New Grading Company - CSG

[brewing]

I'm confident the service will be top notch.

I'm looking forward to what the actual case and flip will look like.

The jumbo slab and jumbo grade are big detractors.

[Bigdaddy]

Seems like the flip is a non-trivial part of the encapsulation. Given that, it might be a good idea if CSG (or any of the other TPGs) would host a design contest for flips. You announce a contest with a $$ prize for the winner and make the statement that all submissions become the property of the company. You could have a public vote or whittle down the submissions in-house. There are lots of very, very talented graphic artists out there and I'm sure that any number of them could do a better job than what I've seen from any of the TPGs.

Just a thought.

[Rich Klein]

Originally Posted by Rich Klein

I'm going to say based on this comment by Leon they have hired at least one sports person (if not more)

"I don't want to be the one to say who the new hire is but I am supportive. It will be out soon I am sure."

Regards
Rich

I just heard from the new hire Leon mentioned and I agree, perhaps for the first time (Hi Leon! that's a joke son), about his opinion on the new hire.

Rich

[t_vguy]

Being on a budget I am naturally curious about the cost. I imagine you probably can't give details on that.

I prefer the look of SGC slabs due to the blackout and how it makes cards looks (color theory is a beautiful thing after all!) I really feel there should be a lot more good grading companies though and considering the wait times we've seen especially with PSA, it certainly warrants it now more than ever since the hobby is growing at such a fast rate. I'll be honest, their labels bother me but if they're accurate and at a price point which competes with SGC (I can dream they'd be lower) I'm all about it!

Thank you for sharing your experience.
---John

[Lorewalker]

Isn't the parent co, CCG, the folks who owned or ran SGC at one point? Could have sworn their scale logo was associated with SGC's site and holders. If so then this one could be promising. Keeping my fingers crossed for a solid grading staff.

[Rich Klein]

BTW -- the hire Leon and myself referred to during this thread is now official. From Sports Collectors Daily Today Notes:

"Andy Broome, the senior vintage card grader at Beckett since 2004, has left for a similar role at Certified Sports Guaranty, which has been adding staff in recent months in preparation for its upcoming launch."

Regards
Rich

[jburl]

Originally Posted by Rich Klein

BTW -- the hire Leon and myself referred to during this thread is now official. From Sports Collectors Daily Today Notes:



"Andy Broome, the senior vintage card grader at Beckett since 2004, has left for a similar role at Certified Sports Guaranty, which has been adding staff in recent months in preparation for its upcoming launch."



Regards

Rich

Good news, for sure.

Sent from my SM-G781U using Tapatalk

[dmats33312]

I think storing an image of the graded card and the grader notes will be huge. The image helps ease any slab popping/swapping and the notes helps with transparency. I've collected CGC comics and always appreciated having grader notes as to why the comics received the grade it did vs cards just seeing a grade with at most for BGS seeing a four criteria break down on modern. Also, for the comics they charge for grader's notes where here it looks like they will be free and public which also will help with web-based sales with not getting stuck with some undisclosed/seen flaw.

[whitehse]

Delete....nevermind.

[Picklepete]

I have about 700 slabbed PSA - PSA/DNA & BGS - BAS CARDS.
I was set up at early Dec. show / Tampa, & they had table at entrance to get peeps info. on them.
At least 50% of people told them they didn't like slab & label design..
Oh..oh..its being changed !

No.. it hasn't.
THAT tells me plenty.

[Exhibitman]

Made my first submission today; we will see...

[Orioles1954]

Originally Posted by Picklepete

I have about 700 slabbed PSA - PSA/DNA & BGS - BAS CARDS.
I was set up at early Dec. show / Tampa, & they had table at entrance to get peeps info. on them.
At least 50% of people told them they didn't like slab & label design..
Oh..oh..its being changed !

No.. it hasn't.
THAT tells me plenty.

I clicked the link and yeah...not good.

[frankbmd]

All cards in slabs look like SGC slabs if you have a black table.

[JackR]

CSG, SGC... only a typo away!

