OT: Could Alex Rodriguez qualify for Comeback Player of the Year?

[Brian Van Horn]

I'll leave it up to you to discuss, but could Alex Rodriguez qualify for Comeback Player of the Year?

[conor912]

Depends on if there's standards for what you're coming back FROM.....

[baseball tourist]

It would be a travesty to award it or anything to him.

[oldjudge]

He has done everything right this year and, as of now, is absolutely the comeback player of the year.

[iwantitiwinit]

Comeback PED user of the year. In my opinion he remains on the juice, no reason to think he's off them. Hmmm a 40 year old hits a 452 foot home run that seems vaguely familiar to someone else playing in the early 2000's. Get serious, he has lied about PED use at least twice, he was unable to stay off them after having been caught using them the first time. He makes me sick and I refuse to attend a Yankee game while he is on the active roster. Went to 25+ games last year and none this year, its a travesty.

Remember this:?

http://m.mlb.com/news/article/3811116/

And this:?

http://www.miamiherald.com/sports/ml...le3578762.html


Come on get real. Prediction, there will be a third scandal before the end of 2016.

[Jim65]

I know it doesn't always work this way but liars and cheaters should never be rewarded.

[egbeachley]

Cashing out the last few years of his contract is more important to production for A-Rod. He is not on PEDa but he did benefit from the year off. Essentially that's what PEDd do, they efficiently repair your body - like having a year off.

Who else would be in the running? Bryce Harper?

[Rich Klein]

There are no restrictions on who is eligible for that award (or MVP or Cy Young, etc). The proper question is, do you believe because of the PED past, is what he is doing in 2015 worthy of this award.

[packs]

I think his only real challengers are Kendrys Morales or Jose Iglesias.

[howard38]

[QUOTE=packs;1435228]I think his only real challengers are Kendrys Morales or Jose Iglesias.[/QUOTE
Mark Teixeira, would be a prime candidate if his resurgance was not being overshadowed by A-Rod.

[howard38]

[QUOTE=packs;1435228]I think his only real challengers are Kendrys Morales or Jose Iglesias.[/QUOTE
Mark Teixeira, would be a prime candidate if he was not being overshadowed by A-Rod.

[bmattioli]

Alex who??

[pokerplyr80]

My stance on known or suspected steroid users isn't quite as harsh as others. I feel guys like Bonds, Clemens, and even A-Rod should be in the hall even though it's unlikely they will be any time soon, if ever. MLB didn't even test for steroids until 2003. If it was really that big of a concern while it was happening baseball would have done something about it then.

I know there are a lot of people who strongly oppose any player who cheated from being honored or rewarded and I do see their point. But If most pitchers and hitters in this time were using in way they were just leveling the playing field.

Even if they had a separate steroid era section of the hall of fame, I think these players should be remembered.

[midwaylandscaping]

He or Teixeira would be good choices. I don't hold the PED use against of the guys, be it A-Rod, Palmeiro or whoever. Probably because had I been a player in that era, I would have been a PED guy.

[conor912]

I care less about the PEDs than I do his grand aura of douchery, but we all know MLB couldn't care less about character.....

[pokerplyr80]

Originally Posted by conor912

I care less about the PEDs than I do his grand aura of douchery, but we all know MLB couldn't care less about character.....

I can't argue with that. Same with Lance Armstrong. Even though in his case 99% of the other riders were using something as well the lies and lack of character did him in just as much. Sometimes it's best just to admit what happened instead of making things worse.

[skelly]

In contrast to a previous post, I have finally made it back to Yankee Stadium because of A-Rod. Don't kid yourself, he's great for the Yankees, people are interested in how he does. I do not feel that A-Rod is on the sauce. I feel that his production is the result of a few factors.

1. He has solid mechanics that have stayed with him throughout his career.


2. Only having to concentrate on hitting has helped him. For some players they feel that they aren't really in the flow of the game when not in the field. For A-Rod this has helped.

3. This is the X-factor, but don't think for a second that A-Rod misses Jeter.

I would love to see A-Rod continue his success. For the record, I'm not a Clemens or McGuire guy, so it's not like I have a thing for the juice crew. I just think it's cool how he was completely written off, his own team didn't even want him, and here he is.

[iwantitiwinit]

When something seems too good to be true it usually is.

