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#1
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Geno
I was roaming the streets today while my wife was doing some shopping and ended up in my favorite tobacco card shop. I pick up a grab bag every once in awhile and the one I got today had a Pirate back Chinese card in it. Is there much demand for these? Obviously a baseball one is a treasure, but I have no idea about these. If they are worth a few bucks, I may go back and see if he has anymore... |
#2
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: peter ullman
they're nice...and worth $5-10. |
#3
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: mr. moses
that a compatriot of Martin Murray (guy in Canada can't remember his name and not Steve) or the man himself has/had 70+ of the Pirate baseball cards.... I am a bit skeptical. Alan Hagar did have 4/5 at a show 10+ years ago and my friend purchased one for a bit under 1000.00 if my memory serves me well. Forget about the actual condition when compared to the GRADE it had:-O but rare certainly says it. As for the character cards the Pirate Brand was as popular overseas as "Cycle" and "Sweet Caporal" over here with millions of cigarettes sold and nearly as many cards available. The cards are mostly a novelty item and I have a few different style packs, trade card, and a clock as "go-withs" (oooops dirty word:-)) which is how I would approach the card. To the pickers that would try and take advantage of the paucity of actual baseball cards and a general lack of knowledge especially BEFORE eBay; these cards had asking prices of 40.00 and up. They can be had now for a reasonable 5.00 to 10.00.. I'll try and post some pix on "the other board" of the artifacts that relate in a future tobacco pack thread...... |
#4
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Cobby33
Unfortunately, the price estimate above is fairly accurate. I have one only because it's the closest I'll ever come to a "real" T215 Pirate back. |
#5
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Bob
I recall Gary Nucherino buying a beautiful T206 Tinker with a Pirate back which was (I think) graded authentic 2 years ago for a nice price on ebay. It was a beautiful card and saw it in Chicago. I remember it was slabbed and I believe it was slabbed as "authentic." |
#6
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Zach Rice
There is currently a graded example of a T215 with a Pirate Cigarettes back in Clean Sweep Auctions. Also, when Mastro's live auction at the National was discussed, Doug Allen mentioned they would be auctioning a large group of "T215 Pirate cards". I can only assume these are the rare Pirate Cigarette backs and not the Red Cross T215s. |
#7
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Cobby33
Unfortunately, there are no scans of the front of the card! |
#8
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Craig H
Dang, I have one and paid about $30 for it(in 1999). I've been searching for information on non-sports issues such as these but without much success. I don't plan on getting more, but got one because of the back. |
#9
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: mr. moses
I'd be interested in the thread or article that says they were hand cut and how they came to that conclusion..... Do you remember the approximate date? Thanks in advance. |
#10
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Cobby33
Henry- I believe I saw that in SCD, however the SCD I have in front of me (2006) only says, "[t]here is reason to believe the 'standard' tobacco card length of 2-5/8" (width 1-7/16") may not be universally applicable to the Pirate cards, possibly because of packaging considerations." |
#11
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: RC McKenzie
fwiw, I thought they were handcut too. The few ones I've seen look handcut, anyway. |
#12
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Dave G
Be VERY careful if you see any lots of baseball Pirate backs - there is a major problem in europe with counterfeit chinese issues, cards, posters etc etc. |
#13
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: scott brockelman
I have never seen a handcut one. Most are trimmed at the top or bottom as the good ones I have seen are a bit diagonal cut. I have one of the few full size ones I have seen and no where does it appear hand cut. |
#14
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: daryle
I ran across a large group of these cards at a show in the late 90s (think there was 63 of them). I bought like 15 of them and then turned and sold 13. I noticed that a couple had the advertisement for "Pirate Magnums" on the back instead of just "Pirate". There were only like 2 in the stack with this ad. I bought both but sold one and kept one. Any thoughts? Tougher? Has anyone ever noticed this difference? Will post a scan when I dig it out later...... |
#15
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Anonymous
with SB although only my wife is always right. Dat be da reason I was curious and hence the question...... |
#16
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Marc S.
the current SMR touts that the Mastro Live Auction will include Ninety-Four (yes, you read that correctly, 94) Pirate-back baseball cards. |
#17
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: barrysloate
Well, I guess that ends its run as a great rarity. Even if they are offered as a group and one person gets them all and puts them away, knowing that 94 of them are out there will take away some of their mystique. |
#18
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Steve Murray
93 other guys/gals that would like to go in with me on this lot? |
#19
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: barrysloate
Steve- the logistics of organizing that group would add a few gray hairs for sure...but count me in. I might even take two! |
#20
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Steve Murray
that leaves 90. I'm starting a list |
#21
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Cobby33
Count me in for a couple! (Assuming we're not talking about the nice Asian pastoral scenes)... |
#22
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: peter ullman
steve...i'm in for one. |
#23
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: mr. moses
I need one"-) |
#24
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Cobby33
I think it would be foolish for them to do them all as one lot (assuming of course this is all accurate). Seems it would be more profitable doing several lots, as they would reach a multitude of bidders, versus one who could afford the whole thing (aside from our consortium, of course). |
#25
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Marc S.
