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#1
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Are the 1910 COUPON (T213-1) cards really T206's ? ....I think so. ....What say you ?
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Pat We have gone thru this before....that pack in Jon's pix contained T213-2 or T213-3 cards. It did NOT contain 1910 COUPON cards. Think about it, the T-cards of that era served the purpose of stiffening the cigarette pack. Two cards, one on each side of the pack were inserted. There's no way the thin cardboard stock that the 1910 COUPON cards were printed on that could serve as stiffeners. Incidentally, years ago I discussed with Jon the possibility of a cigarette pack containing 1910 COUPON cards, and if I recall correctly: Jon said that none were found. Furthermore, a pack designed for 1910 COUPON cards would have had Quotation Marks on the brand name as the backs of these cards are printed with. The quotes signify a new Tobacco brand which is in the process of getting a Registered Trademark. Here are examples of this.... ............ . Therefore, continue your search for a Coupon pack that is labelled..... "COUPON". Please contact me when you do find such a pack. TED Z T206 Reference . |
#2
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backs and stating your opinions and theory's as facts. |
#3
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Hey Pat
Wishing you a very Happy New Year. Perhaps we can try to enjoy 2019 without any sarcasm on this forum. TED Z . |
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Fair enough Ted. So back to the discussion the coupon carton you refer to in
Jeremy's post doesn't have the quotation marks either. Coupon carton.jpg and can you answer the question of where the 1910 date for the type 1 comes from. |
#5
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Are the 1910 COUPON (T213-1) cards really T206's ? ....I think so. ....What say you ?
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Pat 1st.....Here is exactly what I said in the 1st post in this thread... .. Quote:
Pat....do notice that I stated...."Such a cigarette carton" This particular carton which Jeremy posted in his thread some years ago contained COUPON cigarettes manufactured in 1913 - 1919. And, if cards were enclosed in this type of carton, they would have been either T213-2 or T213-3. This we know for sure, since the LIGGETT & MYERS TOBACCO CO. logo is printed on it. The ATC divesture (circa June 1911) resulted in the following manner LIGGETT & MYERS was given about 28 per cent of the cigarette market: Coupon Piedmont Fatima American Beauty Home Run Imperiales King Bee Fatima (the only 15 Turkish blend and the cheap straight domestic brands. P. LORILLARD received 15 per cent of the nation's business: Helmar Egyptian Deities Turkish Trophies Murad Mogul and all straight Turkish brands AMERICAN TOBACCO CO. retained 37 per cent of the market: Sweet Caporal Hassan Mecca Pall Mall, its expensive all-Turkish brand, named for a fashionable London street in the 18th century where "pall-mall" (a precursor to croquet) was played. R. J. REYNOLDS received no cigarette line but was awarded 20 per cent of the plug trade. 2nd....." and can you answer the question of where the 1910 date for the type 1 comes from." Approx 10 years ago, Louisiana Newspaper clippings (1909 or 1910) were posted in a Net54 thread introducing the new ATC tobacco brand, COUPON. TED Z T206 Reference . |
#6
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In your thread title you ask "what say you" and when I posted my opinion you stated that I'm uniformed and that I'm misleading people. I don't care if people consider them T206's but in my opinion there is more evidence to support how Burdick catalogued them and not enough to change it. Yes they have the same image as T206's but the same group of subjects are not found on any other backs except piedmont's which were used on every subject with the exception of Demmitt and O'Hara St. Louis. The same T206 images were also used for type 2 and 3 and the Chief Meyers T213-3 card depicting him with New Haven would have been printed in 1919 or later, eight years after the T206 printing supposedly ended. So they either made new plates or used the T206 plates after their printing ended. When I look at the group of subjects in the T213-1's it seems plausible that's what they did with them. Do you have a copy of that newspaper clipping and does it mention anything about baseball pictures? |
#7
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Are the 1910 COUPON (T213-1) cards really T206's ? ....I think so. ....What say you ?
It isn't different. The pack depicted on Jon's site is labelled LIGGETT & MYERS; therefore, it was issued 1913 (or later). If it had BB cards in it they would be T213-2 or T213-3, ONLY.
OR, it may have Movie stars in it from that era. For example... . Quote:
Your statement here tells us that you don't realize Jefferson Burdick incorrectly classified all three T213 sets as 1914-1915 issues. This timeline is a proven fallacy, on both ends of it. "T213-1"......1910 T213-2... .1914-1916 T213-3... .1916-1919 Quote:
You find it, you are good at searching for things. Frankly, I am tired of playing this game. You do not want to accept my research, fine.....that's your prerogative. It appears to me that many guys responding in this thread have more of an open mind. TED Z . |
#8
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In post #5 of this thread Jon says the pack on his website is from 1910 hopefully if he changed his mind he will chime in. http://www.net54baseball.com/showthr...ghlight=Coupon It seems like they used quotes on a several tobacco products around that time. I have this Carolina Bright's coupon that has "Carolina Brights" on the coupon but on the picture of the pack Carolina Brights doesn't have quotes. Tobacco Coupon Back.jpg Tobacco Coupon.jpg |
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