more than he would).

Suspension is up to the moderators, not me. But the thread was not cool.

[19cbb]

How about a poll?
That should be fun.

[Jim VB]

My distaste for Bruce is well known. I abhor the intent of this thread. As Barry stated, the only purpose was to make some claim that this proves that conservative politics trumps liberal thought and wish financial failure on a fellow collector.

This post has no place on a hobby board.

However, in no way should Bruce be suspended or banned for this action. As reprehensible as the original premise was, it doesn't come close to reaching that level. It may show us the workings of a narrow minded, hateful individual, but the world has plenty of those kind.

He's said/done far worse in the past. My expectations of Bruce are so low, I'm sure we will see far worse going forward. But we shouldn't ban him for being a moron (apologies to all other morons for lumping him in.)

[calvindog]

Lots of deep thoughts on this page. Heavy, hand-wringingly deep thoughts.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ax96iVmTCI

[Tsaiko]

Since it's just watercooler talk, it would be harsh to ban them from their basic sustenance, but they could be assigned this task for the next month.
http://cache4.asset-cache.net/xc/200...123AA3B5A18ED0
They could divide the task amongest themselves, so it wouldn't be that much of a hardship on any single one of them.

That's my paper loss common's worth.

[bobafett72]

"He hates to mix politics and the hobby"

hear hear!

[HRBAKER]

Bruce is provocateur, he posts most often for the purpose of getting a reaction. Many take the bait. In this instance he is reveling in someone's misfortune bc that person is on the opposite side of the political spectrum from him. I don't give a rat's patoot if you ban/punish him or not. The best medicine is to ignore him for it is the attention/reaction he seeks most.

As an aside for MSNBC to get self righteous about one of their commentators making a political donation is inane. No one considers these people, regeardless of the network, to be impartial newspeople. As pointed out these folks are entertainers plain and simple.

[autograf]

HR is always the voice of reason and sanity.......I'm up in the air about banning. Sometimes it's nice to be reminded just how much of moron Bruce continues to be. I think he's a sad, lonely person who revels in others misery. As for Olbermann, there's probably not 1-2% of what he espouses that I agree with but this is America (last time i checked) and he's got a right to say it. In fact, he gets paid a LOT of money to say it. I'm sure a few days or weeks off without pay won't hurt him, but I don't see where MSNBC (GE) comes off by suspending him. I guess he knew the policy but for commentators to be held to the same standard as a newscaster seems odd to me. I've sold stuff to Keith and as a collector I certainly respect his collection. He was always nice to me in any transaction. Hopefully saber heads will prevail and he will be back. I liked him much more on Sportscenter however.

[Leon]

After giving it more thought and soliciting opinions on what to do, it was almost a tie. It was about 50/50 on banning/suspending. Personally, I never thought this thread, and Bruce's posts, arose to that level of punishment, and I still don't. As few people know, but has always been on the board, there is a personal section when you click on someone's name. You can find contact info, all of the member's posts and threads and other board related info. There is also a section that says "Infractions." If you look under Bruce's infractions you will see that he still has one there (the very few times we have given an infraction we have usually made them for one year). So, Bruce had one still active. I am not sure if that was when he got suspended from before, for a month, or not, but it swayed my opinion to take an action. He is suspended from the board for 2 months. It's not a matter I take lightly and I hate to do it, but I feel it was warranted because of the previous infraction....not to mention the other 3 moderators were of a different opinion than I on this matter. This is the part of moderating I don't care for..Lets please get back to collecting........best regards

[tbob]

I always tried to cut him slack because Barry had mentioned that off-line he was not the same bombastic, petulant and self-absorbed person he comes across as on-line, but enough is enough. I think the suspension is just. I achieve no joy over the action but the culmination of many threats and mean-spirited attacks on my fellow collectors over the years hoisted him on his own petard.
Back to baseball cards...

[19cbb]

MSNBC TV to reinstate suspended host Keith Olbermann on Tuesday - NBC Universal

http://www.nbcuniversal.presscentre....D=2&ClientID=7

07 Nov 2010 8:51 PM

STATEMENT REGARDING KEITH OLBERMANN - SUNDAY, NOV. 7

From Phil Griffin, President of MSNBC:

After several days of deliberation and discussion, I have determined that suspending Keith through and including Monday night's program is an appropriate punishment for his violation of our policy. We look forward to having him back on the air Tuesday night.