I envision it would not be all as one lot, but perhaps four or five, with some of the HOFers (assuming there are any) segregated out, with the 'commons' sold in one group. |
#26
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Trae R.
"I recall Gary Nucherino buying a beautiful T206 Tinker with a Pirate back which was (I think) graded authentic..." |
#27
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Scott Mosley
Does the "go with" clock that you mentioned earlier look like this? |
#28
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: mr. moses
and before you LMK that it isn't real or period - I bought it as a novelty from someone that bought it as real. I am unsure (feel it probably ISN'T), never researched it, and never black lighted it or took it to a real clock guy. My questions about it's authenticity were evoked and precipitated by the 5-6-7 that showed up on eBay (too many - although there could be other reasons), the insert was different on most of the ones I saw, and the knowledge that many Pirate related things are and have been er ah "pirated".... Subsequently my friend forwarded an email from someone who said they were the head of XXX chapter of the clock dealers association; and that the clocks were modern creations. He also forwarded me an email from someone else (perhaps the seller"-)) who was sure they were a warehouse find. I bought it CHEAP - liked the graphics as it looks out from my shelf - and it went with my Pirate pack. I own three items I don't thing are what they are purported to be - Duke chair from major "tin" dealer that has a replaced pair of inserts - devil cigar holder that has Philips screws - and the clock. I hope the rest of what I own is real and trust that I have done the necessary homework to ascertain that it is. BUT........... |
#29
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Bob C
Interesting thread. What makes it intertesting is I thought all of the baseball player cards from this series showed packs "closed" on reverse while the others all showed "opened" packs. What makes Genos's post unique is his reverse shows closed pack and it is not a baseball player. Anyone have input/knowledge on this? |
#30
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Bob
I'd be in for 2 Pirate back baseball cards also. |
#31
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: mr. moses
for an extended period of time (non-sport ones) so it's no stretch that there are different back configurations. If there are implications to be made of MERIT relative to the BASEBALL ones, then I think one would have to see a good deal of examples, and until now at least the paucity of such cards in the market precludes that. |
#32
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: T206Collector
...what is the appropriate ACC designation for a Pirate Tobacco card? Is it T215? |
#33
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Steve Murray
11 spoken for so far. |
#34
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: leon
As long as the other 83 (baseball) Pirates cards stay under $10 each I will take the rest.....Seriously I would be in for 1-2.... |
#35
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Richard
I have done a little research on these cards and will post some scans tonight. |
#36
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Cobby33
I've always wondered about the T215 designation as well, given that there are already two issues (Red Cross Type I and II) with that designation- from a completely different manufacturer/region. |
#37
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Richard
Here are some scans: |
#38
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Scott Mosley
I wish I could add more about the clock but, like you, I just bought it because I saw it on eBay one day and thought it was pretty neat. I probably over paid a bit for it but it is still a neat looking piece. |
#39
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: scott hassel
Guess I was the guy with Henry that bought that Pirate card from Hager back in the early 90's. I have since bought 3 variations of packs and even found a rare round version tin that held 50 cigarettes. There are tons of fake large size cards around and calanders. Beware. Count me in for 2 of those cards. Min condition EX+. |
#40
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Bruce MacPherson
Steve, count me in for a card or two as well. Consider this the ultimate Net 54 cabal (if they all go in one lot). |
#41
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Steve Murray
Another member has emailed Doug who will only confirm that they have the cards and they will be in the Auction. Apparently they are at SGC now and look to grade vgex to exmt. |
#42
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Anonymous
The Clean Sweep trimmed Pirate card is at $7600 + juice with 21 days to go. WOW |
#43
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Cobby33
I sure hope Barry's prognosis is correct! |
#44
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: mr. moses
would be appreciated by a bald man. That couldn't be what you are referring to:-) If it's that they would lose some of their mystique I would think not. It seems that the pool of interested parties, the type collectors, or those with investor mentalities could easily absorb such a quantity....... |
#45
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Zach Rice
Here is the Tinker that was mentioned above: |
#46
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Cobby33
We'll see what Clean Sweep actually gets paid for it, with the rash of over-zealous bidders and the new hoard/find. |
#47
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Steve Murray
No Mention of the Pirates. |
#48
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Geno
I picked up some cool Pirate cards today, so I went back to review this thread as I remembered Richard's scans of the different backs. Here's a new one for you, although it isn't baseball on the front, but birds instead. Anyway, I thought it was kind of cool and added info to the thread...maybe I should have post it on the Non-Sports side to be more "correct," but it's nice to keep the thread all in one place! As you can tell by the little camera thing, it's an Ebay scan - I should have the cards in a few days... |
#49
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Pirate back Chinese card
Posted By: Bill Kasel
Definitely count me in for one if we are truly goig into this with that bidding strategy. |
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