Its not just moser/pwcc...more trimmers exposed

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by MULLINS5

It is not in PWCC's best interest to deal with people who inspect their purchases.

I wonder how their investment advice thing is going.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I wonder how their investment advice thing is going.

Probably pretty good. This is on a few baseball card forums but what percentage of collectors are on forums or even know this is happening or even care.

I have friends from the 90's that are still very active in the hobby and had no idea that the Mastro thing happened.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I wonder how their investment advice thing is going.

I would say it's hanging on by a thread.

[Peter_Spaeth]

How many times do you think he has advised people to buy cards out of his auctions he knew were altered?

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

How many times do you think he has advised people to buy cards out of his auctions he knew were altered?

I have no idea but if you started counting out loud at 1 it might take some time to get to that number.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

How many times do you think he has advised people to buy cards out of his auctions he knew were altered?

Just read some of the descriptions of the relisted cards with enhanced grades.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by frankbmd

Just read some of the descriptions of the relisted cards with enhanced grades.

It's one level of disingenuousness to describe them that way; quite another to tell someone one on one to buy them.

Not far back someone here posted about a 52 Musial and as I recall mentioned how he reviewed all his purchases with Brent before bidding, I hope for that guy's sake he didn't get burned.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

It's one level of disingenuousness to describe them that way; quite another to tell someone one on one to buy them.

I think we agree to agree.

[jad22]

Was this one of the service the "Vault" provided? You could send your PSA 6 card and it would leave as a PSA 7 when it is resold. Select the Dr. Moser option when it is shipped there.

Maybe PSA should hire him as a consultant. He is certainly operating a much higher level than they are able to detect.

[swarmee]

If he came clean and flipped on Brent/PWCC/PSA co-conspirators, if any, it's quite possible. "Catch me if you can...." situation.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by jad22

Maybe PSA should hire him as a consultant. He is certainly operating a much higher level than they are able to detect.

He's probably making more money than all PSA employees combined.

Originally Posted by swarmee

If he came clean and flipped on Brent/PWCC/PSA co-conspirators, if any, it's quite possible. "Catch me if you can...." situation.

If Brent really thought he was in any kind of trouble at all, don't you think he would flip on Gary first?

Originally Posted by swarmee

It's funny that getting arrested and kicked out of the National is not enough to get Tony to stop selling crap autos.

Quoted you from another thread, but if a small hand slap is all these guys like Tony Podsada are getting, what's the real impact of getting caught? I guarantee things are still business as usual with Gary without a care of being caught.

This whole situation is like a snake. How do you kill a snake? You don't chop off its tail, you chop off the head. PWCC isn't the head. Gary or any other doctor isn't the head. PSA is the head. PSA is the key to making this work. As I've stated before, if PSA does their job correctly, none of these get graded and the card doctors are out of business.

[pokerplyr80]

Someone should examine these altered cards to determine if the alteration left anything behind that is detectable. If it is, we as a hobby should force PSA to answer why they aren't using this detection method.

A measurement of the trimmed cards should suffice. If cards that don't measure have been graded, we also deserve an answer as to how that is happening.

I have no idea what percentage of the hobby is on blowout and here, but if everyone agreed not to submit until we get some answers it may force the issue.

I find it ironic how worked up some are in this thread and yet some of those commenting are putting together a PSA group submission on the main page of the site.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

Someone should examine these altered cards to determine if the alteration left anything behind that is detectable. If it is, we as a hobby should force PSA to answer why they aren't using this detection method.

A measurement of the trimmed cards should suffice. If cards that don't measure have been graded, we also deserve an answer as to how that is happening.

I have no idea what percentage of the hobby is on blowout and here, but if everyone agreed not to submit until we get some answers it may force the issue.

I find it ironic how worked up some are in this thread and yet some of those commenting are putting together a PSA group submission on the main page of the site.

As I posted size is not always indicative, but yeah some of those cards posted on Blowout really do look short, especially some of the Look N' Sees.

[ullmandds]

I find it ironic how worked up some are in this thread and yet some of those commenting are putting together a PSA group submission on the main page of the site.[/QUOTE]

Right!!!! Wtf??? You can lead a horse to water but you can’t make them drink !

[pokerplyr80]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

As I posted size is not always indicative, but yeah some of those cards posted on Blowout really do look short, especially some of the Look N' Sees.

I do realize there are measurement irregularities of vintage cards from the factory. But it wouldn't hurt to measure the vintage cards. And for the modern cards it should be pretty clear. If cards were graded that didnt measure correctly an investigation should be started.

