1907-1910 Weiser Wonder - Walter Johnson PC, new to the hobby

Awesome PC Leon. Don't know what type of info you are looking for but I believe Johnson played for the Weiser Kids (1906-July 1907), 84 consecutive scoreless innings pitched in 1907. He worked for the local telephone/telegraph company in Weiser, Idaho.

The subject of the PC is interesting, sounds as though these two are cattlemen, one looking for work in Wyoming. Weiser is the last town up river from Hells Canyon and was a popular Ferry point across the Weiser River, which combines with the Snake. Today, the town is known as the "Fiddling Capital of the World", and has some great sturgeon fishing.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by pariah1107

Awesome PC Leon. Don't know what type of info you are looking for but I believe Johnson played for the Weiser Senators (1906-July 1907), 84 consecutive scoreless innings pitched in 1907. He worked for the local telephone/telegraph company in Weiser, Idaho.

The subject of the PC is interesting, sounds as though these two are cattlemen, one looking for work in Wyoming. Weiser is the last town up river from Hells Canyon and was a popular Ferry point across the Weiser River, which combines with the Snake. Today, the town is known as the "Fiddling Capital of the World", and has some great sturgeon fishing.

Thanks Ty...here is another scan of the back. The info I am interested in hearing about is why, when the dating of this has been discussed before, no one has ever mentioned the copyright date of 1907 on the front? I am not saying it was produced then but it certainly merits some thought if folks are trying to date it. If it IS 1907 it would make it one of, if not the, first Walter Johnson card. All that being said I very well might have missed someone pinpointing the date of it. This particular postcard was sent to the person's grandfather from whom I acquired it, according to them...and I have no reason to believe otherwise.

[caramelcard]

I go there every year for the fiddle festival. Pretty much everyone in town has a garage sale that week. I've found some pretty cool stuff, but not this PC which I have seen before and wouldn't mind running into. Or anything vintage WJ would be fine. Either way, it's a great little town and worth the long drive from Seattle.

I don't know about the dating of it, but maybe the photo dates to 1907, but the PC was made in 1910.

Rob

[Hankphenom]

How interesting. I had always thought this postcard was of later vintage, teens to perhaps even the 20s based on the relatively modern looking graphics. The copyright of 1907 is in the photo itself, though, the original of which was auctioned several years ago by a cousin of mine. It's possible the postcard could date from 1907, after his first partial season with Washington, but could also have been produced anytime between then and Nov 1910, according to this postmark. This could be his rookie card, which I guess is now considered to be the American Caramel card from 1908, although I could be mistaken about that. Great find, in any case. I had Walter's copy of this card at one time, from his scrapbooks.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Hankphenom

How interesting. I had always thought this postcard was of later vintage, teens to perhaps even the 20s based on the relatively modern looking graphics. The copyright of 1907 is in the photo itself, though, the original of which was auctioned several years ago by a cousin of mine. It's possible the postcard could date from 1907, after his first partial season with Washington, but could also have been produced anytime between then and Nov 1910, according to this postmark. This could be his rookie card, which I guess is now considered to be the American Caramel card from 1908, although I could be mistaken about that. Great find, in any case. I had Walter's copy of this card at one time, from his scrapbooks.

Thanks Hank. Yes, I saw the original cabinet that had the "1907" in it. I don't know all there is to know about copyright dates but I haven't seen anything to make me think this postcard wasn't printed earlier than 1910. I believe that sometimes copyright dates are in fact used as dating of items. Again, not trying to necessarily feather my own nest but it is interesting no one, I saw, ever bring up the date on the card itself. That was the main thrust of the initial post, as well as to show a really cool postcard .

[Hankphenom]

So the possible time frame is August, 1907 to November, 1910, with no evidence arguing in favor of any particular date within that period. Right?

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Hankphenom

So the possible time frame is August, 1907 to November, 1910, with no evidence arguing in favor of any particular date within that period. Right?

