Becomming a dealer for full time income.

[67 MEMORIES]

I have about had it with my current job.. 14 years and for the last 2 being treated like #*@^!! I am seriously considering going into the sport card and memorabilia business.. I would have to sacrifice some of my collection.. Some pre war , wrappers, non sport, autos, etc.. Any advice as to having your own web sight vs becomming and ebay store/dealer.. I have been on ebay for about 7 years and have excellent record and many hobby references as a buyer.. I also would have some cash to do some buying with..

I really appreciate any advice from some of you seasoned people.. Thanks for your time..

[Cardboard Junkie]

I suggest you forget the idea of making it a business.
I don't think the economy has hit bottom yet.
There is a very real possibility that the economy may never recover.
Plan for the worst, but hope for the best. jmo dave

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by Cardboard Junkie

I suggest you forget the idea of making it a business.
I don't think the economy has hit bottom yet.
There is a very real possibility that the economy may never recover.
Plan for the worst, but hope for the best. jmo dave

I agree with this. It might be a good way to supplement income if you wanted to work part time or for less money, but no way I would ever think about it as my only source of income.

[BuffettFan]

My father quit his job as an attorney in the late 70s to focus on gold coins and Civil war money and other collections. He said he loved his hobby but ultimately hated the business. I could see the stress build as he traded one set of problems (not liking the law practice) for another (new set of late hours to meet with clients, selling stock he did not want to yet to pay tuition or other bills).

I would take the "dipping your toe" approach, so that your "large" fortune does not turn into a "small" one.

Good luck!

[D. Bergin]

Everybody thinks buying and selling in their hobby of choice would be a great business plan, until they actually realize what goes into it.

I would sit down with an accountant and go over all the various expenses. Overhead, Tax situation, Health Insurance, Web Site costs, Merchant costs, Ebay and Paypal costs, Inventory costs, Paperwork you need to keep to keep track of everything concerning your business, collectors wondering why you can't pay 90% of retail for items that will sit in your store for 5+ years.

I have a small hobby business compared to most, and every year about tax time I have an epiphany about how much easier it was to put up with my overbearing, overworking bosses in the real world, where all I had to do was punch a clock and payroll would do all my taxes for me when I got paid on Thursday of every week.

Also, unless you have an insanely high end collection already, you can forget about keeping much for yourself. You'll generally find easily sellable inventory is not easily stumbled across in the real world, the best stuff will sell the quickest and you'll probably have to fall back on your collection at one point or another so you can pay the bills.

[smtjoy]

I agree with the "take is slow" approach and start by selling a few items on ebay then if you like it build upon that business. I starting selling my few dupes on ebay 5 years ago and each year built up my sales by looking for deals or by buying lots that had cards I wanted in them. I now have a small ebay store and have done very well on ebay, I have learned a ton and added all the profits to my collection. A few things I have learned-

***Having sufficient capital is so important, by using my own sales numbers I would need $200,000 in inventory and $50,000 in cash to make around $3,000 a month in profit and still grow the business.

***The good items sell fast and you are left with a growing inventory of items that will sit there unless you are willing to take a loss/no gain to move them, understanding turning your inventory is huge. When to sell at a loss and when to hold or discount. If your inventory turns stale you are doomed, a store needs fresh inventory to grow and expand, otherwise your store turns into the overpriced BIN museums you see on ebay.

***It is a detriment to your business to continue to collect. It brings the personal side into your decisions when you need to be able to base them solely on what will make you money. This is the biggest thing keeping me from greatly increasing my ballcard side business. Just this year, I had scouted a few lots in REA that I felt I could turn for a nice profit but there was also a single card I have been hunting for my collection for a long time I really wanted, well the collection won and I purchased the single card. Hard to buy cards you have no interest in them but to turn a profit vs buying a card you really want.

***It helps a lot of have an area you are an expert in as it will let you know when a card is a good deal to buy or not. I am a Clemente collector so when I started selling it was my dupes from upgrading so I knew how much I could expect to sell them for. Also by knowing the market it helped me on my purchases as I knew this little niche and would be alert for deals on ebay and AH for cards to resale and I could place low priced snipes and sometimes get lucky on them.

Good luck!

[glchen]

Originally Posted by smtjoy

...
***Having sufficient capital is so important, by using my own sales numbers I would need $200,000 in inventory and $50,000 in cash to make around $3,000 a month in profit and still grow the business.

