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  #201  
Old 05-10-2021, 12:57 PM
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I think if anything I'm trivializing fate.

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  #202  
Old 05-11-2021, 05:37 PM
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Ten years from now, you'll be hearing commercials that say, "If you took the Covid vaccine from 2020 to 2021, you may be entitled to cash compensation."
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  #203  
Old 05-11-2021, 05:43 PM
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Ten years from now, you'll be hearing commercials that say, "If you took the Covid vaccine from 2020 to 2021, you may be entitled to cash compensation."
Exactly.
I have not and my wife has not.
We will not.

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  #204  
Old 05-11-2021, 06:05 PM
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Ten years from now, you'll be hearing commercials that say, "If you took the Covid vaccine from 2020 to 2021, you may be entitled to cash compensation."
More likely we will see wrongful death claims based on some tortured theory that it is someone else's fault the decedent DIDN'T get the vaccine.
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  #205  
Old 05-11-2021, 06:13 PM
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  #206  
Old 05-11-2021, 06:43 PM
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Ten years from now, you'll be hearing commercials that say, "If you took the Covid vaccine from 2020 to 2021, you may be entitled to cash compensation."
Because they are approved for "emergency use only" is suing/compensation even a possibility?

Why emergency COVID-vaccine approvals pose a dilemma for scientists
Immunizations are speeding towards approval before clinical trials end, but scientists say this could complicate efforts to study long-term effects.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-03219-y


Last edited by irv; 05-11-2021 at 06:43 PM.
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  #207  
Old 05-11-2021, 08:47 PM
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Do the people who have hesitancy about the vaccines and want more research avoid GMO foods? Curious.
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  #208  
Old 05-12-2021, 05:39 AM
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Do the people who have hesitancy about the vaccines and want more research avoid GMO foods? Curious.
I absolutely avoid GMO foods.
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  #209  
Old 05-12-2021, 06:06 AM
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I absolutely avoid GMO foods.
It looks like the new future, at least for a while, is get a COVID test every time you'd like to go to an event, even outside, although I don't plan visiting an outdoor Singapore construction site. Or produce a completed vaccine record.

Eventually, unless YOU want to be the one hiding inside from a virus that may not be the least bit lethal to your demographic, or to the majority of healthy people under 55, you have to get your Fauci Ouchie.

The minority finally won! I guess you can always tip your hat to "saving lives".

I'll let those have need it, have anxiety over not getting it, or feel the need to brag how "they got theirs", line up first, then I'll get mine. I'm just that kind of guy, selfless, maybe to a fault.




So you don't eat corn?



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  #210  
Old 05-12-2021, 06:32 AM
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Because generally speaking people on one side of the aisle live in a fantasy world and people on the other side of the aisle live in the real world.

Doug "like how I did that?" Goodman
The problem is each group thinks you're talking about the other...
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  #211  
Old 05-12-2021, 07:55 AM
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The problem is each group thinks you're talking about the other...
At least they both would be right.
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  #212  
Old 05-12-2021, 08:18 AM
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At least they both would be right.
But they'd never agree on it!
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  #213  
Old 05-12-2021, 09:03 AM
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It looks like the new future, at least for a while, is get a COVID test every time you'd like to go to an event, even outside, although I don't plan visiting an outdoor Singapore construction site. Or produce a completed vaccine record.

Eventually, unless YOU want to be the one hiding inside from a virus that may not be the least bit lethal to your demographic, or to the majority of healthy people under 55, you have to get your Fauci Ouchie.

The minority finally won! I guess you can always tip your hat to "saving lives".

I'll let those have need it, have anxiety over not getting it, or feel the need to brag how "they got theirs", line up first, then I'll get mine. I'm just that kind of guy, selfless, maybe to a fault.




So you don't eat corn?



I eat organic corn when bought from the store, and in the summer I buy from organic local farmers.
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  #214  
Old 05-12-2021, 10:29 AM
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I am guessing that most of us ingest all sorts of stuff every day that hasn't really been studied extensively for long term safety. And may never be.

