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  #1  
Old 10-20-2020, 09:43 PM
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Default Why on earth is Mookie’s RC so cheap compared to Trout’s?

A comparable player in every way, selling for 1/5 of what Trout is. What am I missing?
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Old 10-20-2020, 09:51 PM
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If that's how you feel then buy, buy and buy some more. Trout has being the face of baseball going for him. Nothing against Mookie, he is a great player! Mookie has had an excellent post season contribution so far for the Dodgers which should only increase see his value.
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  #3  
Old 10-20-2020, 11:20 PM
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Probably has to do with the 77.4 WAR vs 45.2 WAR difference. Keep in mind Mike Trout is only 1 year older than Mookie Betts, so although he has played in more games they are nearly the same age.

That being said Mookie is great and could easily be in that conversation who is the better player currently but at this point right now Trout has accomplished more in his career and is thus more valued. I should also add that I have several of Mookie's RC cards and plan to hold onto them as I love him as a player.
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Old 10-20-2020, 11:25 PM
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Mookie Wilson comparable to Mike Trout?

What have you been smoking and/or drinking?

All he did was hit a ground ball that should've been caught for the out.

























Oh.................................

Nevermind





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  #5  
Old 10-21-2020, 07:09 AM
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Red Sox and Betts fan here. A few years ago a commentator, ARod?, was questioning why Mookie isn't a household name? I agree. I got the impression that Mookie is lowkey and possiably didn't seek hype and branding maybe it was the Sox fault? His new home with LA will be telling. If he becomes the "new face of baseball" LA is the place to do it, if he wants it.

I would add that the Sox are a real "hometown" team being on the Dodgers may have a more national appeal. Just some thoughts

I'm glad I have my Betts rookies and happy with the price I paid!
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  #6  
Old 10-21-2020, 09:00 AM
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Reminds me of Mantle vs Mays controversy from the 1960s.
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  #7  
Old 10-21-2020, 10:09 AM
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I'm a Dodger fan and have quickly fallen in love with Mookie, but Trout has been so damn consistent at such a high level, plus, and don't underestimate this, the hype train was SO huge when he was a prospect coming up at the same time as Harper, and turning out to be clearly superior to him, that it drove his value and there's never been so much as a hiccup in his performance to derail that train.
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  #8  
Old 10-21-2020, 10:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhettyeakley View Post
Probably has to do with the 77.4 WAR vs 45.2 WAR difference. Keep in mind Mike Trout is only 1 year older than Mookie Betts, so although he has played in more games they are nearly the same age.

That's pretty much it. Mookie is a fantastic player, but just the difference in their WAR (bear in mind, I don't think that's the end all be all statistic some do), is a pretty good full career, for a lot of decent ballplayers. Trout is already the 5th ranked All-Time Centerfielder on Baseball Reference. Mookie is the 27th ranked Rightfielder.

If Trout retires or gets a career ending injury tomorrow, he's going into the HOF, first ballot. If Mookie dramatically falls off for some reason, he falls into the Don Mattingly, Doc Gooden, Orel Hershiser, Bret Saberhagen, Dick Allen, Albert Belle, Juan Gonzalez, Johan Santana, etc., etc., etc...., territory.

Dominant for a time, but not quite the consistent era defining HOF star you had predicted when you shelled out a lot of dough for their rookie cards. Not to say that Betts can't change that with a couple more MVP's and a long injury free career..............but it's far from a given.
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  #9  
Old 10-21-2020, 10:57 AM
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Why is Trout higher priced ? Not sure ! But he did have 1 Stolen Base in 2020 and only 11 in 2019. Not the 5 star player anymore, and probably not many post season appearances in the future.
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  #10  
Old 10-21-2020, 11:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by insidethewrapper View Post
Why is Trout higher priced ? Not sure ! But he did have 1 Stolen Base in 2020 and only 11 in 2019. Not the 5 star player anymore, and probably not many post season appearances in the future.
Yeah, but did that stolen base get the whole country a free taco?

I think the Mantle/Mays comparison is appropriate. I just don't get the price difference. Whatever. I’ll take 5 Mookie RCs over one Trout any day of the week.
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  #11  
Old 10-21-2020, 11:54 AM
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Mantle and Mays were roughly comparable players. Trout and Betts are not. At this point in their careers, it's really not even close. Betts is a very good although somewhat inconsistent player, Trout is generational.
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  #12  
Old 10-21-2020, 01:13 PM
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Buy the red foil ASAP

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  #13  
Old 10-21-2020, 01:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neal View Post
Buy the red foil ASAP

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Haha. No.
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  #14  
Old 10-21-2020, 02:31 PM
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Trout is one of the best players of all time.