[Pre War Starter]

I love how the two “EXPERTS” they hired to manage the vintage and modern, in the promo video, Broome wasn’t wearing gloves, getting oil and grease on the borders, and Weston was handling a “chrome” card and had his thumb planted right on the face, leaving his thumb print on it.

I know Leon gave his approval to Broome, but IMO, an “expert grader” doesn’t touch a vintage cards without gloves.

[Frank A]

We are just a tiny percent of the people who have cards graded. It will take many years before a grading company can compete with the established group. I wish them good luck in the long haul.

[LACardsGuy]

Any way to never wait for 4 months after paying through the nose with PSA will be welcome.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Frank A

We are just a tiny percent of the people who have cards graded. It will take many years before a grading company can compete with the established group. I wish them good luck in the long haul.

I disagree completely. IF the new group does a good job they will take a lot of market share from the current opinionators.....who have NO guarantees whatsoever. (except to give your grading fees back when they are incompetent)

[Jcosta19]

I only see standard sized cards pictured on their website.
Does anyone know if the same size holder is used for t206 and similar sized cards or if they have multiple sizes?

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[rjackson44]

Im going to give them a try love this

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by Orioles1954

I clicked the link and yeah...not good.

I went to their site and ... yeah. The slabs look like the slabs you see on Ebay from somebody grading in their basement. Not good.

[3-2-count]

Originally Posted by Tabe

I went to their site and ... yeah. The slabs look like the slabs you see on Ebay from somebody grading in their basement. Not good.

I wonder if the many complaining about the look of CSG's slab would be doing so if they were around before PSA and SGC. In my opinion so many have just grown accustom to what they're used to.

We continue to see the countless threads complaining about PSA and SGC's rising cost of grading fee's, long wait times increasing more by the day and a plethora of tampered cards getting into their slabs yet we bitch about a new comers slab.

I swear some of the things I hear collectors complain about absolutely blows my mind. I truly hope that CSG takes the market by storm and puts huge amounts of pressure on the others to improve their business or potentially lose it. We all deserve better than what we're currently getting. A slab design should be low on the list of expectations from third party authentication if even mentioned at all.

My two cents! Carry on...............

[tab]

Need a grading company that sticks to vintage. Leave all that new shiny stuff and Pokémon cards for others. A company needs to be able to service their customers in a timely manner. The current waiting time for PSA is ridiculous!

[hcv123]

Competency SHOULD matter
Resale value matters (to many)
looks matter
cost/wait times matter


I am hopeful with Nat Turner and Steve Cohen taking over PSA that we will see some desperately needed change happen there.
I agree the CSG holder looks horrible (and it matters). For those who choose to give them a shot, keeping an open mind to see how they do in the other areas.

[Jcosta19]

I wish they graded oversized cards..
I had 4 cards I've been holding off on submitting due to wait times but 2 are t201 and a 36 goudey premium

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[yanksfan09]

Originally Posted by Jcosta19

I wish they graded oversized cards..
I had 4 cards I've been holding off on submitting due to wait times but 2 are t201 and a 36 goudey premium

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I'd say that is something they'll need to address quickly if they want to compete in the vintage arena. So many tallboy slabs in my, and many others collections. Postcards, Exhibits, T201, T202, T3, Goudey Premiums, R312, R315 etc.... countless pre war issues are "oversized" by todays standards. There weren't any standard sizes back then. Can't ignore and not slab a very large percentage of pre war card issues and expect to be relevant with those collectors. I understand they're new to the game and very well may be working on multiple bigger sized holders right now? We shall see. I'm not rendering any judgements and hope they do well and hope the extra competition can up all companies standards.

[chadeast]

I am totally ready for a new grading company, but... I must agree that looks do matter, and the label is just way too busy for my tastes. Imagine a faded Old Judge in that holder. The label would dominate it. IMO, it seems designed for modern flashy cards.

If they had a more simplified 'single grade' option with a label maybe 30% shorter in height, I'd start using them to slab my cards tomorrow. I do really like their legible font (take note, SGC). My hope is that, as a new company, they might be able to offer something like that in the future. They can call them 'vintage' or 'classic' holders.

[Tyruscobb]

Originally Posted by 3-2-count

A slab design should be low on the list of expectations from third party authentication if even mentioned at all.