[Jay Wolt]

Originally Posted by packs

I think his only real challengers are Kendrys Morales or Jose Iglesias.

Arod is doing better then anyone expected, but I would give the award to Prince Fielder
He missed most of the season last year & when he played he hit under .250. now he's in the 330's

[Eric72]

.

[bigtrain]

Went to see the Amy Schumer movie "Trainwreck" last weekend. There is an
abusive comment about A-rod that made me laugh but I was thinking this guy can't even go to the movie without being ridiculed. BTW Lebron is terrific
in the movie. Steals every scene he is in.

[KCRfan1]

I have no problem at giving the award to ARod. IMO, most players in the league were on PED's then, and the players who put up the crazy numbers were already extremely talented, and would have excelled anyways. Many of the PED users did not excel, because the talent just was not there for them. You still have to be able to hit the ball ( square it up and make contact ), and PED's did not help you in that respect.

[chaddurbin]

he's probably the favorite to win right now, and i have no problem with that. he must've hired a new pr firm, because everything coming out of his mouth now he credits his teammates, he just wants to help the team wins, he doesn't really care about the stats etc etc...i'm almost buying it!

forget pete rose, put arod bonds clemens in the hall....

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by conor912

I care less about the PEDs than I do his grand aura of douchery, but we all know MLB couldn't care less about character.....

Supremely talented baseball player, loser as a human being both on and off the field. His slap of Bronson Arroyo's glove in the 04 playoffs and then arguing it was incidental spoke volumes about him.

Oh and this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9NSSCzrnRw

[Vintageclout]

Originally Posted by oldjudge

He has done everything right this year and, as of now, is absolutely the comeback player of the year.

+1! He served his penalty which was more severe than any of the other PED users and has seemingly walked a straight line since. Considering that hitting a baseball at a major league level is arguably the toughest task in sports, his performance this year (after missing a full season at the age of 39) is nothing short of miraculous.

[darwinbulldog]

The impression I came away with from reading "The Education of Alex Rodriguez" was not so much that he's a narcissist (cf. Donald Trump, Kanye West) as that he just has low intelligence. I don't mean that in a flippant "Man, what an idiot! How could he act that way?" sense; I just mean literally he seems to have a lower IQ than all the people around him, and he's just trying to follow everyone's advice because he knows they're smarter than he is. That's actually the same thing I've heard about Shoeless Joe. I don't think either of them is particularly heroic, or even brave, and the word tragic is overused, but I think for both men their situation is sad and is more understandable in light of appreciating what it would be like to be in the spotlight and being constantly worried that everyone is on the verge of recognizing that you have this embarrassing flaw. So what do you do? You latch on to the people around you and say the things they tell you to say or the things you've heard them say (This is why he only speaks in cliches. He lacks the aptitude to conceive of anything clever to say on his own.) and act the way they tell you to act ("Hey, Alex, why don't you kiss that mirror? That would make a great picture.") or the way you've seen them act.

There's a reason that in the more serious case of the death penalty there is an IQ cutoff (70 here in Florida). A-Rod's clearly not in that range, but I'd be surprised if his IQ was above 85. That's not particularly unusual; it just means he's in the bottom sixth of the population. I don't see anything untoward about expecting people who in fact are smarter to be able to act smarter. I don't think A-Rod is a bad person. He's a great baseball player, he cheated, he was punished, and he's doing the right things now. I agree with the sentiment of allowing someone to move on with his life after he has done his time.

The answer to the original question is yes.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Whose example was Alex emulating when he blatantly cheated by slapping the ball out of Arroyo's hand and then pretending he hadn't?

[Joshchisox08]

Originally Posted by KCRfan1

I have no problem at giving the award to ARod. IMO, most players in the league were on PED's then, and the players who put up the crazy numbers were already extremely talented, and would have excelled anyways. Many of the PED users did not excel, because the talent just was not there for them. You still have to be able to hit the ball ( square it up and make contact ), and PED's did not help you in that respect.

It's hard to say you make great points. Most players in the league were but most players aren't the player/teammate Rodriguez was.

He should be lucky he's playing right now period. If it were up to me and I was the commissioner he wouldn't have been allowed to play again though I'm sure that would be a scrap with the players association.

He's lied multiple times, people have wound up in jail and yet he get's to still play and make more than we can dream of.