Mookie is another very good player. He is not one of the best players of all time.
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  #15  
Old 10-21-2020, 07:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bxb View Post
Reminds me of Mantle vs Mays controversy from the 1960s.

Don't overlook the obvious difference:

Mantle is to Mays

as

Trout is to Betts

No controversy, it's just there.
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  #16  
Old 10-21-2020, 07:52 PM
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With Mantle and Mays, the WAR tilt is actually significant in Mays direction.
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  #17  
Old 10-21-2020, 10:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TedWill1939 View Post
Red Sox and Betts fan here. A few years ago a commentator, ARod?, was questioning why Mookie isn't a household name? I agree. I got the impression that Mookie is lowkey and possiably didn't seek hype and branding maybe it was the Sox fault? His new home with LA will be telling. If he becomes the "new face of baseball" LA is the place to do it, if he wants it.

I would add that the Sox are a real "hometown" team being on the Dodgers may have a more national appeal. Just some thoughts

I'm glad I have my Betts rookies and happy with the price I paid!

Maybe he should have someone take his picture kissing himself in the mirror, that ought to do it for the branding.
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  #18  
Old 10-21-2020, 10:51 PM
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Statistical comparison aside, it boils down to:

1. While similar talents, Trout is widely regarded as the player of this this generation both by the hobby and the sport at large. You could debate the two as long as you like but in almost every facet Trout is “generational” and Betts is “exceptional” by majority. I tend to fall into this camp as well, and it’s direct correlation to hobby prices is obvious.

2. The 2011 Topps Update Trout has taken a life of it own and can now be easily regarded as the most important modern baseball card in the hobby (sans manufactured scarcity) and it could be argued it has cracked the top 10 most important post war baseball cards. The 2014 Betts, while valuable and important, is not in the same standing.
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  #19  
Old 10-21-2020, 11:01 PM
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trout is babe ruth mookie is jimmie foxx, that's the more apropos comparison in term of performance. and i love mookie being a dodgers fan, he's been everything and more with the already high expectations.
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  #20  
Old 10-22-2020, 09:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike D. View Post
With Mantle and Mays, the WAR tilt is actually significant in Mays direction.
Career OPS+

1st Ruth 202
5th Trout 176
7th Mantle 172
19th Mays 156
113th Betts 135
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  #21  
Old 10-24-2020, 07:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gorditadogg View Post
Career OPS+

1st Ruth 202
5th Trout 176
7th Mantle 172
19th Mays 156
113th Betts 135
OPS+ only measures offense, though, WAR measures offense, defense, and baserunning.

Of course, WAR is also a counting stat, so the fact that Mays had 12,497 plate appearances in his career vs. 9,910 for Mantle is taken into consideration.
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  #22  
Old 10-31-2020, 02:15 PM
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Mickey Mantle went to the World Series twelve times! When he retired from the game, he had seven rings! He was a true champion! There is a reason why his cards are expensive! As for Trout, I don't know man! This guy has zero World Series appearances, and made the playoffs just once! And despite this, statheads are just punching away at their calculators going "Let me divide his ABs with his WAR and let's multiply this by 52.385 and then subtract this total from his ... oh my godness! Oh my godness! This guy is the best! Wow! Wow! Wow! " It's quite laughable!
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  #23  
Old 10-31-2020, 02:22 PM
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And you heard it here folks...a teams success is the measure of an individual players worth and the major driver in their card values!
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  #24  
Old 11-01-2020, 07:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by samosa4u View Post
Mickey Mantle went to the World Series twelve times! When he retired from the game, he had seven rings! He was a true champion! There is a reason why his cards are expensive! As for Trout, I don't know man! This guy has zero World Series appearances, and made the playoffs just once! And despite this, statheads are just punching away at their calculators going "Let me divide his ABs with his WAR and let's multiply this by 52.385 and then subtract this total from his ... oh my godness! Oh my godness! This guy is the best! Wow! Wow! Wow! " It's quite laughable!
Ted Williams had no rings. Is he laughable?
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Old 11-01-2020, 08:27 PM
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Ted Williams had no rings. Is he laughable?
Not at all. People aren't spending gazillions of dollars on his cards and nor do they compare him to Babe Ruth (like they do Trout).
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  #26  
Old 11-01-2020, 08:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by samosa4u View Post
Not at all. People aren't spending gazillions of dollars on his cards and nor do they compare him to Babe Ruth (like they do Trout).
He's literally considered one of(if not the) greatest hitter of all time. I do agree Trout is overrated though only because his career story isn't finished, not because he hasn't made the playoffs.
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  #27  
Old 11-07-2020, 08:14 AM
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Trout has nine straight years of OPS+ of over 150. Betts has done that just once in his seven year career.

