The Future of Negro League Players in the Hall

[Topnotchsy]

It seems like there will be another opportunity for Negro League players in 2020 (pretty sure I read that here in a post but can't seem to find it) and that got me thinking.

If I understand correctly, consideration for Negro League players was originally by a committee formed in 1971 with Monte Irvin as the chairman, and they voted in 9 players from 1971-1977. The veteran's committee elected a couple of players in the 80's and then 1 a year from 1995-2001. In 2006, a special committee was put together that elected 17 Negro League-related personnel (players, owners etc.) And now we have the upcoming 2020 opportunity.

Obviously the Negro Leagues ended decades ago. And while there is ongoing research that continues to shed light on these players, there are still quite a few players who were considered by their peers to be incredible, but have not made the Hall, and may not be the first names on a short list to make the Hall.

Given the way things have progressed, where do you see things ending up? Do we have committees every few years voting in a few Negro League players until there are another 30+ players? Are we almost at the end and basically only the players in now (and maybe a few others) is it? How do you see this playing out?

[tazdmb]

From my understanding, they will be up for consideration in 2020 and again in 2030. Based on the past track record, I wouldn't hold my breath for anyone getting in. There will not be a special Negro League Committee in 2006 and I doubt there will be any former Negro League players-like Irvin and O'neal-on the Committee.

[packs]

Going to cross my fingers for Valentin Dreke, Francisco Coimbre, and Perucho Cepeda anyway.

[Jason19th]

Originally Posted by packs

Going to cross my fingers for Valentin Dreke, Francisco Coimbre, and Perucho Cepeda anyway.

I think the above players, though unquestionable great players, actually poise a interesting question. How much should we value performances outside the US. After all it is the National baseball hall of fame and museum. We would never think about putting Sarahadru Oh or Victor Sarafin in the hall for there performance in japan. So should we think about putting Cepeda in for what he did in Puerto Rico and other Latin league. The same with Drake - if I am correct his stateside negro league experience is pretty limited. Pedro Formental played in the Cuban leagues throughout the 1950 and has many of the offensive career records. He was a great player - but should he really be considered for the American hall of fame

[packs]

I think they should be. Dihigo played 12 seasons in the Negro Leagues, but I would argue it was his numbers in the Cuban and Latin leagues that got him in.

I think Dandridge and Jose Mendez's careers followed a similar path.

Cepeda is the most intriguing of my picks vis a vis this point. He refused to play in the Negro Leagues because he refused to be a part of a segregated society. So he expressly chose not to play in the Negro Leagues as a form of protest.

At the end of the day, all of the players I chose were excluded from playing in the Major Leagues because of their skin color, so for me, that is why they should be considered. Oh and Starfin don't meet that criteria.

[Topnotchsy]

Originally Posted by Jason19th

I think the above players, though unquestionable great players, actually poise a interesting question. How much should we value performances outside the US. After all it is the National baseball hall of fame and museum. We would never think about putting Sarahadru Oh or Victor Sarafin in the hall for there performance in japan. So should we think about putting Cepeda in for what he did in Puerto Rico and other Latin league. The same with Drake - if I am correct his stateside negro league experience is pretty limited. Pedro Formental played in the Cuban leagues throughout the 1950 and has many of the offensive career records. He was a great player - but should he really be considered for the American hall of fame

I've been thinking about this question and wonder whether Puerto Rico, which is a US Territory, should be viewed more similar to the Negro Leagues, or more similar to other areas... (or whether this should matter at all).

[darwinbulldog]

Just to play devil's advocate here, given the racial makeup of the country at the time, in the absence of any bias wouldn't one conclude that there should be approximately 10 white players of the era in the Hall for every Negro League player? And isn't the actual ratio far lower than that? Or is there compelling evidence to conclude (e.g., from exhibition games and post-integration data) that the top 100 black players were approximately as good as the top 100 white players in spite of there being a 90% smaller pool from which to draw the talent? And if so doesn't that suggest a remarkably (or astonishingly) large population level race difference in baseball skills?

[Klrdds]

Originally Posted by tazdmb

From my understanding, they will be up for consideration in 2020 and again in 2030. Based on the past track record, I wouldn't hold my breath for anyone getting in. There will not be a special Negro League Committee in 2006 and I doubt there will be any former Negro League players-like Irvin and O'neal-on the Committee.

You are completely correct . They are eligible in 2020 and 2030 under the Early Baseball era umbrella, and while there are probably 20 players/executives give or take from the complete Negro League era with Hall of Fame worthy credentials it is doubtful any will get elected given the current makeup of the Veterans Committee. Additionally by 2020 and certainly by 2030 the number of ex-Negro League players still living who could lobby or promote candidates will be few. The Negro Leagues will have lost their voice and history to time. While I hope for more Negro Leaguers to get inducted, without strong advocates such as Monte Irvin and Buck O' Neil the chances are slim.

[Kenny Cole]

Anymore they don't even elect great eligible players from the major leagues. While I would very much like to see more deserving Negro League players elected, the way the process is currently configured, I think that's a pipe dream. The current system is completely rigged against anyone who played before 1950, in any league, IMO.

[Topnotchsy]

Originally Posted by Klrdds

You are completely correct . They are eligible in 2020 and 2030 under the Early Baseball era umbrella, and while there are probably 20 players/executives give or take from the complete Negro League era with Hall of Fame worthy credentials it is doubtful any will get elected given the current makeup of the Veterans Committee. Additionally by 2020 and certainly by 2030 the number of ex-Negro League players still living who could lobby or promote candidates will be few. The Negro Leagues will have lost their voice and history to time. While I hope for more Negro Leaguers to get inducted, without strong advocates such as Monte Irvin and Buck O' Neil the chances are slim.

I hope that as technology continues to get better and old newspapers are better cataloged and available for research to everyone, we will continue to gain better insights into the Negro Leagues, and that will push interest. As a relatively young white male (born in the 1980's) who finds the history of the Negro Leagues both interesting and important for the story of America, civil rights etc. i hope I am not the only one.

[pclpads]

The obvious reply is, "dim." This is why the HOF is such a pathetic embarrassment. For all he did for baseball, Negro leagues and the bigs, to have have passed on Buck O'Neill tells you all you need to know about the joke known as the HOF.

[Jason19th]

Buck O'Neil was a great man, a trailblazing coach and scout, a tremdous story teller and the sole reason that the Negro League museum exists. He was a utility player who was not a hall of fame player on his best day. He would tell you that. There is really no one who is in the hall with his type of credentials.