I wonder how many regular smokers are skeptical of the vaccine's safety?
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  #215  
Old 05-12-2021, 10:38 AM
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I'm just curious why creeping doubt about remote side effects only comes into consciousness about this particular vaccine. I have no doubt that there are a bunch of members who take all kinds of prescription medication with all kinds of warnings on the bottles about the remote possibilities of side effects. Why does a remote chance of a negative reaction only bother you vis a vis the vaccine?
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  #216  
Old 05-12-2021, 10:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
I am guessing that most of us ingest all sorts of stuff every day that hasn't really been studied extensively for long term safety. And may never be.

I wonder how many regular smokers are skeptical of the vaccine's safety?
You better not be knocking my chili dog addiction!
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  #217  
Old 05-12-2021, 10:50 AM
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I'm just curious why creeping doubt about remote side effects only comes into consciousness about this particular vaccine. I have no doubt that there are a bunch of members who take all kinds of prescription medication with all kinds of warnings on the bottles about the remote possibilities of side effects. Why does a remote chance of a negative reaction only bother you vis a vis the vaccine?
Maybe because it's a political position justified by a sounds-good mantra divorced from the science?

As to those who raise the straw man of final FDA approval, consider fen-phen. Among other drugs later withdrawn from the market.
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  #218  
Old 05-12-2021, 10:52 AM
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I'm just curious why creeping doubt about remote side effects only comes into consciousness about this particular vaccine. I have no doubt that there are a bunch of members who take all kinds of prescription medication with all kinds of warnings on the bottles about the remote possibilities of side effects. Why does a remote chance of a negative reaction only bother you vis a vis the vaccine?
In some cases not so remote, my friend. There are many thousands of people effed up by using drugs as prescribed. Nothing is perfectly safe, probably not even a Diet Coke.

How much "long term safety" data, by the way, do people think the FDA has when they APPROVE a drug? Not necessarily that much.
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  #219  
Old 05-12-2021, 10:55 AM
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You better not be knocking my chili dog addiction!
Now that might be worth the risk.
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  #220  
Old 05-12-2021, 11:36 AM
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I'm just curious why creeping doubt about remote side effects only comes into consciousness about this particular vaccine.
It's not necessarily the vaccine itself, but the fact that we were lied to from the very beginning over the whole Covid situation.
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  #221  
Old 05-12-2021, 11:43 AM
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It's not necessarily the vaccine itself, but the fact that we were lied to from the very beginning over the whole Covid situation.
I agree! "In two weeks this will all fade away" did a lot of harm to the debate
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  #222  
Old 05-12-2021, 11:51 AM
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We're talking about getting the vaccine. My question is about the vaccine itself not any kind of politics or personal feelings about the pandemic.

Last edited by packs; 05-12-2021 at 12:26 PM.
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  #223  
Old 05-12-2021, 11:51 AM
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I agree! "In two weeks this will all fade away" did a lot of harm to the debate
In fairness, the sky is falling world is ending coverage of some of the media wasn't that helpful either.
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  #224  
Old 05-12-2021, 11:56 AM
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In fairness, the sky is falling world is ending coverage of some of the media wasn't that helpful either.
Totally agree.
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  #225  
Old 05-12-2021, 12:22 PM
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I agree! "In two weeks this will all fade away" did a lot of harm to the debate
It went from "two weeks to flatten the curve" to "I'll need to see your vaccine card before you can...(fill in the blank)" all within one year.

But I was referring more to the constant flip flop regarding effectiveness of masks, whether the disease could be transmitted via contaminated surfaces, even to the fact that the WHO came out and initially said there was no evidence of human-to-human transmission.

Also the inconsistency in testing. When a goat and a pawpaw test positive for Covid and one doesn't question that, then they are indeed brainwashed.

