Getting sick of the more obvious frauds

[cubsfan-budman]

Originally Posted by Shoele$$

Don't worry Gary, John knows exactly what the case was and his overall attitude about selling, don't let it fool you. I guess everything would have been all good had I been the dumb ass to offer to pay John $8-10K for his card right?

I guess I'll say everybody is thinking because I just don't give a $hit, basically what happened was I ask John if he wants to sell, he says "well I really don't have to sell"......"but if I do, IT'S NOT GONNA BE CHEAP".....translation turned out to be "sure if you're dumb enough to make me an offer for 2-3 times what I paid, I'll sell it".....well yeah! Of course! If everybody was a sucker and always paid 2-3 times for everything I owned, I'd be a sell everything I had too! Is it clear enough now?

yeah, its totally too bad that someone else made the money that you wanted to make. where's the justice!?!?

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by cubsfan-budman

yeah, its totally too bad that someone else made the money that you wanted to make. where's the justice!?!?

Who made what money?? What are you even talking about? You just like reading your own cool guy posts don't you? You're like the little kid that jumps in screaming "YEAH!!!" for no reason. Go back to whatever hole you crawled out from.....please.

[Leon]

Let me go ahead and draw this virtual line in the sand. Get back to the topic please.....or your post might be edited out. I think the fraud that Jeff is talking about is rampant and needs to be dealt with. As an auctioneer I could easily do photoshop and scanning tweaks to make things look better. Then I too would be a fraudster......but for me, it hurts my gut so I can't do it. Others, it doesn't seem to bother. They will reap what they sow.....

[wonkaticket]

Glenn not sure why I’m the bad guy here or why all of your hostility?

I’ve been offered way above what you offered for the card in question. I don’t need to sell because guess what….exactly that I don’t need to sell. The card is in my personal collection and I’m in no need to unload the item. Should I decide to sell this card why would I sell to you at less than what I paid for it or for that matter a slight perceived profit via your eyes. Last I checked hobby prices aren’t set by you.

I was very nice on your request and I was clear I would sell this card but need a serious offer. You failed to give a serious offer and I wasted none of your time or mine on back forth banter I said thanks but no thanks. It was you who continued the lecture and conversation as if to imply you had it figured all out and I’m just some dumb schmuck with some cards.

This has nothing to do with markets, trends/fads, you being a super successful business man, the rise and fall of T206’s, stock markets or unreasonable sellers.

You offered a number and a low one at that and I said no thanks very nicely for the record…that’s it.

Perhaps you can think about that next time you think the seller is the unreasonable one as coins do tend to have two sides that’s all I was saying.

John

P.S. Nobody was trying to take advantage of you. You made an offer and I rejected that offer. I never even gave you a counter offer or number so how is that attempting to take advantage of you?

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by wonkaticket

Glenn not sure why I’m the bad guy here or why all of your hostility?

I’ve been offered way above what you offered for the card in question. I don’t need to sell because guess what….exactly that I don’t need to sell. The card is in my personal collection and I’m in no need to unload the item.
Should I decide to sell this card why would I sell to you at less than what I paid for it or for that matter a slight perceived profit via your eyes. Last I checked hobby prices aren’t set by you.

I was very nice on your request and I was clear I would sell this card but need a serious offer. You failed to give a serious offer and I wasted none of your time or mine on back forth banter I said thanks but no thanks. It was you who continued the lecture and conversation as if to imply you had it figured all out and I’m just some dumb schmuck with some cards.

This has nothing to do with markets, trends/fads, you being a super successful business man, the rise and fall of T206’s, stock markets or unreasonable sellers.

You offered a number and a low one at that and I said no thanks very nicely for the record…that’s it.

Perhaps you can think about that next time you think the seller is the unreasonable one as coins do tend to have two sides that’s all I was saying.

John

Look John, here's the deal, first of all I bear no hostility to you, as my definition of "hostile" is a lot different than yours, believe me when I say that. Second of all if you had offers WAY above the almost $6,000 I last offered, you should have and already would sold it. Why don't you post a thread of those offers like you did mine?? Thirdly don't get defensive with me when it was YOU who decided to first air the dirty laundry, at that point it's fair game right? Sorry but I have very little tolerance for bull$hit to begin with as it is coming from a third generation mob family, it's ingrained in me.

