Very Sad News in Happy Valley. Paterno's legacy appears to end in scandal

[WhenItWasAHobby]

The statue came down yesterday and in addition the NCAA levied a very stiff punishment including:

- Four year postseason ban
- 10 initial scholarship losses and 20 per year for four years
- $60 million fine
- All wins from 1998-2011 vacated
- Five year probationary period


http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaaf-...69--ncaaf.html

[barrysloate]

That is a very stiff penalty, but it was also a very brutal crime that was committed. I would say the penalty fit the crime.

[novakjr]

While all of this makes sense. I don't quite get the vacated wins..I know the NCAA wanted to take a crack at JoePa's win record(which is understandable), I honestly don't see the grounds for vacating the wins.. Sure, there was shady business all around, but nothing involving eligibility issues.

I don't have a horse in this race, but I'm just trying to stay objective here..

As much as the actions of Sandusky, JoePa and the rest of the governing body at PSU disgust me, I will still personally view JoePa as the record holder. Well, because he is.. Besides, it wasn't JoePa or the PSU officials that won those games, it was the players. Why should they be penalized here, just because it's the only thing that the NCAA can really do to JoePa. Maybe it's just me being anti-ncaa, but I think vacating the wins is a huge stretch for them. But then again, NO ONE will challenge this, because it's simply, just not that important, given everything else that has gone on...

And as far as the city of Grambling petitioning the NCAA to vacate the wins, just because they wanted their record back for Eddie, is F***ing disgusting..

[WhenItWasAHobby]

From what I read elsewhere, due to Paterno's vacated wins, Bobby Bowden is now the all-time leader in wins in Division I and Paterno drops to 17th in the all-time ranking.

[novakjr]

Originally Posted by WhenItWasAHobby

From what I read elsewhere, due to Paterno's vacated wins, Bobby Bowden is now the all-time leader in wins in Division I and Paterno drops to 17th in the all-time ranking.

Technically, I guess that would be correct. 45 of Robinson's wins at Grambling came before it was an accredited college..

[edhans]

Kudos to the NCAA and to the current administration at Penn State for doing the right thing. There are other institutions and individuals around the country that value the sanctity of their athletic programs above all else. A strong and unambiguous message was necessary, and it was delivered here. It's a shame, of course, that the current student athletes will have to suffer for sins which were nor theirs.

[drc]

I think the wins punishment is based on the theory that the coverup was done to protect the team and in the name of winning-- which it almost certainly was-- a thus a fitting punishment is to take take away wins.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by whenitwasahobby

- all wins from 1998-2011 vacated

stoo-pid

[drc]

In general I support taking away wins as punishment, because most of the NCAA football team crimes are done in the name of winning.

It's certainly true this instance is an unusual case. Usually wins are taken away when on the field players were ineligible-- a direct effect on the games.

[SetBuilder]

Penatly fits the crime? Really?

So the best thing to do is hurt the Penn State athletes who are now disgraced and have to transfer schools, plus all the athletes who lost scholarships?

To punish a dead man and a jailed convict?

Way to go NCAA. The most power hungry organization I've ever witnessed.

[drc]

Penn State had a ridiculous culture that favored football over academics, that put the football coach as the most revered and powerful person at the university. It's a good thing for the students that the shift will be back to academics. It's a university not a football team.

When a Penn State student applies to medical school, the medical schools are going to be interested in the academic rating of the school and not the number of football wins. The student's potential future employer won't care that Penn State went to the Cheetos Bowl. This idea that a good football team is beneficial to students is a myth-- and a silly one when you think about it. You may be shocked to learn that degrees from Cal Tech, Rice, Duke, NYU and Vanderbilt are considered highly desirable by grad schools and employers, even though the school's football teams are mostly horrible.

If someone cares about academics and education, he should be glad at the new focus. If someone wants the school to retain old Paterno football as center of power, he cares only about football.

Do you ever wonder why MIT doesn't have a Division I football team, even though they could easily afford one as they have a larger endowment than Penn State and Alabama put together? Because they feel their mission is *gasp* educating their students.

College athletics can be a good thing, going to your school's games is nice, but it is bad for the university and its students when football dominates the school as it did at Penn State. And at other schools.

[Lordstan]

David,
Sorry to correct you, but as an alum I can tell you NYU doesn't have a football team. As of my graduation year(1988), the only Division 1 sport they had was fencing. Go Violets!
I think it was the late 60's, or thereabouts, that NYU pretty much disassembled their entire sports program.

As far as PSU, they absolutely got what they deserved. Because of the culture of placing football above all, the administration and Paterno, cost those children their health and well being for the rest of their life.
I am fortunate that I have not had anyone in my family exposed or traumatized by sexual abuse, but I have many patients in my practice who have. Even 40-50 yrs later, they are still suffering the scars of the ordeal. Be happy that most of us have no idea what it's like.
The PSU admin and Paterno are lucky it's only money and wins they lost. If any of those kids were mine, I'm not sure what I would do.

The NCAA didn't hurt or disgrace all those athletes. The NCAA didn't cost them their scholarships. The former administration and Joe Paterno did. They did it by violating every trust we put in our educators to protect and improve the lives of our children. They did it because the revenue stream from the football program was so great, that those children were deemed reasonable sacrifices at the altar. By handing out this type of punishment, hopefully every school in the country will stand up and take notice.

Bobby Bowden and other coaches can stand up with righteous indignation all they want. They can come out and criticize what PSU did until they are blue in the face, BUT I think the reality is more likely that many other big programs would've done the same thing. Of course, nobody will ever admit this. It is too horrible to think anyone would jeopardize children in this way. Unfortunately, nobody thought Paterno would do it either.

[drc]

I know a guy who went to Cal Tech. He said they indeed had a football team while he was a student, but that doesn't mean was it a good one.

I read an article a few years back about the Cal Tech basketball team. Their tallest player was 6'3". They were losing by 30 and 40 points a game to Division III teams.

[midwaylandscaping]

never understood the vacated wins penalty in the NCAA but man what a sad and awful situation up there.

[Lordstan]

Upon further thought, I believe the NCAA enacted a vacated wins penalty for 2 main reasons.
1) Punishment for the school to put football above child safety. By school, I mean administration and, perhaps the most powerful man at PSU, Paterno.

2) The idea that if there had been a scandal in 1998, when the incidents first became known to the powers that be, perhaps many/some of the football players, who subsequently attended PSU, might've gone somewhere else. The controversy at the time certainly would've disrupted the season(s). Would they have won as many games? Perhaps. Perhaps not.

I think it's mostly the first reason, but I think both might've been considered.

To anyone who doesn't think the penalty is fair, I wonder what your reaction would've been if it had been your child molested.