1939-46 Salutation Exhibits Williams

[Brian]

For all you Exhibit afficionados: Does anyone know why there is such a huge discrepancy in the rarity of the #9 shows versus the #9 not showing versions? Were they issued at the same or different times or for different durations?

If this subject has already been covered, please let me know...and thanks for any help.
Brian

[Bill77]

If I remember correctly the no #9 showing Ted was issued during the Salutation time period and was also issued well into the 1950's which is why it is much easier to find.

[Brian]

Very interesting, thanks--I naively thought it was issued through '46...

Brian

[whiteymet]

Bill above is half right. Or he did not explain it correctly or I read it wrong.

The card with #9 showing was issued with the early Salutations. Probably only in 1939/40. The version where his number is not visible was basically issued every year even into 1960. So, yes it was issued over a much longer period of time.

[Brian]

Cool--so the #9 showing is essentially a rookie card of sorts. It is a very cool card IMO.
Thanks for the great info. Brian

[Exhibitman]

i would not say rookie per se. Not until we find an uncut sheet or checklist that we can date to 1939. This whole 1939-46/1947-66 thing is an artificial construct that took hold as cataloging cards began in earnest but is demonstrably wrong. This uncut sheet of Exhibit cards is 1960 or 1961 at the earliest. Rocky Colavito is shown with Detroit, where he went after the 1959 season in a trade for Harvey Kueen. Next to Rocky is Ted Williams' Salutations card that supposedly was printed from 1939-46.



The dating divide likely stems from product redesigns after the war moving away from the Salutations design, so I give them a bit of a mulligan there. However, the reality is that ESCO issued the same card for years, hence the 1949 ("An Exhibit Card" legend on front) Salutations cards, the "Printed in USA" Williams Salutation cards, DiMaggio, Feller pitching, Tommy Holmes, and some others too. As long as the guy stayed in the show, so did his Salutations card.

Dating this stuff is subject to all sorts of poor inductive reasoning. There was a huge debate/discussion on the pre-1980 page recently with an unknowledgeable person pushing the theory that Willie Mays's first ESCO card was made in 1951, probably because he accumulated several of them and was trying to gloss them to get a payday. The refutation of that theory in part was the existence of a checklist promo card which does not have Mays on it. One of his proofs was the presence of an 1951 patch on the jersey. Well, the only deduction to make from that is that the image was taken in 1951. The card could have been made any time after the image.

My hypothesis, FWIW, is that the Williams would have been a 1940 issue at the earliest. Unlike today, ESCO was not trying to generate a buzz with rookies. From what I can tell, a rookie who made good (and Williams was one) might be in the next year's set, but not in the set issued the year he was an untested rookie. That Mays discussion was an example.

[Brian]

Amazing, thanks for the info, Adam! I knew you would have some insights into this issue.

Are there any pubs or references for these Exhibits? I have been bitten by the Exhibits bug. The combination of a real photo on an actual card is unbeatable for me.....
Brian

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by Brian

Amazing, thanks for the info, Adam! I knew you would have some insights into this issue.

Are there any pubs or references for these Exhibits? I have been bitten by the Exhibits bug. The combination of a real photo on an actual card is unbeatable for me.....
Brian

https://www.lulu.com/en/us/shop/adam...e=1&pageSize=4

[Baseball Rarities]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

https://www.lulu.com/en/us/shop/adam...e=1&pageSize=4

This is a great publication that should be in the library of everyone who has any interest in Exhibit cards.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by Baseball Rarities

This is a great publication that should be in the library of everyone who has any interest in Exhibit cards.

Thanks, Kevin!

[Rickyy]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

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If you like Exhibits...BUY THIS BOOK!

Ricky Y

[Brian]

I haven't had a chance to buy that book, but it sounds awesome. That uncut sheet is fantastic. I still don't understand why these cards are so under-appreciated, although they seem to be getting more popular (at least some of the players).

So until I buy the book:
Is it still possible to date the Exhibits by the 'made in USA' vs 'printed in USA' at the bottom, and further by the height of the lettering of the former designation? Or is this now uncertain as well?

Brian