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  #1  
Old 09-24-2020, 03:45 PM
Econteachert205 Econteachert205 is offline
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Default Star Basketball sets to avoid master list

Hi, I tried looking around the internet for a master list of bad/later/fake star sets. So far I have

Avoid: (many include Levin COA’s and were shop at home fakes)
1984-1985 lite all stars white version
Miller Lite 1986
Blue border Olympic 1984-85
Crunch n' Munch 1986
1986 Chicago Bulls arena set
UNC Michael Jordan
Michael Jordan ten card Olympic
1985 roy set white with red letters
84-85 all rookies blue border
Yellow border non 5x7 court Kings 1985
Gatorade set white
Any 5x7's printed as standard size cards
Black or white Jordan 101 XRC

Unknown if original or later (in dispute):
Best of the Best
Magic Johnson subset


Avoid unless graded by Beckett:
Best of the new 4 card set (type 2's based off original plates were reprinted later)
Michael Jordan subset (Type 2's were reprinted later)
1985-86 main set numbers 95-172 (also later reprinted)

Note: It does not seem that full sealed sets have been reprinted that I can find thus far.

Last edited by Econteachert205; 10-16-2020 at 07:38 AM.
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  #2  
Old 09-24-2020, 05:45 PM
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Raw Best of the New I would avoid...and do you mean the Olympic subset? Haven't heard anything wide spread on that one...

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  #3  
Old 09-24-2020, 05:53 PM
Econteachert205 Econteachert205 is offline
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In the interview with Steve Taft:

https://jordancards.com/blog/the-rea...rt-steve-taft/


He seems to say the 84-85 Olympic subset Is a shop at home product.
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  #4  
Old 09-24-2020, 06:05 PM
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I think thats more crap with the different color borders...

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  #5  
Old 09-24-2020, 06:16 PM
Econteachert205 Econteachert205 is offline
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Ok yes, not to be confused with the red border Olympic set which is legit. There is also a McDonald’s all American star Jordan card on eBay that has bids now that isn’t any good. There just seems to be a lot of bad stuff out there masquerading as legit star.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1984-85-Sta...AAAOSwhjlfOG3X

Last edited by Econteachert205; 09-24-2020 at 06:19 PM.
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  #6  
Old 09-30-2020, 03:42 PM
Econteachert205 Econteachert205 is offline
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The 86 Bulls arena set is bad. The 10 card Jordan subset does exist but not with this card so it is bad as well.

I'm curious if the COA with the best of the new set is ok.
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  #7  
Old 09-30-2020, 04:07 PM
Econteachert205 Econteachert205 is offline
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If you look at sold eBay listings for Jordan star hsn cards the cards are selling for 40-100 dollars each with 10 bids plus. All raw. Am I crazy or dumb or missing something?
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  #8  
Old 09-30-2020, 04:10 PM
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all bad
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  #9  
Old 09-30-2020, 04:12 PM
Econteachert205 Econteachert205 is offline
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more
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  #10  
Old 10-08-2020, 09:28 AM
Econteachert205 Econteachert205 is offline
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updated information in first post for those interested.
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  #11  
Old 10-08-2020, 03:27 PM
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Another
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Last edited by Econteachert205; 10-08-2020 at 03:38 PM.
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  #12  
Old 10-09-2020, 05:42 PM
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Yikes this is on probstein and unless someone corrects me I do not think is legit at all

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1984-85-Sta...1&LH_Auction=1

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1984-85-Sta...t&LH_Auction=1


https://www.ebay.com/itm/1984-85-Sta...ff4ds&LH_All=1

Last edited by Econteachert205; 10-09-2020 at 05:46 PM.
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  #13  
Old 10-10-2020, 10:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Econteachert205 View Post
Complete garbage all of it

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  #14  
Old 10-10-2020, 11:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hxcmilkshake View Post
Complete garbage all of it

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Thank you for responding. I would think Probstein would know better. So much of this junk is selling and itís too bad because it causes people to be soured on the really great legit star products.
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  #15  
Old 10-10-2020, 07:42 PM
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Default Garbage

Are those common fakes? I have never seen them before.
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  #16  
Old 10-11-2020, 11:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aro13 View Post
Are those common fakes? I have never seen them before.
This is why I am compiling a list of all known fakes. They all seem to fall into three categories:

1. Fantasy sets: Almost all of which were part of the 1997 shop at home scandal and bear Levin coa’s. I haven’t yet determined how many different of these sets were made and I add as I see them.