An award you say ?? Well if he's allowed to play why wouldn't he be eligible ??

It's a double edged sword. Obviously the majority of people (I think) would rather him have come out this season and fall on his ass and ride the bench. Or would rather him just not play at all. But the fact is he's being allowed to pay, he served his "punishment" so he technically will/could/can be eligible for the award. He can/will be eligible for Cooperstown but just because he can/will be doesn't mean he'll get it.

[packs]

Why do you think players who used PEDs would have excelled anyway? Jason Giambi was a player who used PEDs. He was absolutely terrible in short order. As was Brady Anderson, Luis Gonzalez, Shawn Green and on and on. The only reason you recognize any of those names is because they used PEDs and were suddenly good.

There is no way you can ever say A-rod is a good player because who knows when he was and wasn't on PEDs. Saying he would have been A-rod with or without them is not something I think you can really know.

[HRBAKER]

It doesn't matter to me whether he gets it or not. ARod will always be the supreme narcissist to me. Tons and tons of natural talent but it wasn't enough. His lying and lying and lying and cheating reveal his true character to me. He will always be dogged by being the guy with a mountain of stats and no clear way to determine what he would have really done on his own. In a couple of years he will be gone and go down as one of the most successful of the PED era. Good for him, it neither erases what he did or who he was.

[glchen]

Jhonny Peralta, Yasmany Grandal, and Ryan Braun all made the All Star game this year after serving lengthy suspensions for PED's. If ARod is the worst liar on PED's, then Ryan Braun is in the Top 5. I don't think you can single out ARod, and say he shouldn't be eligible for any awards and then give these other PED users a pass.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by HRBAKER

It doesn't matter to me whether he gets it or not. ARod will always be the supreme narcissist to me. Tons and tons of natural talent but it wasn't enough. His lying and lying and lying and cheating reveal his true character to me. He will always be dogged by being the guy with a mountain of stats and no clear way to determine what he would have really done on his own. In a couple of years he will be gone and go down as one of the most successful of the PED era. Good for him, it neither erases what he did or who he was.

He may never get over the comparisons to Jeter, who was so much more beloved despite being far less talented.
For me, his defining moment:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lxPNcrvR46Q

[clydepepper]

Originally Posted by Brian Van Horn

I'll leave it up to you to discuss, but could Alex Rodriguez qualify for Comeback Player of the Year?

Whatever he 'wins' or gets 'awarded' should always be followed by an ( * )
.
.
Roger Maris never cheated but got one, so why shouldn't A-Roid?
.
.

[Joshchisox08]

Originally Posted by glchen

Jhonny Peralta, Yasmany Grandal, and Ryan Braun all made the All Star game this year after serving lengthy suspensions for PED's. If ARod is the worst liar on PED's, then Ryan Braun is in the Top 5. I don't think you can single out ARod, and say he shouldn't be eligible for any awards and then give these other PED users a pass.

That's the problem Gary. I think A-Roid has been the one that has been made an example of which isn't a bad candidate. But Bonds shouldn't be brought up in Greatest of All-Time forum as a result of his use either.

McGwire fan always even though he cheated even though he admitted it (finally).

It's really just a weird situation. Steroids in general. If you have ever seen the documentary "Bigger Faster Stronger" it might change your opinion on them in general I know it changed mine. But still even though I think steroids ARE publicly and lawfully viewed as wrong I will say that they're not as harmful as they're made out to be. In a sense they're made out just as bad as pot used to be made out. Don't get me wrong there ARE side effects that are negative and probably a lot worse than pot but it's just a comparison.

I guess what i'm saying for me personally it's really hard. So many players did it. You can dislike players and use the steroid fact against them if you dislike them because they're a-holes like Bonds and A-Roid. But when it comes down to it they did physically do what they did when other people were also using as well.

Still a LOT of former PED users in the league right now and my team is no different. Jose Quintana, Adrien Nieto, Melky Cabrera, etc.

Hard to say it but if players are (silently banned) from the HOF for it then it's a NO NO. Otherwise you let the 8 men out back in.

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Supremely talented baseball player, loser as a human being both on and off the field. His slap of Bronson Arroyo's glove in the 04 playoffs and then arguing it was incidental spoke volumes about him.