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  #28  
Old 11-11-2020, 01:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
Mantle and Mays were roughly comparable players. Trout and Betts are not. At this point in their careers, it's really not even close. Betts is a very good although somewhat inconsistent player, Trout is generational.
I'd quibble with this as Mookie is not just a very good player, he is a generational talent. But you're right in that he's still not comparable to Trout, because Trout is beyond generational. I don't know what's the next level, or the level beyond that, but Trout is there - perhaps epochal?
Mookie won an MVP and has finished no lower than 8th in the four years prior to 2020 (he should garner good MVP consideration this year, too), pretty consistent.
Trout finished lower than 2nd once in the eight years prior to 2020 (and he should garner MVP consideration this year, too), while winning three and being the runner-up four times.
I've been a Red Sox fan for most of my life, but the trade of Mookie last winter really challenged my fandom. If a team owner wants to save a few bucks so much that he wants to trade a homegrown player like Mookie, I don't think that owner appreciates baseball, the team's fans or how special a player and person Mookie is. Seems like the Dodgers and their fans appreciate him, though, so that's a good thing.
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  #29  
Old 11-11-2020, 07:03 PM
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I guess you would have to say he's one of the top handful of players the last 10 or even 15 years, but then again it feels like it hasn't been a great 10-15 years for hitters. Consider, for example, career home runs. One active player has over 500, Pujols of course. Cabrera is close, but then you drop down to Encarnacion and Cruz in the low 400s (and both are approaching 40), and from there it's another big drop to Braun at around 350. It feels like, especially with home runs being relatively plentiful, there should be more guys with higher totals?
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  #30  
Old 11-16-2020, 10:33 AM
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Default Trout = g.o.a.t?

Someone else may have already brought this up, but Trout has a legitimate shot to be the best to ever play (up to this point). I would think that would drive demand as much as anything.
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  #31  
Old 11-19-2020, 06:38 AM
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I don't think there is a question as to which of these guys has accomplished more but consider this:
  • Betts is as exciting as any player in the game to watch
  • his postseason play this year was top-notch.
  • will continue to be in the postseason consistently
  • has 392 million reasons for everyone to carefully track his progress
  • regardless of the Mantle/Mays comparison Mookie delivers with his glove in a way that is reminiscent of Mays.
  • he has a loyal fanbase on both coasts.

These are on top of his numbers which as everyone has pointed out are really good. Not Trout numbers yet, but he's certainly pulled a chair up to the table. He's stealing the heart of the baseball world and that will drive his cards. Will they ever be as big as Trout? That's hard to imagine but I never imagined Trout's cards would get to where they are. If anything I think people are going to ask this exact question more and more frequently and turn to Betts cards. Trout cards are exploding right now. The PSA 10 '11 Topps Update is selling for $2300+, Betts cards are going to rise too. Betts cards will get pushed up just by being comparable to Trout. He doesn't have to be as good, he only has to be in the conversation and comparable- because truly no one else in the game is comparable to Trout. They won't eclipse Trout until he's eclipsed Trout but I certainly expect them to continue trending up. He's a savvy player to collect right now. If Trout cards continue to break records the demand for his other rookies will follow, and by being in the conversation with Trout, Betts cards will shadow that climb. Make no mistake Trout is driving the demand and it's sky-high right now but Betts cards will benefit. I don't see Betts' superfractor selling for $3.93 million, last I saw it sold for $79,200. It's got a LOOOOOOONG way to go- but if he continues to turn heads as he has and remain comparable to Trout (and assuming Trout keeps playing at a high level) they'll keep going up. I wouldn't be shocked if his cards climbed faster than Trout's did. A lower ceiling with a steeper curve.
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