Presentation matters. There is an entire industry that focuses on it. Take your favorite family photograph and place it into a cheap frame. Now, take the same photograph to a professional framer and I guarantee the new frame will magnify the photograph’s effect and presentation.

Just like your family photograph, you are more concerned with the card than its slab/frame. However, a nice slab/frame significantly adds to the overall presentation and effect.

I agree that there are more important factors, but presentation, especially for cards that I collect for my PC and plan on looking at until I die, is very important.

This post is not expressing an opinion concerning whether this new company’s slabs, or any other TPG’s slabs for that matter, are or are not aesthetically pleasing.

[Casey2296]

Aesthetics are important to pre war collectors. I realize we're not the most important demo to grading companies but having an option for a black apron and a subtle label would have grabbed a lot of market share from that demo.

[perezfan]

+3 (to the three posts directly above). These posts all echo my sentiments exactly.

I am sooooo ready to give them a try, but am having trouble getting past that gigantic flip/slab. Especially with regard to my Tobacco and Caramel Cards.

It's the presentation of the actual card that matters.... not the number. Now that they are an advertiser here, I really hope someone from CSG is reading (and subsequently addressing) this!

[Exhibitman]

Aesthetic preferences are like buttholes: everyone has one. I actually like the holder and flip. And let's be honest here: far more collectors care about the flip than the card inside anyway. Perhaps not in this fine group but certainly among the general body of collectors. Once these cards reach the market and start selling all will be forgiven.

[Leon]

I can pretty much assure everyone that CSG reads this forum. Keep the comments coming. I am neutral on the flip as I buy cards. That said, I agree the SGC black inserts really make our cards pop. I will probably never use them again, as I don't like their management ways or recent capabilities, but they do have nice slabs.

[mq711]

Can’t imagine they will get a hugh market share of vintage cards but should have enough interest from modern collectors, investors and flippers who have a who is hot now mentality. Since a lot of the modern cards are busy and loud they will display much better in those slabs than a T206 or Cracker Jack.

I’m still shocked they don’t include a measured centering option to the flip and add a Perfect 10 grade to their scale. Since most modern cards are mint, one with all around 50/50 centering would receive a gold flip and then let the chase begin.

[Oscar_Stanage]

I cannot get on board with that slab.
I will buy the card if the price is right, but will have to crack it and send elsewhere for presentation in my collection. I won't send cards in.
but if they get rave reviews from people on this site, I will re-consider.

[jchcollins]

I will have to get one of these slabs once they start showing up on eBay just out of pure curiosity. I don't love the look of the flip on first impression, but I don't hate it either.

[RayBShotz]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Aesthetic preferences are like buttholes: everyone has one. I actually like the holder and flip. And let's be honest here: far more collectors care about the flip than the card inside anyway. Perhaps not in this fine group but certainly among the general body of collectors. Once these cards reach the market and start selling all will be forgiven.

Adam - I think I like the holder and flip as well.
I'd really like to see them do everything right and honor all sportscard collectors.

Really anxious to see what type of results Leon gets with his vintage submission.
I think turn around time is a very big deal in today's TPG market. The delays have been intolerable for too long and collectors should root for a new player in this space.
I honestly hope it happens for CSG.
RayB

[chadeast]

I spent a bit of time playing around with Paint to create a few concepts, please excuse my very limited skills. This is meant only as something to stimulate conversation, and hopefully is taken as such. I am absolutely rooting for the success of CSG. If they are unhappy with my brainstorming using their images, I will remove them.

In my ideal world, the label would be black and white only, but my Paint skills only take me so far.

EDIT to add original below

[robw1959]

Originally Posted by Pre War Starter

I love how the two “EXPERTS” they hired to manage the vintage and modern, in the promo video, Broome wasn’t wearing gloves, getting oil and grease on the borders, and Weston was handling a “chrome” card and had his thumb planted right on the face, leaving his thumb print on it.

I know Leon gave his approval to Broome, but IMO, an “expert grader” doesn’t touch a vintage cards without gloves.