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

Someone should examine these altered cards to determine if the alteration left anything behind that is detectable. If it is, we as a hobby should force PSA to answer why they aren't using this detection method.

Working eyeballs.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

I do realize there are measurement irregularities of vintage cards from the factory. But it wouldn't hurt to measure the vintage cards. And for the modern cards it should be pretty clear. If cards were graded that didnt measure correctly an investigation should be started.

I have personally seen numerous examples of cards in slabs that were noticeably short and not, IMO, "natural" shorts. There is no doubt IMO that they miss obvious trimming sometimes.

[vintagebaseballcardguy]

Originally Posted by bnorth

Probably pretty good. This is on a few baseball card forums but what percentage of collectors are on forums or even know this is happening or even care.



I have friends from the 90's that are still very active in the hobby and had no idea that the Mastro thing happened.

^^^This^^^ I have a couple of friends who have absolutely zero knowledge of Net54, Blowout, Mastro, etc. When I see them and we discuss cards, I have brought all of this up. They look at me like I am exaggerating or speaking a foreign language. I am afraid most collectors are just like them...I was the same way before I found Net54 a few years ago...just quietly collecting cards and enjoying their collections without a care in the world.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

[Paul S]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I wonder how their investment advice thing is going.

Canopy Growth Corp. Out of U.S. juristdiction

[Bram99]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

S

I have no idea what percentage of the hobby is on blowout and here, but if everyone agreed not to submit until we get some answers it may force the issue.

If everyone agreed not to submit PSA could get caught up and back within their promise dates...

[Bram99]

Originally Posted by vintagebaseballcardguy

^^^This^^^ I have a couple of friends who have absolutely zero knowledge of Net54, Blowout, Mastro, etc. When I see them and we discuss cards, I have brought all of this up. They look at me like I am exaggerating or speaking a foreign language. I am afraid most collectors are just like them...I was the same way before I found Net54 a few years ago...just quietly collecting cards and enjoying their collections without a care in the world.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

This story isn't a "Me Too" story like the ones in the news. But I agree with the poster above. I just spoke to two friends who are frequent and active buyers of 1940's and 1950's PSA cards for their several registry sets. While they are both extremely active in buying, neither had any idea this new scandal was going on, nor had they heard about the autograph scandal of a few weeks/months ago.

Tony

[Bram99]

What do you think of the picture in this listing?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1949-BOWMAN...8AAOSw7Ppc1csS

[frankrizzo29]

Has anyone looked at the new round of T206s that PWCC listed on ebay? It appears that several of them have cert numbers that are very close to each other. My guess is that these cards are also doctored. Is PWCC really being this brazen to still sell doctored cards while they are being caught red handed?

[Bram99]

Originally Posted by frankrizzo29

Has anyone looked at the new round of T206s that PWCC listed on ebay? It appears that several of them have cert numbers that are very close to each other. My guess is that these cards are also doctored. Is PWCC really being this brazen to still sell doctored cards while they are being caught red handed?

Did you not watch Brent's one-hour + discussion on conservation?

[swarmee]

Originally Posted by Bram99

While they are both extremely active in buying, neither had any idea this new scandal was going on, nor had they heard about the autograph scandal of a few weeks/months ago.

Nothing that a front page article in the SMR or Forbes wouldn't help fix.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by swarmee

Nothing that a front page article in the SMR or Forbes wouldn't help fix.

Forbes lol yeah 100 times more likely another puff piece.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by perezfan

The bogus PSA-approved cards just keep coming on BO.... Cobb, Marquard and Mantle now... with no apparent end in sight.

If FBI or Law Enforcement doesn't have enough to intervene with this plethora of indisputable evidence, then there's a huge double-standard. This is feeling way beyond what Mastro, Allen and Rogers did.

PWCC/PSA are to cards as Coach's Corner/Christopher Morales are to autographs. Actually they are worse, as the corrupt money pouring in is far greater.

Very good analogy

[Bram99]

Originally Posted by perezfan

The bogus PSA-approved cards just keep coming on BO.... Cobb, Marquard and Mantle now... with no apparent end in sight.

If FBI or Law Enforcement doesn't have enough to intervene with this plethora of indisputable evidence, then there's a huge double-standard. This is feeling way beyond what Mastro, Allen and Rogers did.

PWCC/PSA are to cards as Coach's Corner/Christopher Morales are to autographs. Actually they are worse, as the corrupt money pouring in is far greater.

