Here We Go Again!!

steve B · #1 08-14-2013, 10:25 PM

It's an interesting fake, not quite good enough, but better than most.

The one they used as the source is labeled 4a here
http://t206resource.com/Wagner-Gallery.html

The graphics touchups are a bit slicker than usual, the upper left is added, and so is the stained/damaged area at the lower right.

And they used the same back scan, with another reconstructed corner. (Upper right)

The source is an odd choice. It's one of the few Wagners with a misregistration to the right. (Maybe the only one?) All that effort and they chose one of the more identifiable ones to work from.

Steve B

Runscott · #2 08-15-2013, 10:25 AM

Where do sellers come up with this bullshlt? I've seen this same exact line in many ebay scam listings:

As per ebay policy if not graded we must list as a reprint ..real or not.

kcohen · #3 08-15-2013, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Runscott

Where do sellers come up with this bullshlt? I've seen this same exact line in many ebay scam listings:

As per ebay policy if not graded we must list as a reprint ..real or not.

I haven't looked at Ebay rules in a long time. However, there is (was) a listing violation called "authenticity disclaimer." This is a textbook example of this transparently slimy listing practice. Obviously, there is no such Ebay policy.

thehoodedcoder · #4 08-15-2013, 10:21 PM

there is actually a policy on big name cards like this.

edit. i am looking for where i saw that. i definitely read that some where before and it specifically mentioned the wagner.

will let you know if i find it.

double edit. this in of itself should void the listing:
http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/...sclaimers.html

and then there is this which is not explicit...but basically says if it is not graded they can do what they want:
http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/autographs.html

kevin

EvilKing00 · #5 08-16-2013, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by steve B

It's an interesting fake, not quite good enough, but better than most.

The one they used as the source is labeled 4a here
http://t206resource.com/Wagner-Gallery.html

The graphics touchups are a bit slicker than usual, the upper left is added, and so is the stained/damaged area at the lower right.

And they used the same back scan, with another reconstructed corner. (Upper right)

The source is an odd choice. It's one of the few Wagners with a misregistration to the right. (Maybe the only one?) All that effort and they chose one of the more identifiable ones to work from.

Steve B

nice link steve, someone should send that info to ebay, these scammers need to be stopped

EvilKing00 · #6 08-16-2013, 06:25 PM

I sent the guy the link steve posted, he said he was removing the listing

nsaddict · #7 08-16-2013, 07:23 PM

Yup...the auction was ended. One bidder had a 10K max??

CaramelMan · #8 08-16-2013, 07:30 PM

I wonder why Wagner 25b psa2 does not have a MK designation when the date stamp is clearly visible on the back..all the cards that I have that have the same stamp, are called MK.....come on PSA

steve B · #9 08-16-2013, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaramelMan

I wonder why Wagner 25b psa2 does not have a MK designation when the date stamp is clearly visible on the back..all the cards that I have that have the same stamp, are called MK.....come on PSA

I don't use PSA, but as I understand it you can have cards graded with or without qualifiers. I think the deduction is usually about two grades.

So it could have been done as a 4MK or a straight 2. Personally I think it's closer to VG, but Wagners always seem to get a little bump in grade.

Steve B

slipk1068 · #10 08-17-2013, 03:18 PM

I accidentally posted this on the thread Connor912 started about the ending price of this auction. I think I will get better results if I post this here.

Could someone educate me about what makes this a fake? Is the only reason it is FOR SURE a fake is because it is not slabbed?

I saw this for one for sale about a week ago, and was considering bidding $100 for it. I thought the background looked a little too orange and not golden enough, and I was 99% sure it was a fake. Also, the dark brown outline around the card looks a little too washed. Still, I thought it was worth $100 to fill a hole in my collection (kinda like what we call filler).

I am just looking to learn. Please take a look at my link below and tell me why this card is fake other than the fact that it is too good to be true and not slabbed. Thanks.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1909-T206-Ho...vip=true&rt=nc

the 'stache · #11 08-17-2013, 04:46 PM

Hi Slipk,

There are certainly T206 experts here that will know more than I, as I have only recently started collecting "the Monster", and learning about it. But I have a few things to say, and I'll wait for some of the big guns on the forum to chime in.

First thing, never assume a card is real because it's been slabbed. Unless a card is in Beckett slab, always operate under the assumption that what you're looking at could be a fake. Thieves are counting on you making an assumption that a card slabbed by PSA or SGC is the real deal when they put a fake card in a fake slab, or a fake card in a real slab they've cracked. Always buy the card. Look it over carefully. If you have questions, ask your friends on Net 54. It's always better to ask then to buy something, only to find out later you've been burned.

When considering a card, I always compare it to a known legitimate example. This is what handwriting experts do when verifying the authenticity of a signature.

On the right is a good example from T206resource.com. The one in question is on the left.

The coloring on this one is all wrong. Look at the face on the fake. Also, look at the border surrounding the portrait. The real card has a black border. The fake has a brownish border. The card doesn't pass the smell test.

steve B · #12 08-16-2013, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EvilKing00

I sent the guy the link steve posted, he said he was removing the listing

That's a nice surprise. I hope the seller isn't out much if he also thought it might be real.

I wouldn't expect Ebay to be any help at all.

Back when I started Ebay I emaild them about a small lot of fake cards. Black and white Goudeys of Ruth and Gherig with machine cut corners, really obvious but listed as real. Their reply was A) Lazy and B) insulting. Basically they wouldn't look at other auctions of real cards that I sent links to, and gave the polite version of "who the __ are you to say they're fake"
I guess readily available links on their own site from someone with around (at the time) 25 years experience wasn't even worth a brief look.

I haven't bothered since.

Steve B