***The good items sell fast and you are left with a growing inventory of items that will sit there unless you are willing to take a loss/no gain to move them, understanding turning your inventory is huge. When to sell at a loss and when to hold or discount. If your inventory turns stale you are doomed, a store needs fresh inventory to grow and expand, otherwise your store turns into the overpriced BIN museums you see on ebay.

***It is a detriment to your business to continue to collect. It brings the personal side into your decisions when you need to be able to base them solely on what will make you money. This is the biggest thing keeping me from greatly increasing my ballcard side business. Just this year, I had scouted a few lots in REA that I felt I could turn for a nice profit but there was also a single card I have been hunting for my collection for a long time I really wanted, well the collection won and I purchased the single card. Hard to buy cards you have no interest in them but to turn a profit vs buying a card you really want.

***It helps a lot of have an area you are an expert in as it will let you know when a card is a good deal to buy or not. I am a Clemente collector so when I started selling it was my dupes from upgrading so I knew how much I could expect to sell them for. Also by knowing the market it helped me on my purchases as I knew this little niche and would be alert for deals on ebay and AH for cards to resale and I could place low priced snipes and sometimes get lucky on them.

Good luck!

I think Scott gives some tremendously good advice on how to do business on ebay. I would emphasize that part on what happens when you sell enough and become an expert in a certain area. For example, if you collect a certain area, say 1914 Cracker Jacks, you'll know which commons are "short prints" and are in demand more. For those cards, you will learn you can sell at a higher price than other commons.

Regarding market efficiency, I would say it's around a 5. People aren't stupid as if you're selling a card for $50 and ten other sellers have it at the same grade for $25, you're not going to be selling your card. However, this thread was recently posted on the PSA forums: I know this has been rehashed before, but how does 707 get the prices he gets?!?!
. So there you go about how some sellers with BIN museums can still sell stuff, somehow.

[steve B]

Yep, what everyone else has said.

You'll need inventory, and unless you specialize that means laying out a LOT of money.
Or
You do quick turnover on Ebay for a small profit each time. And you still have to buy more stuff to resell. Even decent sized lots of T206s on Ebay seem to go for about what they'd be individually.

Any collectibles business can be a tough one. People complain about not getting anywhere near retail for a collection, without considering the time to list the things for sale, or if you're doing shows, merely putting the stuff into new holders. While it's ok for me to have my cards in old yellowed toploaders, slightly cracked cardsavers and a variety of other holders that's not what people expect or usually accept from a dealer.

Sit down one night and simply reholder and price 50-100 cards. And track the time.


If you still want to do it full time, go for it. the advice at that point?
1)Find someone to do the stuff you're not good at. For me that would be the paperwork.
2) Decide what your "angle" will be, and stay with it long enough to know if it will work.
3)Change if it won't work.
4)You can make money with anything if you buy it right
5) You don't always need to be an expert, but you do have to be a good guesser.
6) Offload your mistakes and move on. Nobody gets it right every time. As long as you learn from it the mistake was probably ok.

Steve B

[SetBuilder]

Scott, Steve,

On a scale of 1-10, 1 being very inefficient and 10 being perfectly efficient, how would you rate the card market in general?

Economic theory would suggest there are more profits to be made in an inefficient market, than in a perfect one.

I happen to think, based on my observations, that the pre-war sports card market is about a 4 or less on this scale. The price fluctuations are pretty wide. Enough to realize a healthy profit if you're going from wholesale (auctions, lots, private collections) to retail.

The only downside is the time you have to wait before someone meets your price point.

You can't catch any fish if you're not fishing.

[RobertGT]

The key question you have to ask yourself is this: Can you buy inventory THAT WILL SELL FOR A HIGHER PRICE on a consistent basis, and can you obtain it at a price point that would make this venture sustainable over time?

If you have a large network of contacts, ability to purchase inventory at wholesale prices through various outlets, or can find inexpensive collections in your vicinity then I say go for it. Take a shot at something you love.

If you have to resort to buying material on eBay or through online auction houses, then this idea is dead on arrival. You will wind up selling your collection to put food on the table.

Also, I agree with the earlier poster that spelling errors such as "becomming" and "web sight" do not help your cause. Professionalism goes a long way with buyers. While it's not always true, many times TYPO=SCAMMER in the world of online commerce, and that's definitely not an image you want to impart.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

[Tsaiko]

Try the nymphomaniac for two weeks, then see if you still feel the same way about opening a sport card and memorabilia business.