[autograf]

So can he read but not post or can he not even read? Good news about Olbermann although I don't watch MSNBC.......ever.......

[Leon]

There are ways he can still read but not sure if he will know that, or if he will want to..........oh well. From his actions and words I don't think he would care about any of us. Also, I hope folks won't comment too much about him since he won't be able to defend himself.

[rholmes]

In a perfect world Keith and Bruce would serve concurrent suspensions and be re-instated to job and board at the same hour on the same day.

I was pretty vocal this time around about Bruce, but believe me when I say suspension brings no satisfaction. I'd much rather he somehow, miraculously, be a cool guy. I am glad to know, however, that you can't be as shit*y a person as Bruce constantly seemed to want to be on the board and always get away with it.

[Leon]

For the record Brucii sent an email to me, which to me, looked like he was threatening legal action, copying a/his lawyer. I just don't have time for him anymore and he is now banned indefinitely. best regards

[calvindog]

Indefinitely? So he'll be back Tuesday night?

[Leon]

Originally Posted by calvindog

Indefinitely? So he'll be back Tuesday night?

The word the system uses is probably more accurate; FOREVER, I was making it sound a bit less harsh.

[FUBAR]

Don't suspend a guy for having an opinion different then yours.

My opinion, lock the thread and lets move on to more friendly and important issues.. nobody is right, nobody is wrong....we just agree to disagree!

[Leon]

Originally Posted by FUBAR

Don't suspend a guy for having an opinion different then yours.

My opinion, lock the thread and lets move on to more friendly and important issues.. nobody is right, nobody is wrong....we just agree to disagree!

I understand Jim. And I was in that camp too.....I was going to go with a verbal warning until I noticed he already had a current infraction for the same thing. Then I made it a 2 mos suspension, which I could have been politely talked into lowering, if an apology or something would have been done. Then his idiotic email, copying his lawyer and threatening legal action just pushed me over the edge. "Forever" is a long time and I doubt I will keep that stance. But Bruce does things that are detrimental to the welfare of the board, and those are bannable violations (especially after multiple instances). I am an easy going person. Look how much I fought for him in this thread. I don't hate the guy at all, quite the contrary. I just get tired of defending him, and then to have him threaten legal action as I am doing so, just turned me off. What can I say? I wish the whole thing would have never happened but I didn't start the thread wishing ill will on another member. best regards

[celoknob]

Originally Posted by FUBAR

Don't suspend a guy for having an opinion different then yours.

My opinion, lock the thread and lets move on to more friendly and important issues.. nobody is right, nobody is wrong....we just agree to disagree!

It wasn't about a difference of opinion or "agreeing to disagree". It was about wishing a fellow board member to lose his job, lose his collection and income so that the poster can get some items cheaper for himself. How is that appropriate or have anything to do with a reasonable discussion about baseball memorabilia?

This is a baseball card forum--not a political forum or forum of hate. Why shouldn't some degree of civility be a requirement? If this was the only time and just a heated emotional slip up....I would agree with more or less letting it go. I'm tolerant of other views and mistakes. But the death threats and constant very ugly personal attacks from this person ever since I have been a member are very unpleasant. It never ceases. Our society increasing seems to almost relish uncivil dialogue but surely there is a line somewhere.

[Jim VB]

Originally Posted by Yankeefan51

Jay

It is free country. We, for example, never worked for scandal ridden company that nearly brought the economy to its knees.

I, for one, want to know more about this board member who brought the economy "to its knees!"

That's powerful stuff. (And I'm sorry if I made fun of you for the "jerk" comment. I didn't mean it. Please don't hurt me!)

Originally Posted by Yankeefan51

And it would be nice if there was less competition in themarketplace. Time to stick to trading and basbeall cards. And do what is RIGHT for America!

Bruce

In reflection, this is one of the funniest lines ever. The irony is too thick to cut.

[slidekellyslide]

I say good riddance...Bruce may have contributed the occasional interesting post, but he almost always ruined it in some way, and I can guarantee his ulterior motive for most of his posts was to find a seller for something he coveted. And if you ever help the guy out don't expect any thank you from him.. He can claim he was being attacked, but for the most part he gave as good as he got, and frankly anyone who posts on a message board in the royal "We" is just asking for it. He is without doubt the rudest member this forum has ever had.

