General Photograph question

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Posted By: Dave

Looking at all the different avenues of collecting...curious from board members what makes a vintage photo just a vintage photo and what makes a cabinet photo a cabinet photo? A cabinet photo I'm assuming is worth more for various reasons? Is it better if the old photo has some type of writing on the back? either the player, team, year, etc? Any help always appreicated!

*Edited to say, yes this is one of those "dumb" questions that a lurker to two may have as well...LOL

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Posted By: barrysloate

No question is dumb if you don't know the answer.

A cabinet is an albumen photograph that is glued onto a roughly 5" x 8" cardboard mount. They were among the most popular forms of photography from the 1870-1890's.

The second part of your question-what is a vintage photo- is a little tougher because by definition it covers all original early photography. I guess I would define "vintage" as an early, first generation photo, such as a wire photograph. Often, the negatives were reused at a later date. I wouldn't consider that vintage.

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Posted By: martin dalziel

Dave,
Heres a link to David Cycleback's excellent site where he's made available PDF's of his work. Theres a whole book on Sports Photographs and their identification.

http://www.cycleback.com/

Careful you don't get too sucked in to the Jean Shrimpton stuff though - its addictive

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

Heh....I didn't know who Jean Shrimpton was until I started reading this board.

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Posted By: Dave

Thanks guys. Only thing left that can be considered "fishy" by a novice buyer....considering these items are in very nice condition and original....

what could I expect to pay for a "cabinet" of a Miller Huggins for example..

what could I expect to pay for a smaller photo 3"x5" of a 1887 team picture of say Cincinnatti?

I'm just looking for ballpark figures..

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

These are both items that are available for you to purchase? I think we'd have to see the items before anyone here could give you an idea if they are fishy or not. Is there a studio name on the Miller Huggins cabinet? And an 1887 photo of the Cincy team should be on a hard cardboard type backing...is it?

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Posted By: Dave

Dan..shooting you an email


Dave

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Posted By: ramram

Dave,
3x5 would be an odd size for any 1887 original image. At that period of time they would typically be cabinet card size or larger (unless the mount/image was trimmed).
Rob M.

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Posted By: davidcycleback

My opinion is that if someone is new is to collect early 1900s news service photos. These will include the famous players like Ty Cobb, Christy Mathewson and Honus Wagner, and are easier to judge as vintage. Many of these photos will have a back stamp from the news service or photographer that identifies it as old. For example International News Photos, United Press (not United Press International which is modern), ACME Newspictures, Pacific & Atlantic, Bain News Service are old, defunct companies and their stamp would only appear on an old photo. If you see a Ty Cobb photo with a Pacific & Atlantic or Bain News Service stamp, you can confident it's vintage. Many of these news service photos are of top quality.

Most of these news service photos will have production notes on back and normal usage (rough edges, wrinkle or two, toning). The quality of the image and overall presentation value is what matters. Many of the most expensive 1900s baseball photos have some wear like edge wear or corner creases. In fact, if you find a 1920s ACME Newspictures Babe Ruth photo that has Gem Mint, razor sharp edges it was almost certainly trimmed recently.

What a collector can also consider collecting are baseball photographs by famous photographers. As many photographers like Conlon, Bain and Burke stamped their names on the back, their photos can be easy to identify. These guys shot photographs of guys like Ruth and Cobb, so the collector can have it both ways: famous photographer and famous subject.

Obligatory Jean Shrimpton photo: