A Summer Gift - and I am tired of looking - Honus Wagner

[steve B]

Wagners come with both factory 25 and factory 30 SC backs.

I'd be very surprised if the ratio of vertical to horizontal miscuts was 50/50. I hardly ever see a horizontal miscut.

I'd also hesitate to draw any solid conclusion about the eventual sheet layout from a proof strip. While it's possible, maybe even likely the order would be the same, it's not certain.

But it's a good start to looking for a partial Wagner. One will probably turn up eventually.

(I'd love a truly high res scan of the one recently showing a corner of another card at the bottom. If that corner isn't a Wagner it Just might be identifiable)

Steve B

[teetwoohsix]

I've often wondered if the Wagner test strip could give us a little insight into where he was placed on a sheet. I can't say for sure.

I think the best information we have to go off of is the information on T206Resource. Tim wrote a great article about it, and Chris put together a very believable possible sheet layout. The print groups play a significant role in putting together what we could assume a sheet may have looked like.

I have been doing a lot of research into the presses that the ALC were using and I'll save that for a later thread, when my research is done. I can say that I'm very confident that they were using many different types of presses; not just the 19x24.

And, take it for what it's worth- in the book "The Card" on page 79 it says that the Wagner had a red printer's line at the top of the card.

Sincerely, Clayton

[BigJJ]

Originally Posted by teetwoohsix

in the book "The Card" on page 79 it says that the Wagner had a red printer's line at the top of the card.

Thank you Clayton. Do you have the link to Tim's research for posting?

Also thanks for the above, will take a look. Red printers line is interesting.

[teetwoohsix]

Originally Posted by BigJJ

Thank you Clayton. Do you have the link to Tim's research for posting?

Also thanks for the above, will take a look. Red printers line is interesting.

Hi Jon,

Here's the link for you: http://t206resource.com/Article-T206...stique-34.html

Sincerely, Clayton

[BigJJ]

Thank you

[teetwoohsix]

Originally Posted by BigJJ

Thank you

You're welcome. I hope it helped-

Sincerely, Clayton

[BigJJ]

Originally Posted by steve B

Wagners come with both factory 25 and factory 30 SC backs.

I'd be very surprised if the ratio of vertical to horizontal miscuts was 50/50. I hardly ever see a horizontal miscut.

Steve,

Interesting.

I have never seen a Factory 30 Wagner. Do you know of a listing, or picture of one? Will amend the above after review.

Also, very good point regarding more vertical miscuts than horizontal. I will amend the above accordingly. What percentage vertical versus horizontal would you say there is? Important, as it would make a horizontal find that much more difficult.

Thanks Steve J

[terjung]

Originally Posted by BigJJ

Steve,

Interesting.

I have never seen a Factory 30 Wagner. Do you know of a listing, or picture of one? Will amend the above after review.

Also, very good point regarding more vertical miscuts than horizontal. I will amend the above accordingly. What percentage vertical versus horizontal would you say there is? Important, as it would make a horizontal find that much more difficult.

Thanks Steve J

The Wagner from Goodwin's auction last year was one example. I'll try to find a link.


ETA: It was this auction, but the photos are wrong for some reason... showing a Ruth RC instead of the Wags.
http://www.goodwinandco.com/LotDetai...entoryid=21264


ETA: Here is a link showing front and back scans of it.
http://www.net54baseball.com/showpos...06&postcount=4

[BigJJ]

Thank you Brian, will edit the above.

[BigJJ]

Based on the link provided above, with regard to the 2 name 1 card, compilation, both the Mordecai Brown (Portrait) and Bowerman are the bottom half of the sheet. Therefore, the Wagner likely was on the bottom half of the sheet.

THIS IS WHY WE DO NOT FIND ANY - "WAGNER, PITTSBURGH" - ON ANY OTHER CARD. IT IS BECAUSE THEY MAY NEVER HAVE EXISTED. Wagner was likely on the bottom.

Under this framework, the only possible partial vertical Wagner would be his head.

Now the question is, what card was above Honus.

Based on the good work of the above thread, we know Magee was above Brown (Portrait) and that Chance (color? either red or yellow) was above Bowerman.

If there is a horizontal miscut or misprint containing Magee or Chance, we might identify who the player was that bordered Wagner vertically.

[BigJJ]

Brown miscut showing the above Magee. Piedmont, 150 Series, Factory 25.
If the owner of the Bowerman/Chance, also would post a picture, front and back, it would be much appreciated.

[BigJJ]

The Bowerman/Chance is a Sweet Caporal 350.

Need a Sweet Caporal or Piedmont 150 vertical miscut of Bowerman.

The only Frank Chance that could have been in the 150 series was the red, not the yellow. So the only Frank Chance that could have been above Bowerman in the 150 series was Chance red.

We have evidence that Chance red was above Killian in the 150 series, from a double name 150 Piedmont card, have not seen photos of this card.

Taking this at face value, the card over Bowerman in the 150 series is either Chance red again, with their double printing Chance red in the initial 150 series. Or the card over Bowerman in the 150 series was replaced in the 350 series, likely with Chance yellow, the super card. If the card above Bowerman was replaced after the 150 series, the card over Bowerman in the 150 series, was likely a card ONLY printed in the 150 series.