I don't think this is true, as I have seen in print from either PSA or SGC a grading note that tells us as customers that graders need to feel the surface of the card stock to determine key grading factors such as authenticity.

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by chadeast

I spent a bit of time playing around with Paint to create a few concepts, please excuse my very limited skills. This is meant only as something to stimulate conversation, and hopefully is taken as such. I am absolutely rooting for the success of CSG. If they are unhappy with my brainstorming using their images, I will remove them.

In my ideal world, the label would be black and white only, but my Paint skills only take me so far.

EDIT to add original below

The smaller flip definitely looks better!

Can you photoshop what a small T206 or Caramel card would look like encased in their current "mega slab"?

[Casey2296]

Originally Posted by perezfan

The smaller flip definitely looks better!

Can you photoshop what a small T206 or Caramel card would look like encased in their current "mega slab"?

Better yet, can you compare the size of a T206 to the size of the current label?

[chadeast]

Originally Posted by perezfan

The smaller flip definitely looks better!

Can you photoshop what a small T206 or Caramel card would look like encased in their current "mega slab"?

That's where I was headed, I was actually thinking of a M101-4 in my mind. RL got in the way but after I finish work I may give it a go. I can't stress enough how much of a novice I am at this, what you see is just painting white, putting in a black box, and cut and paste. If I can successfully put a low grade non-color pre-war card into the image, I think it will really highlight the issue.

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by 3-2-count

I wonder if the many complaining about the look of CSG's slab would be doing so if they were around before PSA and SGC. In my opinion so many have just grown accustom to what they're used to.

I don't follow the logic here. They're not first. They don't get the benefit of the doubt that comes from being first. They should be improving on what's already available not coming up with "well, it wouldn't be that bad if nobody else had done it before".

[chadeast]

Here is my attempt at showing what my WaJo M101-4 would look like in a CSG holder. Again, apologies for my low grade MS Paint skills, all scaling was done by hand. A T206 would obviously be smaller still.

EDIT: added a third with clear/white background

[perezfan]

The second one looks far better to me. Better ratio of card to slab.

I hope also, that they will have slabs that can properly accommodate the size of these smaller cards, without the use of a hideous wrinkled up baggie (PSA style). That is an immediate deal killer for me. I actually display most of my cards, so a clean refined look is far superior to PSA's haphazard tilting cards with baggies.

Thanks for doing the photoshop!

[irishdenny]

Originally Posted by Leon

I tend to pay more for cards I find aesthetically appealing irrespective of their technical grades.

This is Pre War Theology...
*You have to be in the Big Boys Club to know this!

[chadeast]

Originally Posted by perezfan

The second one looks far better to me. Better ratio of card to slab.

I hope also, that they will have slabs that can properly accommodate the size of these smaller cards, without the use of a hideous wrinkled up baggie (PSA style). That is an immediate deal killer for me. I actually display most of my cards, so a clean refined look is far superior to PSA's haphazard tilting cards with baggies.

Thanks for doing the photoshop!

You're welcome. I display my cards too. The holders matter to me, very much. And yes, I have a current preference

EDIT: Note that any slab even an 1/8" taller than an SGC slab will not fit in my display case.

[JollyElm]

You can absolutely root for the success of this new company while also being annoyed by the look and size of the slab.

It's like McDonald's packing their delicious Big Macs in pointed metal cases that look like sea urchins.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by jchcollins

I will have to get one of these slabs once they start showing up on eBay just out of pure curiosity. I don't love the look of the flip on first impression, but I don't hate it either.

I would also like to get one when they show up. Want to find a very low serial # to add the slab to my slab collection.

[Tyruscobb]

I’m rooting for any new TPG’s success. Hopefully, a new player will reduce all the other TPG’s wait times, as well as force them to improve their services. Competition is great for us consumers. We can only win.

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by chadeast

You're welcome. I display my cards too. The holders matter to me, very much. And yes, I have a current preference

EDIT: Note that any slab even an 1/8" taller than an SGC slab will not fit in my display case.

Beautiful display.

That's exactly what I meant to convey about clean aesthetics and a slab that emphasizes the card above the slab. Awesome Goudeys and classy looking display!