And not to get political, but even statements from NY political leaders:

"This disease, even if you were to get it, basically acts like a common cold or flu. And transmission is not that easy." - NYC Mayor Bill de Blasio - February 10th 2020

"We know that there is currently no indication that it's easy to transmit by casual contact. There's no need to do any special anything in the community. We want New Yorkers to go about their daily lives - ride the subway, take the bus, go see your neighbors." - NYC Health Commissioner Dr. Oxiris Barbot, MD - March 2, 2020

“There's really no need to panic and avoid activities that we always do as New Yorkers.” - I don’t know who this moron is, but he obviously has some kind of leadership position. - February 2, 2020

I could go on and on. But surely some can see why one would question the vaccine given so much misinformation.
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  #226  
Old 05-12-2021, 12:26 PM
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So here is a thought. Everyone now has the opportunity to get the vaccine if they want it.
Why not? Everything should be opened 100%. Those that didn't get the vaccine are happy, we that did are happy...it's a happy place. Since my 2nd shot a few weeks ago I find myself wearing my mask less but still wear it every day to most places. Again, to each their own.

My daughter the stats major isn't getting one yet either even though I have told her my thoughts and I think she should.

In response to David, right above. This is a fluid situation and the ebbs and flows of the pandemic are expected. I am NOT a doomsayer but just go by the overwhelming science of it. I also think, at this point, everyone should get to do what they want.
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  #227  
Old 05-12-2021, 12:27 PM
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It went from "two weeks to flatten the curve" to "I'll need to see your vaccine card before you can...(fill in the blank)" all within one year.

But I was referring more to the constant flip flop regarding effectiveness of masks, whether the disease could be transmitted via contaminated surfaces, even to the fact that the WHO came out and initially said there was no evidence of human-to-human transmission.

Also the inconsistency in testing. When a goat and a pawpaw test positive for Covid and one doesn't question that, then they are indeed brainwashed.

And not to get political, but even statements from NY political leaders:

"This disease, even if you were to get it, basically acts like a common cold or flu. And transmission is not that easy." - NYC Mayor Bill de Blasio - February 10th 2020

"We know that there is currently no indication that it's easy to transmit by casual contact. There's no need to do any special anything in the community. We want New Yorkers to go about their daily lives - ride the subway, take the bus, go see your neighbors." - NYC Health Commissioner Dr. Oxiris Barbot, MD - March 2, 2020

“There's really no need to panic and avoid activities that we always do as New Yorkers.” - I don’t know who this moron is, but he obviously has some kind of leadership position. - February 2, 2020

I could go on and on. But surely some can see why one would question the vaccine given so much misinformation.

But if you had this same skepticism about all medication there wouldn't be any medication to take. Why is the vaccine different?
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  #228  
Old 05-12-2021, 12:32 PM
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Many people said many stupid things along the way, but overall the arc has been one of learning as we go from experience, not a vast conspiracy, I think.
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  #229  
Old 05-12-2021, 12:36 PM
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But if you had this same skepticism about all medication there wouldn't be any medication to take. Why is the vaccine different?
Because it's new. I've said (and others have said too) once it's been around for a while and it's been determined there are no long term side effects, I'll more than likely get it.
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  #230  
Old 05-12-2021, 12:39 PM
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Very first time an RNA vaccine is brought to market is for this virulent form of the common cold. Very first large scale human phase III "trial". Mrna should revolutionize medicine, I hope it does. No denying its virulent, no denying it's a form of the common cold.


Why do we call the old yearly vaccine choice a flu "shot" when it is a vaccine? Kind of confusing compared to other vaccines, the ones we dont ask side effects of, polio, measles, etc we get once and are immune for life. Will this one work the same?


I cant remember anyone being singled out as an anti-vaxxer for not opting for a flu shot
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  #231  
Old 05-12-2021, 12:46 PM
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Because it's new. I've said (and others have said too) once it's been around for a while and it's been determined there are no long term side effects, I'll more than likely get it.
Has that determination been made for any approved drug, or GMOs, or artificial sweeteners or preservatives, or household cleaning products you probably inhale when using?
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  #232  
Old 05-12-2021, 12:56 PM
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Has that determination been made for any approved drug, or GMOs, or artificial sweeteners or preservatives?
I'm not having those shoved down my throat, or being bombarded with commercials with celebrities and politicians telling me how safe those are and why I should consume them.

Let's turn it around. Have you ever in your lifetime seen so much persuasiveness to take a vaccine? I'll be 50 next month (and I think you're a little older than I am) and I've never seen anything like it. Does that seem normal to you? I've never seen a flu vaccine commercial in my life. You???
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  #233  
Old 05-12-2021, 01:01 PM
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I'm not having those shoved down my throat, or being bombarded with commercials with celebrities and politicians telling me how safe those are and why I should consume them.

Let's turn it around. Have you ever in your lifetime seen so much persuasiveness to take a vaccine? I'll be 50 next month (and I think you're a little older than I am) and I've never seen anything like it. Does that seem normal to you? I've never seen a flu vaccine commercial in my life. You???
The pandemic is unprecedented in our lifetime, no? Don't you think that explains it?
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  #234  
Old 05-12-2021, 01:04 PM
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There have actually been pretty aggressive vaccination campaigns lately. The most prominent one that comes to mind is the HPV vaccine. The meningitis B vaccine is another huge one. These vaccines are targeted toward children / young adults in particular so you may not be as familiar.
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  #235  
Old 05-12-2021, 01:06 PM
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The pandemic is unprecedented in our lifetime, no? Don't you think that explains it?
I don't think it explains it. Unless one is living under a rock, they know there is a vaccine out there that is FREE to them if they so choose. So why are they really pushing this thing so hard??? That just doesn't seem normal to me.
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  #236  
Old 05-12-2021, 03:34 PM
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Let's turn it around. Have you ever in your lifetime seen so much persuasiveness to take a vaccine?
Evidently the "persuasiveness" isn't very persuasive, at least to you, which is kind of funny because most (if not all) of the people you voted for, and those you probably watch and listen to on TV have all "been persuaded", even though they campaign with their own "persuasiveness" against you doing so.

I'm older than you, so when I reference my lifetime it encompasses yours. I travel for a living (nearly 5 million miles during my career, half of it on the ground) and in MY lifetime, I have never experienced anything that CLOSED the entire world to my multi-billion dollar business that employs millions of people worldwide.

This isn't a Democrat vs Rumpublican based political issue, none of my friends in Adelaide, Australia; Sao Paulo, Brazil; Eindhoven, Holland; St. John's, Newfoundland; Tokyo, Japan; Kerikeri, New Zealand; etc. care in the slightest that for the first time in my life I agree with Liz Cheney.

And they also don't care that you probably don't.

This thread is getting tired, let's discuss something else we might eventually agree on like abortion or the death penalty.

Doug "If there is a God, she Hates Us All" Goodman
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  #237  
Old 05-12-2021, 03:49 PM
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In the US it does, for whatever reason, seem to be a political issue. I would be willing to bet there is a pretty good statistical correlation between position on the vaccine and party affiliation. Indeed I recently saw a rather startling statistic on the percentage of people who call themselves Republicans who don't intend to get it.

Not unusual for America I suppose. For example, you would think which person you believe in a he said she said sexual assault case would probably correlate more with your sex than anything else, but if the alleged perpetrator is a political figure (e.g. a Supreme Court nominee), party affiliation becomes a huge factor. The irony there is when the next accused is from the other party, everyone changes sides.
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  #238  
Old 05-13-2021, 06:28 AM
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Follow the science.

How many times have they flip flopped on this vaccine?? I have honestly lost count, but that also goes with the rest of the narrative. From masks don't do anything to wear 2, it's on surfaces to no its not. I could go on here but it's a waste of time.
Everyone up here also seems to have forgotten that the original advice was to get both shots within a couple/few weeks of each other to be effective, but because our Federal gov't didn't procure enough, they say waiting up to 4 months now or longer is OK too????

Ontario will no longer offer first doses of AstraZeneca COVID-19 vaccine

TORONTO -- Ontario will no longer offer first doses of the AstraZeneca COVID-19 vaccine due to an increase in reports of rare blood clots.

The announcement was made by Ontario’s Chief Medical Officer of Health Dr. David Williams on Tuesday afternoon.


https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/ontario-w...cine-1.5423379

Now our Federal gov't, again, because he didn't procure enough vaccines, is talking about mixing them but yet there is no confirmed/verified data about the health risks nor if mixing them will actually do anything???

I'm sure the "science" will come out and eventually tell us mixing them is OK, but I imagine, just like the AstraZeneca vaccine, in a few weeks, they will tell us differently.
https://www.cp24.com/news/u-k-study-...ines-1.5425549

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipUn5goyM2I

What a mess!

Last edited by irv; 05-13-2021 at 06:29 AM.
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  #239  
Old 05-13-2021, 07:25 AM
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To those on all sides of the 'speed to market' issue of the vaccine, maybe we should serious consider this: Are we taking too much time to approve everything else?
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  #240  
Old 05-13-2021, 07:28 AM
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"All SUNY and CUNY schools will require vaccinations for all in-person students beginning Fall 2021. This requirement is subject to the FDA providing a full approval for the vaccine, beyond the current emergency use authorization. Certain medical and religious exemptions will be permitted. "


Yes you gotta have faith a-faith a-faith!

I have a feeling we see some growth in religious catagories
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  #241  
Old 05-14-2021, 06:25 AM
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B.C. man has part of small intestine removed due to vaccine-induced blood clot

"I really wish they had let us know what “worse case scenario” might look like...""


https://www.torontosun.com/news/loca...f-81de5fd6d4c0

Manitoba Chief Microbiologist and Laboratory Specialist: 56% of positive “cases” are not infectious

"PCR testing was invented to find genetic viral material in a sample and has not traditionally been used as the sole method for identifying people suffering from a viral or bacterial disease"

And of course the media spin, or what they tell you.

"Finally, it should be noted that some Canadian news agencies have quoted Dr. Bullard as testifying that a positive PCR tests indicates infectivity 99.9% of the time. This is incorrect. Rather, Dr. Bullard testified that a PCR test will detect any viral RNA that is present in a sample 99.9% of the time. However, Dr. Bullard testified that determining whether or not a sample is actually infectious (containing a viable virus, capable of replicating) needs to be confirmed by lab culture. As noted, only 44% of the “positive” samples using a Ct of 18 returned a viable lab culture. Samples tested at a Ct of over 25, according to Dr. Bullard’s report, produced no viable lab cultures"

https://www.jccf.ca/manitoba-chief-m...7YnWc-PlDM2I18

Last edited by irv; 05-14-2021 at 06:26 AM.
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  #242  
Old 05-14-2021, 08:11 AM
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Bill Maher diagnosed with Covid...after being fully vaccinated.
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  #243  
Old 05-14-2021, 08:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy View Post
Bill Maher diagnosed with Covid...after being fully vaccinated.
Damn, that just invalidates the whole thing.
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  #244  
Old 05-14-2021, 08:50 AM
Republicaninmass Republicaninmass is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy View Post
Bill Maher diagnosed with Covid...after being fully vaccinated.
nobody ever said it was 100% lol

I wonder if he had a "case" or was asymtomatic, and needed to test everyday, as many of us in "MY TRILLION" dollar business have to do.


Unprecedented use of the word unprecedented

1st time the world shuts down

1st time PCR tests used as sole method for diagnosis of viral disease

1st time rna vaccine use

1st time vaccine rolled out, before fully approved


forgot one

1st time the medical term "case" is used for something which shows NO symptoms. That is known as asymptomatic for the folks just catching on
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  #245  
Old 05-14-2021, 10:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Republicaninmass View Post
nobody ever said it was 100% lol

I wonder if he had a "case" or was asymtomatic, and needed to test everyday, as many of us in "MY TRILLION" dollar business have to do.


Unprecedented use of the word unprecedented

1st time the world shuts down

1st time PCR tests used as sole method for diagnosis of viral disease

1st time rna vaccine use

1st time vaccine rolled out, before fully approved


forgot one

1st time the medical term "case" is used for something which shows NO symptoms. That is known as asymptomatic for the folks just catching on
It's proven everyday............ the vaccine does not prevent contraction nor transmission with countless scores of people being vaccinating then testing positive......

Now, which totally blows my mind, they are pushing this crap on children which, statistically speaking, affects 0.000% of them.

And oh yeah, someone said they weren't pushing these on people at all.
I'm sure AOC is now pissed that beef is being used as a lure with climate change and all but these must be vegan burgers I assume?.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CO0lpsNl..._web_copy_link
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  #246  
Old 05-14-2021, 10:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irv View Post
It's proven everyday............ the vaccine does not prevent contraction nor transmission with countless scores of people being vaccinating then testing positive......

Now, which totally blows my mind, they are pushing this crap on children which, statistically speaking, affects 0.000% of them.

And oh yeah, someone said they weren't pushing these on people at all.
I'm sure AOC is now pissed that beef is being used as a lure with climate change and all but these must be vegan burgers I assume?.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CO0lpsNl..._web_copy_link
If the efficacy rate is 95 percent, which is incredibly high for any vaccine, and countless millions of people get it, then of course there are going to be high numbers of people who still get infected. Your point is?

Or maybe people who need emergency life saving surgery shouldn't get it because it only has a 95 percent chance of saving their life.
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Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 05-14-2021 at 10:47 AM.
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  #247  
Old 05-14-2021, 10:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
In the US it does, for whatever reason, seem to be a political issue. I would be willing to bet there is a pretty good statistical correlation between position on the vaccine and party affiliation. Indeed I recently saw a rather startling statistic on the percentage of people who call themselves Republicans who don't intend to get it.
I think the correlation is more along the lines of people who think for themselves being less likely to take it, as opposed to people who blindly do what they are told.

For the record, I think for myself and decided to get the shots.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
Not unusual for America I suppose. For example, you would think which person you believe in a he said she said sexual assault case would probably correlate more with your sex than anything else, but if the alleged perpetrator is a political figure (e.g. a Supreme Court nominee), party affiliation becomes a huge factor.
I think the correlation here is that people who think for themselves see an accusation, brought forward for the first time 35 years after the fact, where even the accusers own witnesses said it didn't happen, has little merit, while people who blindly follow their party are willing to destroy a person's career.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
The irony there is when the next accused is from the other party, everyone changes sides.
I disagree. I could give a clear example but I'd be violating a rule.
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  #248  
Old 05-14-2021, 10:52 AM
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And I could give all sorts of examples where the accused's party affiliation correlated very strongly with who was for him and who was against him.
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Old 05-14-2021, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark17 View Post




I think the correlation here is that people who think for themselves see an accusation, brought forward for the first time 35 years after the fact, where even the accusers own witnesses said it didn't happen, has little merit, while people who blindly follow their party are willing to destroy a person's career.


+1
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Old 05-14-2021, 04:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
If the efficacy rate is 95 percent, which is incredibly high for any vaccine, and countless millions of people get it, then of course there are going to be high numbers of people who still get infected. Your point is?

Or maybe people who need emergency life saving surgery shouldn't get it because it only has a 95 percent chance of saving their life.
Seem odd to you, Peter? 8 from the "same team" all contract covid after being fully vaccinated. Is that a 95% efficacy rate?
Again, is there any proof whatsoever that these vaccines are actually doing anything?
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/sports/...cases-n1267332
Here's another one.
https://www.sfchronicle.com/news/art...s-16172770.php

I've heard this but never posted it because I couldn't verify it but it seems like what I am hearing is true, that the CDC, and some other medical officials, for some reason (???) are trying to hide these breakthrough cases?

"At the start of May, the CDC shifted from monitoring all reported breakthroughs to only those that result in hospitalization or death, Tom Clark, head of the vaccine evaluation unit for the CDC’s vaccine task force, said in an interview"
https://fortune.com/2021/05/10/can-y...cases-tracing/
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