Oh and this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9NSSCzrnRw

For me, neither of those is any worse than:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9U9jttDSUCg

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by clydepepper

Roger Maris never cheated but got one, so why shouldn't A-Roid?
.
.

There was never an asterisk attached to Roger Maris's record.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Tabe

For me, neither of those is any worse than:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9U9jttDSUCg

Yeah that was very disappointing, I remember it. When I first saw it I thought well maybe even if it just hit the bat the vibration could sting a lot but then he and the Yankees were justifying the sales job. Not good.

[ls7plus]

Originally Posted by Joshchisox08

That's the problem Gary. I think A-Roid has been the one that has been made an example of which isn't a bad candidate. But Bonds shouldn't be brought up in Greatest of All-Time forum as a result of his use either.

McGwire fan always even though he cheated even though he admitted it (finally).

It's really just a weird situation. Steroids in general. If you have ever seen the documentary "Bigger Faster Stronger" it might change your opinion on them in general I know it changed mine. But still even though I think steroids ARE publicly and lawfully viewed as wrong I will say that they're not as harmful as they're made out to be. In a sense they're made out just as bad as pot used to be made out. Don't get me wrong there ARE side effects that are negative and probably a lot worse than pot but it's just a comparison.

I guess what i'm saying for me personally it's really hard. So many players did it. You can dislike players and use the steroid fact against them if you dislike them because they're a-holes like Bonds and A-Roid. But when it comes down to it they did physically do what they did when other people were also using as well.

Still a LOT of former PED users in the league right now and my team is no different. Jose Quintana, Adrien Nieto, Melky Cabrera, etc.

Hard to say it but if players are (silently banned) from the HOF for it then it's a NO NO. Otherwise you let the 8 men out back in.

It's been said more than once: if you took a whole bottle of aspirin, caffeine pills or steroids, the only one that wouldn't kill you would be the steroids. That having been said, anyone who thinks PEDs are gone from the game is not living in the real world. None of the Biogenics players ever tested positive for any banned substance, and very few 39 year-old's have ever hit 30+ HR's.

Comeback player of the year? Not by my vote.

Larry

[Peter_Spaeth]

Yeah when you lie and lie and lie, nobody believes you even when you're telling the truth. I wouldn't place big bucks on ARod being clean, given his history, and his obsession with achievement at any price.

[HRBAKER]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Yeah when you lie and lie and lie, nobody believes you even when you're telling the truth. I wouldn't place big bucks on ARod being clean, given his history, and his obsession with achievement at any price.

This. Why on earth would anyone believe a word he has to say. He may be as clean as snow, however he has abdicated any benefit of the doubt.

[conor912]

Originally Posted by darwinbulldog

The impression I came away with from reading "The Education of Alex Rodriguez" was not so much that he's a narcissist (cf. Donald Trump, Kanye West) as that he just has low intelligence. I don't mean that in a flippant "Man, what an idiot! How could he act that way?" sense; I just mean literally he seems to have a lower IQ than all the people around him, and he's just trying to follow everyone's advice because he knows they're smarter than he is. That's actually the same thing I've heard about Shoeless Joe. I don't think either of them is particularly heroic, or even brave, and the word tragic is overused, but I think for both men their situation is sad and is more understandable in light of appreciating what it would be like to be in the spotlight and being constantly worried that everyone is on the verge of recognizing that you have this embarrassing flaw. So what do you do? You latch on to the people around you and say the things they tell you to say or the things you've heard them say (This is why he only speaks in cliches. He lacks the aptitude to conceive of anything clever to say on his own.) and act the way they tell you to act ("Hey, Alex, why don't you kiss that mirror? That would make a great picture.") or the way you've seen them act.

There's a reason that in the more serious case of the death penalty there is an IQ cutoff (70 here in Florida). A-Rod's clearly not in that range, but I'd be surprised if his IQ was above 85. That's not particularly unusual; it just means he's in the bottom sixth of the population. I don't see anything untoward about expecting people who in fact are smarter to be able to act smarter. I don't think A-Rod is a bad person. He's a great baseball player, he cheated, he was punished, and he's doing the right things now. I agree with the sentiment of allowing someone to move on with his life after he has done his time.

The answer to the original question is yes.

I don't think its a secret he's not bright, but this is an interesting theory, nonetheless.