I also think it's hilarious that he threatens Leon with legal action for banning him on a message forum THAT LEON OWNS. Doesn't Bruce believe in property rights???

[barrysloate]

Bruce of course won't sue Leon because he has no case. But what seems clear is that if Leon lets him back on the board, it will be business as usual, with Bruce treating everyone rudely he doesn't like. I would welcome him back if he agreed to take a different approach, but he won't.

[autograf]

No....the funniest part of this thread was Bruce telling Jay Miller he'd (Jay) buy a card from Bin Laden if he needed it on one breath and then immediately telling Jay that he'd paid Bruce a record price for a Kalamazoo Bats team cabinet to which Jay replied that Bruce had proved his point in his own post. THAT was humor you just can't make up.

Congrats to Olbermann......guess he can put that ramen noodle soup back to the back of his pantry. Break out the Progresso............

[Jim VB]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

But what seems clear is that if Leon lets him back on the board, it will be business as usual, with Bruce treating everyone rudely he doesn't like.

Barry,

I've been meaning to speak with you about sentence structure.

[barrysloate]

Originally Posted by Jim VB

Barry,


I've been meaning to speak with you about sentence structure.

You know Jim, I changed that sentence at the last minute. I didn't like it the first way I had it...and I don't like it so much this way either. But I'll just leave it.

[Anthony S.]

Don't worry, Barry. I'll find the other half of that infinitive. I think I see it way over ther...wait, no, that's a squirrel.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by Leon

I understand Jim. And I was in that camp too.....I was going to go with a verbal warning until I noticed he already had a current infraction for the same thing. Then I made it a 2 mos suspension, which I could have been politely talked into lowering, if an apology or something would have been done. Then his idiotic email, copying his lawyer and threatening legal action just pushed me over the edge. "Forever" is a long time and I doubt I will keep that stance. But Bruce does things that are detrimental to the welfare of the board, and those are bannable violations (especially after multiple instances). I am an easy going person. Look how much I fought for him in this thread. I don't hate the guy at all, quite the contrary. I just get tired of defending him, and then to have him threaten legal action as I am doing so, just turned me off. What can I say? I wish the whole thing would have never happened but I didn't start the thread wishing ill will on another member. best regards

Well... bye.

[Rob D.]

Originally Posted by Anthony S.

Don't worry, Barry. I'll find the other half of that infinitive. I think I see it way over ther...wait, no, that's a squirrel.

While you all have been posting about proper sentence structure, thereby drawing more attention to this thread, I've been able to purchase three ultra-high-grade copies of The Elements of Style and an autographed photo of Strunk and White. At bargain prices, no less.

[Jim VB]

Originally Posted by Rob D.

While you all have been posting about proper sentence structure, thereby drawing more attention to this thread, I've been able to purchase three ultra-high-grade copies of The Elements of Style and an autographed photo of Strunk and White. At bargain prices, no less.

"Whilst" you moron. Not "while."

And "we", not "I."


I thought you were good at this!

[Leon]

Last night, when Brucii and I were emailing, he told me while I was banning him he found 2 ultra rare cards and made deals on them from the BST. He seriously said that....

Now who do we have to draw drama to the site? It's all ya'lls fault!!

[Jim VB]

Hey, I voted for him to NOT be banned!

[FUBAR]

I was just trying to keep the peace.... and was hoping that it wasn't getting so personal.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvTNyKIGXiI

[thekingofclout]

Originally Posted by Leon

After giving it more thought and soliciting opinions on what to do, it was almost a tie. It was about 50/50 on banning/suspending. Personally, I never thought this thread, and Bruce's posts, arose to that level of punishment, and I still don't. As few people know, but has always been on the board, there is a personal section when you click on someone's name. You can find contact info, all of the member's posts and threads and other board related info. There is also a section that says "Infractions." If you look under Bruce's infractions you will see that he still has one there (the very few times we have given an infraction we have usually made them for one year). So, Bruce had one still active. I am not sure if that was when he got suspended from before, for a month, or not, but it swayed my opinion to take an action. He is suspended from the board for 2 months. It's not a matter I take lightly and I hate to do it, but I feel it was warranted because of the previous infraction....not to mention the other 3 moderators were of a different opinion than I on this matter. This is the part of moderating I don't care for..Lets please get back to collecting........best regards

Ohh. So Bruce was already on "Double Secret Probation" when he made the Olbermann remarks. That will get you every time.