[edhans]

There's an easy to become a millionaire in the card business-start out a billionaire.

[glynparson]

All I can say is don't do it. if you do you may need to sacrifice all not some of your collection as everything should be for sale if you are doing this for a living and dont have a Levi sized inventory to start with. Be careful of putting yourself into any position where you have to sell things. Honestly just keep it as a side job maybe try to find a job in the hobby with a grading company or established auction house.

[bbcard1]

Someone once said that owning a baseball card shop is like being married to a nymphomanic....it's fun for about the first two weeks.

[glchen]

I would keep your job, and just try to expand your ebay business. If your business got to a point where it's completely booming with loads of income, then I would quit your day job. It might also be smart to do consignments as well as buying/selling your own inventory.

[g_vezina_c55]

Originally Posted by bbcard1

Someone once said that owning a baseball card shop is like being married to a nymphomanic....it's fun for about the first two weeks.

Lololol

[Boccabella]

I think it's a great time to start a business. The internet allows anyone to take a swing without having huge backing or a massive advertising budget, without being dependent on local clientele. Your business can literally be worldwide and run out of your home.

There are thousands of people who want to collect and have $ but don't know how or where to start. Find them and win them over.

BUT...you must be totally committed to being very aggressive with online promotion and advertising, social media participation and also be willing to work long hours at home, seven days a week sometimes.

It can be done. There are a lot of players in the industry who weren't here 10 years ago or even five years ago. When you do something you love, you tend to work harder.

However, you do need to be prepared. Acquire inventory. Have a sense of how to build a business. Find someone, maybe a local community college educator, who also has a reasonably priced tax business and knows how to find deductions for you and can guide you through the process of setting things up.

Communication is ultra important. You do need to know how to spell 'website'. Not being sarcastic...but if you can't communicate effectively online today, you need to find someone to help you do that.

[botn]

Not sure we have nearly enough info from 67 Memories upon which to offer a meaningful opinion. Regardless, I do not agree with most of what has been written. Making a living selling cards is pretty simple if you have any sense of business, a solid knowledge of the type of stuff you are selling and most importantly enough capital to adequately fund the endeavor. I don't think we need another auction house but another dealer? Why not?

It has been no more difficult to make money selling cards in 2012 than it was in 2000. At the height of the market cards sold more quickly and everything was consistently selling for more money, in general, but dealers were paying more. This is not just the card market but any market that is in a boom. So things have slowed down a bit, in some regards, in 2012. You have to adjust your buy price. The demand for cards is still there and very healthy. Some stuff has been more impacted by the economy than others. I think it really depends on the era, sport and grade of the material you are selling that will determine if one can make a buck.

One thing which has changed in recent times is gaining access to private collections. If you are not a large auction house, getting those collections has become difficult absent a large internet presence. There is still plenty of money in buying large lots out of those auction houses and breaking them.

[67 MEMORIES]

I will read all of these a couple times over.. It sounds like maybe part time and a new job would be the best going forward.. I do love collecting and would not ever want it to become something negative in any way..
Lastly has anyone ever heard of buyng an existing business with inventory, either Ebay or not.. There has to be some people looking to get out or wanting to retire. Again.. Thanks for your time

[David W]

I don't know where you live, but in the midwest, in order to make $1000 per week, I would estimate you would need to do $3000-$4000 per week in ebay sales on average to achieve that standard of living.

If you can do that right off the bat, and sustain it, go for it, if not start ebay sales on a part time basis and build up to it.

In some areas of the country $1000 per week may not be enough to live a comfortable lifestyle.

[sycks22]

I wish you luck if you decide to go down that road, but you'll need to get a lot of contacts and inventory before starting the business. I think one of the draws of cards are the fact that they're an excape from our daily lives and not the complete focus of every waking minute.

[drc]

My opinion is to start small and see how it goes. If it builds into a full time business that's great, it it builds into a supplemental income that's good too.

From a practical point, starting off small and slowly is to see how things work-- what does, what doesn't--, getting think kinks out of the system, discovering your errors and misconceptions on the small scale. And, as I said, if that eventually leads to something bigger, great.

One thing is if you star with the pre-conception that you will only sell, say, baseball memorabilia, that might be an off busines choice from the start. There may be other areas (to sell instead of or in addition to sports) than sports memorabilia. Be wary of sentimental blinders. Duly note, I'm not saying sports memorabilia is a bad place to sell, or that it can be good to sell items in an area you are familiar with.