Or what Charles Ponzi is to schemes

[swarmee]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Forbes lol yeah 100 times more likely another puff piece.

I'm sure Forbes has at least one investigative journalist on staff. These articles basically write themselves.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by swarmee

I'm sure Forbes has at least one investigative journalist on staff. These articles basically write themselves.

Is the same publication that's been worshipping Brent going to trash him?

[swarmee]

If you don't ask for it, it will never happen.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Is the same publication that's been worshipping Brent going to trash him?

That attitude is exactly why nothing will ever come of this. Your focus (and many others too) is only on Brent when there are multiple parties involved. If you put as much equal focus on the other parties as you did on Brent, someone might actually take you serious.

My 4:1 offer still stands. Anybody got balls?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

That attitude is exactly why nothing will ever come of this. Your focus (and many others too) is only on Brent when there are multiple parties involved. If you put as much equal focus on the other parties as you did on Brent, someone might actually take you serious.

My 4:1 offer still stands. Anybody got balls?

I have said lots about PSA including today that I am starting to think SGC grades better. Am I willing to speculate that card doctors are paying graders, not yet, although I have acknowledged the possibility.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by swarmee

If you don't ask for it, it will never happen.

Fair point.

[nsaddict]

Too bad PSA didn't offer pedigree service early on. "Moser doctoring collection" on the label....

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by nsaddict

Too bad PSA didn't offer pedigree service early on. "Moser doctoring collection" on the label....

A PWCC sticker may be the equivalent. Just kidding. Sort of.

[frankbmd]

Has anyone on this forum received a sticker on a card they’ve consigned with PWCC?

I don’t think this post will unduly prolong the duration of this thread.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by frankbmd

Has anyone on this forum received a sticker on a card they’ve consigned with PWCC?

I don’t think this post will unduly prolong the duration of this thread.

I think Jesse said he got one once?

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I think Jesse said he got one once?

That’s why I added “unduly”.

[MULLINS5]

PWCC sold the cards to collectors and targeted investors. I don't think it's up to the buyer to send their card back into PSA to determine if there was altering. Collectors might do this, but likely not the investors. Brent has an obligation to his customers to make them aware that their investments are tainted. Instead, he's trying to change the game with his conservation/restoration nonsense. When it's time for the investors to sell, they're going to get a fraction of what they put into it. If Brent was truly a victim here and not complicit he'd put out a statement that PWCC is actively researching the fraud and will be contacting buyers so they can seek a refund through PSA's guarantee.

[MULLINS5]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

A PWCC sticker may be the equivalent. Just kidding. Sort of.

hah!

[jad22]

https://www.blowoutforums.com/showpo...postcount=2422


https://www.blowoutforums.com/showpo...postcount=2421

[swarmee]

Those are T206 Green Ty Cobb portraits, for those who didn't click on the links.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by swarmee

Those are T206 Green Ty Cobb portraits, for those who didn't click on the links.

Now we're close to home, eh?

[Bored5000]

Originally Posted by jad22

https://www.blowoutforums.com/showpo...postcount=2422


https://www.blowoutforums.com/showpo...postcount=2421

Wow, a half grade of "conservation" and the auction result increased over $3,000.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Bored5000

Wow, a half grade of "conservation" and the auction result increased over $3,000.

Part of that is the market was going up.

[asoriano]

"never get cheated"

[swarmee]

Read my signature block. Do people see signature blocks by default?

[Batpig]

When I was selling off my dad’s collection for him, most of the cards went through PWCC. In fact I was a pretty big supporter of Brent based on my dealings with him (“was” being the key word). The DiMaggio debacle was the start, but when this latest BS started getting unveiled, I thought back to some of his cards that got grades I was disappointed with that went through PWCC. The first one that came to mind was a 57 Starr that had great eye appeal, but a stain on the back. I wondered if it would show up as part of this. Sure enough, here it is...

https://www.blowoutforums.com/showpo...postcount=2425

Surprised it still only got a 6 after the work. Based on the delay between auctions, I wonder if it was resubbed and/or reworked multiple times until he gave up.

It certainly wasn’t the most valuable card he had, but it was still really nice before being “conserved”.

Edit: Just remembered I posted about it when the original auction went up and included the raw pics in this thread -

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=221499

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Forbes lol yeah 100 times more likely another puff piece.

A number Forbes online contributors were involved, not too long ago, in a payola scandal where the writers were taking money for favorable pieces and links to certain companies.

This is merely a statement of fact. Draw your own conclusions.

https://glean.info/paying-contributi...thical-common/