2. Reprints: mostly of Jordan’s and high end rcs. Often sold with the rp designation but also sometimes passed as unknown or real. It seems like one way to discern most of these is the lack of topcoat light gloss surface on the front. The photo is often not as clear as well. Often factory star cards had ink bleed on the sides and reprints or sheet cut will not.

As the prices rise more and more seem to come out. If anyone remembers the shop at home scandal I’d love to hear more but my guess is the print run on those sets is 10000 plus so yes they are prevalent.

Last edited by Econteachert205; 10-16-2020 at 07:46 AM.
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  #17  
Old 10-14-2020, 09:22 AM
Econteachert205 Econteachert205 is offline
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Here is something else to be aware of with these star cards:

There are definitely uncut sheets out there. In fact many sets were sold as sheets at the time. This means many sheet cut cards exist out there. So far I have seen:

83-84 all star
lakers champs
1985-1986 featuring jordan set, best of new and much of the 86 set
1984-1985 set featuring Jordan 101 and olmypic
1983-84 Bullets and kings oddly with the Carl Yaz set
1986 Best of Best with Magic Johnson set (according to basketball gold these sets can only be submitted by Schonco to Beckett for grading although I do not know if that information is current). It is my understanding that many of the raw cards in these sets are in fact sheet cut.
1986 court kings
Portland 5x7
5x7 red dunk set with 5x7 pistons and 5x7 lakers and 5x7 rockets
5x7 sixers
last 11 ROY set, all rookie team, Dale Murphy baseball set, rod carew set, coaches set, Kareem set and Nolan ryan strikeout king card all on one sheet

It is very likely that certain raw cards are in fact sheet cut and won't grade, so look closely at edges. Also if cards are being sold as "prototypes" and seem larger than normal, it is likely they are just sheet cut with pieces of the sheet left on.

Last edited by Econteachert205; 10-15-2020 at 06:26 AM.
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  #18  
Old 10-14-2020, 03:23 PM
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Does Beckett know what it is doing? I am not being snarky; if I decide to buy a Star card that is Beckett graded can I at least take for granted that I am not buying a fake, reprint or SAH fantasy card?
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  #19  
Old 10-14-2020, 05:21 PM
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Adam, I am planning on doing a deep dive into graded Beckett soon to see if/what the graded issues are. Beckett does know enough to stay away from the shop at home Fantasy garbage and obvious fakes, so yes to that. The sheet cut stuff and potential second print run cards like the Jordan series, best of new and best of best I am not 100 percent on.

Last edited by Econteachert205; 10-14-2020 at 05:21 PM.
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  #20  
Old 10-15-2020, 06:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Econteachert205 View Post
Here is something else to be aware of with these star cards:

There are definitely uncut sheets out there. In fact many sets were sold as sheets at the time. This means many sheet cut cards exist out there. So far I have seen:

83-84 all star
lakers champs
1985-1986 featuring jordan set, best of new and much of the 86 set
1984-1985 set featuring Jordan 101 and olmypic
1983-84 Bullets and kings oddly with the Carl Yaz set
1986 Best of Best with Magic Johnson set (according to basketball gold these sets can only be submitted by Schonco to Beckett for grading although I do not know if that information is current). It is my understanding that many of the raw cards in these sets are in fact sheet cut.
1986 court kings
Portland 5x7
5x7 red dunk set with 5x7 pistons and 5x7 lakers and 5x7 rockets
5x7 sixers

It is very likely that certain raw cards are in fact sheet cut and won't grade, so look closely at edges. Also if cards are being sold as "prototypes" and seem larger than normal, it is likely they are just sheet cut with pieces of the sheet left on.
Another one:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Michael-Jor...app-cvip-panel
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Last edited by Forever Young; 10-15-2020 at 06:12 AM.
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  #21  
Old 10-15-2020, 06:26 AM
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Thank you, I added it to the list. what an interesting sheet.
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  #22  
Old 10-15-2020, 10:56 AM
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I have gotten fairly heavily into Star in the last year and my go-to move is to buy bags from known sellers, and ask about the provenance every time. This will increase the price and difficulty of acquiring the key Jordan cards, but I'll have a pretty reasonable guarantee of authenticity.

