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#51
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#52
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Nothing is "rare" or "collectible" about a laser printed art card.
Why use the name Helmar? They are not trying to pivot off the tobacco name? Asking for a fiend...(sic) Atrempt at Fraud plain and simple. I don't have to look at their website and claims, just the product and how it's marketed Sent from my SM-S918U using Tapatalk
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"Trolling Ebay right now" © Always looking for signed 1952 topps as well as variations and errors |
#53
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Feel free to point out any claim to fact that is false. Go ahead.
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#54
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Each card is generally scarce in that there are only a handful or so, as I understand it. Collectible? Seems that they are, in fact, collectible as they sell of pretty strong prices a lot of the time. I don't collect them, they aren't my thing, but again there is an actual reality in the world outside of what I like and don't like, and my opinions do not change definable reality. Considering they are putting ads for an imaginary Helmar Brewing product on the back, I'd say obviously not. You won't look at their claims or website, as you slander them with false claims of defrauding people, of course. |
#55
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I never said anything was false. I do absolutely love how you carefully pick what to answer and what to completely ignore in your responses.
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#56
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Put the pipe down dude. I think it is Time for your nap
Anyone can waste their money however they like. Deceiving people using a 100 year old tobacco name for 100 year old baseball players made weekly with limited runs and no date. Claiming they are using a "notable name" since helmer brewing won an award once and call it art. Unlicensed use of players and copying card designs. Maybe they are public domain, maybe it's illegal use. I'm sure st least ONE.person ONCE thought these were vintage Sent from my SM-S918U using Tapatalk
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"Trolling Ebay right now" © Always looking for signed 1952 topps as well as variations and errors |
#57
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OK did 1 second of research
This is being sold as a "t206" No date of production listed anywhere But it ain't a t206, just in the style of one. Good night Sent from my SM-S918U using Tapatalk
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"Trolling Ebay right now" © Always looking for signed 1952 topps as well as variations and errors |
#58
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I've never seen a complaint about somebody buying one. Just people complaining about why they wouldn't. Two opposite camps like everything else in the world. And yes I understand both sides, (I know that's rare)
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My Red Schoendienst collection- https://imageevent.com/lucas00/redsc...enstcollection My Baseball Snapshot Photo collection- https://imageevent.com/lucas00/snapshotcollection Original Type 1/Press photos etc for sale- https://imageevent.com/lucas00/photosforsale Last edited by Lucas00; 12-16-2023 at 07:48 PM. |
#59
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The tea stains rest their case.
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Want to buy or trade for T213-1 (Bob Rhoades) Other Louisiana issues T216 T215 T214 T213 Etc |
#60
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By this logic, every single maker of cards ever is intentionally deceiving people. Can we just think for 5 seconds before making ridiculous claims? |
#61
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Okay, if there's nothing false how am I wrong? I love how you make wild claims and can never defend them or come anywhere near an ascertainable fact.
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#62
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I don't want to get sucked into the debate too deeply as I see both sides (though I am firmly in the pro-Helmar camp), however I felt the need to clarify that yes they used to brew beer back in the early 2000's out of Michigan. They started as a beer and potato chip company and included cards in the packages of chips and used baseball images on the beer.
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#63
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& besides Beer, they made snacks too!
Here's an unopened bag that's on ebay (not mine) |
#64
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This might provide some clarification:
"Since 2005, Helmar Brewing Co., headquartered in the Detroit, Michigan area, has been owned by Charles Mandel. Helmar is an old brand name from the early 1900s. Mandel purchased the rights to the name, and for the past 18 years has included limited-production cards as premiums with purchases of micro-brew beer, potato chips, and snack items. A staff of 7 produces the cards, including Mandel himself, and 5 artists. The cards are produced using vintage printing, ink and art techniques. They are sought after by modern collectors due to their high-quality, and command high resale value. Banty Red Tobacco & Ale Co., operating out of Grayslake, Illinois, is under the ownership of Phil Apostle, a former collector turned manufacturer. Apostle sold a fortune in baseball cards and memorabilia in order to fulfill his dream of producing his own cards. After selling his own collection, he acquired an extensive collection of photographic negatives of ballplayers from the "golden era" of baseball. These cards are made by hand in very limited numbers, most only 1 or 2 cards each. With photographic imagery not found on any other cards, and in high quality, they sell immediately upon issue, often in the hundreds of dollars." There is no intent to deceive, at least as far a card production is concerned, even though they may be labeled as t206 or whatever; that just refers to the size of the cards for reference and comparison purposes to genuine vintage cards. Anyone with any knowledge of vintage cards will know that these are cards have never before been issued before. The ageing, rounded corners, and scuff marks are all in the spirit of making them look and feel old. But they are what they are. They fill a niche in the hobby; a way to get some old-looking cards without necessarily going to the poor house. I don't believe I have ever seen a graded example of even one of these cards. That's not what they are about, either. They are not for everyone. But if you are into old-time baseball, they can be quite interesting.
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James Ingram Successful net54 purchases from/trades with: Tere1071, Bocabirdman, 8thEastVB, GoldenAge50s, IronHorse2130, Kris19, G1911, dacubfan, sflayank, Smanzari, bocca001, eliminator, ejstel, lampertb, rjackson44, Jason19th, Cmvorce, CobbSpikedMe, Harliduck, donmuth, HercDriver, Huck, theshleps Completed 1962 Topps Completed 1969 Topps deckle edge Completed 1953 Bowman color & b/w *** Raw cards only, daddyo! *** |
#65
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Helmar was never a brewer, nor need they have much distribution if any in my knowledge. I live a couple miles from the home Helmar used as their business address and can say I never once saw any of these products. This is why you will never see either with a price tag. They were extremely limited marketing items to build the brand of cards, not the other way around. It is fine to like them, but disingenuous to represent as true history that this was the original distribution method. This has been discussed over the years very early on.
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- Justin D. Player collecting - Lance Parrish, Jim Davenport, John Norlander. Successful B/S/T with - Highstep74, Northviewcats, pencil1974, T2069bk, tjenkins, wilkiebaby11, baez578, Bocabirdman, maddux31, Leon, Just-Collect, bigfish, quinnsryche...and a whole bunch more, I stopped keeping track, lol. |
#66
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I think also some of the not made to deceive folks are relying a ton on current day (which I am happy and excepting of when dated) and not the numerous early Helmar designs and listing practices like the legendary Cap Anson Padlock threads that fooled quite a few on this site as I remember...
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- Justin D. Player collecting - Lance Parrish, Jim Davenport, John Norlander. Successful B/S/T with - Highstep74, Northviewcats, pencil1974, T2069bk, tjenkins, wilkiebaby11, baez578, Bocabirdman, maddux31, Leon, Just-Collect, bigfish, quinnsryche...and a whole bunch more, I stopped keeping track, lol. Last edited by JustinD; 12-18-2023 at 07:45 AM. |
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