[Robextend]

Originally Posted by Leon

Last night, when Brucii and I were emailing, he told me while I was banning him he found 2 ultra rare cards and made deals on them from the BST. He seriously said that....

I found two 1992 Fleer Ultra Scott Brosius rookie cards last night.

[tinkereversandme]

Maybe not now, or five years, or maybe ten years, there will come a time when KO will part with his items for one reason or another and I hope I live long enough to see what he has collected over time. I never thought Barry Halper would sell his collection (being so young) and I was able to pick up a few pieces that...well, I hope are good.

Added: A person should only be banned (IMO) if it's detremental to the board and there is a history of behavement which is not in line with what is expected of the collective group. I belong to several Message Boards and I like the maturity of this Board and the way it is policed.

Larry

[chaddurbin]

imo ko won't be selling his collection...he'd prolly just gift it to the hof or smth similar.

(he'd never get back his 16k per alex gordon rcs anyways...)

[Rickyy]

Originally Posted by Leon

Last night, when Brucii and I were emailing, he told me while I was banning him he found 2 ultra rare cards and made deals on them from the BST. He seriously said that....

Now who do we have to draw drama to the site? It's all ya'lls fault!!

Was it from Keith Olbermann?

[Rich Klein]

Several minutes of my life that I will not be able to get back reading this thread, I reluctantly agree with Leon that the banishment was probably warranted although in a "watercooler" situation, this post was borderline.

Note -- I was later informed that this began on the main boards ----- but I'll repeat because of who the post was about the issue is borderline. However, with Bruce, one of the issues is almost everything he does is borderline so sure enough, one more can be the straw that breaks the camel back

Bruce liked to post interesting topics and then "walk away", which is his right. The biggest problem with Bruce's posts is that some of thre responses or emails (I still have one of his classics to me on file as well)became "personal attacks" -- or posts wishing ill on others. In Mr. O's case, you can defend these posts as comments about a celebrity and you would probably win in court although I'm not a lawyer I have stayed at a Holiday Inn Express.

However, the body of work regarding Bruce's posts, e-mails and other issues is probably what drove everyone over the edge.


So, regretfully, whilst we will miss his interesting takes on the higher end of the hobby, he needs to walk away and join a group of similarly Ivy-educated high-brow collectors to let us regular folks chat about these musty old cards


Regards
Rich

[ramram]

It seems quite ironic that the Board's ratings have gone down 72% since Bruce's banning.

Just like MSNBC, Leon will soon feel compeled to bring Bruce back just to get his ratings back.

Rob M.

[Robextend]

Does this also mean that Bruce is not eligible for the Net54 Hall of Fame?

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Robextend

Does this also mean that Bruce is not eligible for the Net54 Hall of Fame?

Brucii is in the inaugural Net54 Hall of Shame Class of 2010.

And, no doubt that at some time in the future I will probably let Brucii back. Not because of ratings (though I guess drama helps) but because I didn't feel this last offense went that overboard. He wouldn't have even got suspended this time had he not copied his lawyer on an email to me, threatening (so it seemed to me and a few others) legal action. After defending his lunacy so much, that just pushed me over the edge. regards

[jboosted92]

could someone still explain the "we" to me?

[ramram]

Nope.

[Jim VB]

Originally Posted by jboosted92

could someone still explain the "we" to me?

What Rob just said.


There is no rational explanation.

[barrysloate]

I think part of the reason Bruce uses "we" is that it irks people on the board. He seems to get some pleasure out of that. Again, like others I can't explain it- it's just an observation.

[HRBAKER]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

I think part of the reason Bruce uses "we" is that it irks people on the board. He seems to get some pleasure out of that. Again, like others I can't explain it- it's just an observation.

Barry I think you are right. Just as puzzling a question as why he does it to me is why do people care? He is just seeking a reaction and just like clockwork he gets it.

[Republicaninmass]

Originally Posted by jboosted92

could someone still explain the "we" to me?

He has a mouse in his pocket