The sealed bag, by its nature, tends to maintain the condition of the key cards pretty well, and as a value proposition I think sealed bags are the way to go.
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Old 10-15-2020, 11:51 AM
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I agree.
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  #24  
Old 10-15-2020, 07:13 PM
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Did you cover this one? The 86 Crunch N Munch Jordan that was not made in 86?

Look at this on eBay
https://www.ebay.com/itm/333739880289

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Old 10-15-2020, 07:26 PM
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It’s on my list. Pure shop at home trash. I have scoured YouTube looking for the original tv recording of the sale. No luck. Lots of shop at home don west videos out there but no star vids. If anyone has a lead on that it would be appreciated.

Here he is hawking some later star Jordan crap

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8IKOuM5TwzA



Quote:
Originally Posted by Hxcmilkshake View Post
Did you cover this one? The 86 Crunch N Munch Jordan that was not made in 86?

Look at this on eBay
https://www.ebay.com/itm/333739880289

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Last edited by Econteachert205; 10-15-2020 at 07:31 PM.
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  #26  
Old 10-17-2020, 07:39 AM
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We have a ton of Star in our upcoming auction with many keys just graded by Beckett in the last month. They no longer grade ANY "Best of" sets.
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Old 10-17-2020, 10:24 AM
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Scott, Thank you for the information. Just curious, does that include the very rare best of the old yellow five card set? Those have not been subject to controversy or reprint and should still be good for grading in my opinion.


Looking forward to the auction.

Dennis.
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Old 10-17-2020, 10:36 AM
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What Beckett told me was that the company that bought Star's assets in bankruptcy reissued all of the Best cards. They didn't enumerate any exceptions to me, but maybe the person speaking to me didn't have all the information.

We will be selling Best of the old and Best of the new. This collection had nearly every Star Co. Card ever printed and they were collected by the son of a dealer as they came out so fairly impeccable provenance. Also if you're into esoteric basketball, supposedly there's no way to differentiate between 1976 and 1977 Fleer stickers, however again this collection was put together year by year at the time cards and stickers were issued, so while there's no way of "proving" it we have two separate sets of stickers actually labeled with the appropriate year. Just interesting, not incredibly valuable.
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Last edited by Aquarian Sports Cards; 10-17-2020 at 10:37 AM.
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  #29  
Old 10-17-2020, 05:35 PM
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I agree with all of you in the thread, but I just don't like using the term "garbage". I prefer the terms "reprints" or "non-authentic" or "custom" etc,... I collect a lot of reprints of this type as I can't afford the authentic ones.
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Old 10-17-2020, 06:25 PM
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My calling them that is in reference to the purposeful deception sellers use as well as the original deception with shop at home. Outside of that I have no issues with the cards themselves and will refer to them as reprints, fakes or fantasy issues in The future to more accurately label the cards being discussed.
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Old Yesterday, 04:23 PM
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Default jordan set

Is this part of the Jordan subset to avoid raw?
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Old Yesterday, 04:47 PM
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Hi, yes it is. The card could very well be good, but just know that there were more of these produced and sold later and there are a significant amount of reprints. If the seller can guarantee it grades or offer refunds it might be worth taking a shot if the price is right, but it is a risk.





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Is this part of the Jordan subset to avoid raw?
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Old Yesterday, 05:37 PM
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From what I have read the type IIís associated with this set tend to be off register. So if the card picture Is clear that is a good sign. I would also say if the seller is reliable it is likely good.

I donít want to come off as an expert. I am learning more as I add information. I just really like the era and the cards.


My best advise is to read basketball gold top to bottom. Then look at as many auction results on the cards as possible. That is what I did.

I would also say to buy a handful of low priced singles raw to examine closely. They are distinct cards and once you know what to look for, if a seller has good scans it will add confidence to your buying.

I just wanted a thread where star collectors could help each other navigate these cards and enjoy them.
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Old Today, 07:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Econteachert205 View Post
From what I have read the type IIís associated with this set tend to be off register. So if the card picture Is clear that is a good sign. I would also say if the seller is reliable it is likely good.

I donít want to come off as an expert. I am learning more as I add information. I just really like the era and the cards.


My best advise is to read basketball gold top to bottom. Then look at as many auction results on the cards as possible. That is what I did.

I would also say to buy a handful of low priced singles raw to examine closely. They are distinct cards and once you know what to look for, if a seller has good scans it will add confidence to your buying.

I just wanted a thread where star collectors could help each other navigate these cards and enjoy them.
Well this has been a useful thread for me Dennis. Thanks for starting it.
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