Hi Hank
Not being patronizing here but you probably know more than anyone about Walter Johnson. I don't have any info to dispute that span of dates you mentioned. I don't know why a company would produce a card AFTER the player left a team, rather than when he played for it, but it could be solely for publicity/advertising. Without other contradictory evidence I think there is reason to believe it was printed in the 1907 time frame. And as you mentioned, and can well be seen by the postmark, it couldn't have been printed after 1910. Here is another article sent to me by a nice board member...One other thing that makes this postcard a bit more interesting is that it is actually postmarked from Weiser, going to Boise. There seems to be a lot of info pertaining to Walter and those cities.

http://www.examiner.com/article/the-...walter-johnson

.
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Hope this helps Leon, here's an article on the 1906-07 season in Weiser. Sounds as though the fans in Weiser did not really warm-up to the young man until his phenomenal 1907 season (last game for them July 21, 1907). No references to "Weiser Wonder". I agree it would not make sense to promote a young man who had just left your town. Sounds as though they tried to bribe him to stay, offering him a cigar store downtown.

http://cwcfamily.org/wj/ww2.htm

[Vintageismygame]

My only comment is . . . where is the quarter at?

Matt

[Hankphenom]

Originally Posted by pariah1107

Hope this helps Leon, here's an article on the 1906-07 season in Weiser. Sounds as though the fans in Weiser did not really warm-up to the young man until his phenomenal 1907 season (last game for them July 21, 1907). No references to "Weiser Wonder". I agree it would not make sense to promote a young man who had just left your town. Sounds as though they tried to bribe him to stay, offering him a cigar store downtown.

http://cwcfamily.org/wj/ww2.htm

That's my article. Here's a link to the full piece, with intro, etc.
http://cwcfamily.org/wj/ww0.htm

As for the point about not promoting Johnson after he left town, I don't believe they would have been promoting him UNTIL he had left town and begun making a name for himself in Washington, at which point he would have become the biggest thing to ever come out of there and worth promoting. There's no doubt in my mind that this postcard was issued after Johnson had "made good," as they used to call it, in the American League. Of course, he did that almost immediately.

[Eric72]

For starters, I agree completely with those who think this is a great card. From what I have been able to determine thus far, it is most likely an extremely scarce issue. I have seen mention of no more than three known examples here, and would not dispute that number at this point in time.

I also thank those who weighed in with comments regarding my opinions on it (along with its newer, white-bordered counterpart) and hope that I am making a positive contribution to this conversation.

I fully understand that pinpointing exactly when it was issued has the potential to be quite important and, as a result, have been doing a bit more research on the topic. Along the way, I have found two things which piqued my interest. If anyone can shed more light on these, I would be most grateful.

First, according to an older listing by Sotheby’s, this card was produced in June of 1907. I am unsure as to how they deduced this and would like to know the board’s opinion here. Granted, this appears to be the same signed version which was later offered in Goodwin's 2010 auction; however, a link to the Sotheby's info appears below.

http://www.sothebys.com/en/catalogue...08385.html/98/

Also, I was looking through some old Net54 threads and found this:

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthr...=120189&page=2

I have reached out to the person who left post #20 and I am trying to gather more information on the photo posted there. If anyone else might be able to provide insight as to where it came from, it would be greatly appreciate it.

Thanks to all for reading through a long post. I sincerely hope I am not bothering anybody by trying to discover more about this tremendous postcard and attempting to ascertain, with greater certainty, when it was issued.

Best Regards,

Eric

[benchod]

Originally Posted by Leon

I don't know why a company would produce a card AFTER the player left a team, rather than when he played for it, but it could be solely for publicity/advertising.
.

So has your opinion changed on the Reccius Wagner?

Nice pickup and great postcard. Congrats

[packs]

There are a lot of sets with cards printed of players who no longer play for the team or even the league. The Mayo set features retired players, for example. Along with Play Ball and that strip set that has Mathewson in it long after he'd retired. I realize these aren't postcards though. But it would be a lot to brag about if you had Walter first, especially if you're an amateur team.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by benchod

So has your opinion changed on the Reccius Wagner?

Nice pickup and great postcard. Congrats

I don't remember my opinion on the Reccius, but unless I missed it, there was never a definitive date put onto the card. Without that it's hard to say. The dating of it is the key, obviously.

Thanks for the kind words on the pick up. Question for those more knowledgeable than myself. Where do you think this would end up price-wise, in a public auction?