Signed T206: Was Rube Marquard's Wife Signing For Him?

[ATP]

Originally Posted by WillowGrove

Jeff - really interesting that you have had this hypothesis and have done this research. I can add something but not sure how much it helps.

In 1980 my mother wrote a bunch of HOFers and asked them to send me their autograph for my upcoming 15th Birthday and I got a respsonse from Rube. See photos. He mailed it April 17th and passed away June 1st.

All these years went by and it took SGC to point out to me that the signature on the card was a stamp. You'll note it is the exact 'signature' that is on his HOF card. I did a perfunctory search and couldn't find any other stamps. So that's kind of interesting to me in and of itself.

The paper that says Happy Birthday, seems to have Rube's actual signature. This shows that on this particular date, approximately 6 weeks before passing away, it seems that Rube signed a note from a fan, along with including two stamped items. FYI, my mother mailed out her requests about a week prior to the postmark, so the turnaround time was short.

I found Rube's obituary where it says he died, "after a long illness" as well as a quote from his granddaughter who said, "her grandfather had been receiving round-the-clock nursing care for several months. Mr. Marquard, she said, had cancer and was operated on two years ago."

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!to...es/Bm5mXwhInhM

I reviewed this thread on my phone while traveling a few days ago and didn't review again now, so I don't remember if there were any later examples of his signature - but I wanted to post what I had.

For the record, I wrote Rube a thank you note - after receiving his mail on May 6th. I felt good as a kid taking the time to thank him but of course felt terrible to find out he passed away so soon after.

Good convo all. Thanks again Jeff!

Peter, thanks for posting, I really appreciate you taking the time to add what you have, and to include scans. I think it's pretty telling that someone else was working Rube's mail at the time you wrote to him and using that stamp. The little note wishing you a happy birthday clearly is not written by Rube and sure does look an awful lot like the other "Stick" R examples, and definitely looks like the signed T205 I posted and the example of his wife's signature (just look at the "d" finish in Marquard).

And Tom, I think it's also really worth noting, regarding the signed Diamond Greats you posted, that Rube's signature didn't have much left to it at all based on when that was signed (1979 or 1980, but you can STILL see the signature traits you expect), it looks NOTHING like the short note written regarding the Happy Birthday to Peter and would have been signed very close in time based on when that card was made.

I must say that I really was hesitant about creating this post in the first place. I was anxious that I would get bad reactions from some folks, especially those who may have owned one of the examples I was pointing out, but overall I am very happy with the feedback. I hope to continue researching this and would like to invite any others who are reading and haven't posted yet to weigh in, especially those who are in the industry and those who were collecting during Marquard's life and may have other examples they could post. Thanks again.

[WillowGrove]

Originally Posted by ATP

Peter, thanks for posting, I really appreciate you taking the time to add what you have, and to include scans. I think it's pretty telling that someone else was working Rube's mail at the time you wrote to him and using that stamp. The little note wishing you a happy birthday clearly is not written by Rube and sure does look an awful lot like the other "Stick" R examples, and definitely looks like the signed T205 I posted and the example of his wife's signature (just look at the "d" finish in Marquard).

And Tom, I think it's also really worth noting, regarding the signed Diamond Greats you posted, that Rube's signature didn't have much left to it at all based on when that was signed (1979 or 1980, but you can STILL see the signature traits you expect), it looks NOTHING like the short note written regarding the Happy Birthday to Peter and would have been signed very close in time based on when that card was made.

I must say that I really was hesitant about creating this post in the first place. I was anxious that I would get bad reactions from some folks, especially those who may have owned one of the examples I was pointing out, but overall I am very happy with the feedback. I hope to continue researching this and would like to invite any others who are reading and haven't posted yet to weigh in, especially those who are in the industry and those who were collecting during Marquard's life and may have other examples they could post. Thanks again.

Oh I see now Jeff. I was assuming the note was Rube because it has the loop and not the stick.

And Tom's post is so interesting., for reasons you stated.

I wonder if we can figure out when Rube stopped signing himself? In other words, was he consistently signing himself until the end or periodically or was there a cut off maybe after his hospital stay? Again, sorry if this was discussed earlier, I haven't re-read.

I'll have to find the signed Rube I acquired more recently to see where it falls.

Interesting stuff here.

[ATP]

Originally Posted by WillowGrove

Oh I see now Jeff. I was assuming the note was Rube because it has the loop and not the stick.

And Tom's post is so interesting., for reasons you stated.

I wonder if we can figure out when Rube stopped signing himself? In other words, was he consistently signing himself until the end or periodically or was there a cut off maybe after his hospital stay? Again, sorry if this was discussed earlier, I haven't re-read.

I'll have to find the signed Rube I acquired more recently to see where it falls.

Interesting stuff here.

Peter, as far as I know (from the research I have been doing), there has never been any formal thought that someone was signing for Rube. I don't believe anyone has theorized he may have used a ghost signer before. If someone else has been researching this as well I would love to collaborate. It's interesting too that you have proof of a stamp being used at that time. Admittedly I have been focusing on handwriting and haven't specifically been looking for stamps, so I haven't noticed that before either. Regarding the "Happy Birthday" note, it doesn't quite have the same "Stick" in the R as the others but it's very similar in other areas (the start of the "u" in Rube starting separately and so high above the end of the R, not connecting it with the R, and the finish of the "d", among other things. The letters themselves in the "Happy Birthday" part are nothing like his handwriting. Lastly, it would be quite odd indeed for him to stamp the card and HOF plaque but write the short note. By all means, if you have any other Marquard signed items, especially if you can date to when there were signed, please post away. Best, Jeff

[WillowGrove]

Gotcha Jeff. When I found out my Rube was a stamp after about 35 years, I acquired this one.

[ATP]

Originally Posted by WillowGrove

Gotcha Jeff. When I found out my Rube was a stamp after about 35 years, I acquired this one.

That one definitely looks spot on!

[ATP]

I will go through all of the other examples of Rube's handwriting this week, but just wanted to show really quick how he made his upper case "F"'s, from a letter in 1975. Completely different formation. I will do the other letters from Happy Birthday later this week. I think there is a very strong possibility this Happy Birthday note was written by his wife Jeannette, which would just be fantastic for my research as I have really been hoping someone may have received something written along with an autograph reply from that time period.

[btcarfagno]

The one in my 1966 letter from him (top of page 4 of this thread) has a capital F exactly like the one in your post here from the 1975 letter. Mine was definitely written by him.

Tom C