Sounds to me like you're the one who feels like you got it all figured out right? Since now you wanna lecture me on what this is actually about. Explain to me why your word is now gospel? Sounds kinda hypocritical wouldn't ya say? But what do I know, I'm the dumb f*ck buyer who didnt pay you 3 times what your card is worth

Send me a PM if you'd like to continue.

[wonkaticket]

Originally Posted by Shoele$$

Second of all if you had offers WAY above the almost $6,000 I last offered, you should have and already would sold it.

You assume too much in terms sales motivation.

No need to PM any further I was done with any potential transaction/discussion last week when I said no thank you nicely. I’m not offering up anyone else’s PM’s because those people aren’t in here claiming that simply because someone didn’t accept their offer to buy something, is unreasonable or a new form of sodomy.

You failed to see my point, lets get back to bumped scans and tweaked listings or as I call it every catalog.

John

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by wonkaticket

You assume too much in terms sales motivation.

No need to PM any further I was done with any potential transaction/discussion last week when I said no thank you nicely. I’m not offering up anyone else’s PM’s because those people aren’t in here claiming that simply because someone didn’t accept their offer to buy something, is unreasonable or a new form of sodomy.

You failed to see my point, lets get back to bumped scans and tweaked listings or as I call it every catalog.

John

You're not offering up because they don't exist.....now I'm convinced you think I'm a gullible idiot, thanks!

If you had a point to make in the first place I'd see it. Shoulda sent the PM.

[bn2cardz]

Originally Posted by Shoele$$

You're not offering up because they don't exist.....now I'm convinced you think I'm a gullible idiot, thanks!

If you had a point to make in the first place I'd see it. Shoulda sent the PM.

Why, after Leon asked for an end to this, is this still going on?

If you want to PM someone do it, don't ask that they send you the PM. Is this how the mob handles things now days?

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by bn2cardz

Why, after Leon asked for an end to this, is this still going on?

If you want to PM someone do it, don't ask that they send you the PM. Is this how the mob handles things now days?

Ask John.....

Since you're now an expert on mob dealings why don't you answer it tough guy...be careful now, don't tread where you have no f*cking clue where you're going or what you're talking about. You're better off letting this one go.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by bn2cardz

Why, after Leon asked for an end to this, is this still going on?

If you want to PM someone do it, don't ask that they send you the PM. Is this how the mob handles things now days?

Thanks Andy. I don't like to be too heavy handed but at some point I will get us back on track of the original subject. When members keep doing it and their posts end up saying "edited" I guess they will understand what I meant. I know both of the guys arguing and both are good guys...albeit type A personalities. Let's get back to beating up the real fraudsters, the way it should be.

And I will make it easy for the 2 parties involved. If either of you post in this thread anymore, and it doesn't have to do with the original post, I will edit it's contents completely out. Trust me.

[drmondobueno]

Keith here. When I began expanding my (non) existent collection last year I became acutely aware of my inability to do a decent job of seeing true card quality. I quickly became aware of the ebay habit of misrepresentation through poor photo quality, omitting backs, poor lighting, tilted photos, and scans that mislead. In fact, I found I am terrible with a scanner when attempting to get true representations of my cards I wanted to post to the SGC Registry. Besides blurring (I use a lower end HP) I found creases had a tendency to disappear. My lack of confidence and unwillingness to mislead has actually stopped me from selling cards, for both the reason of possibly misleading someone and also limiting the potential sale price of a particular card. As to my ability to properly price a card, well..unh.. that's the rub, I guess.

Another thought. Last year I made an offer on a BIN, and after several back and forths, we came within fifty bucks on a 1600 card. The last time I looked the card as listed at the same BIN, has to be over 7 months now. Seems to me the seller could have turned over the money and reinvested in another piece of profitable merchandise. Guess this was my first taste of a seller with a different level of motivation than myself, or quite possibly a better undersanding of the card's value.

As for misleading and fraudulent sellers, scans of graded cards are just that; scans of graded cards. Any verbiage from the seller is just words. But what do I know, it can be scary buying a higher end t201 or t206. These particular examples leading into this thread are out of my league, so I sit, watch, listen, think. Keep it coming, guys, much appreciated.