Joseph M Pankiewicz, you are a disgrace to this hobby!

the 'stache · #1 08-29-2013, 01:56 AM

The problem as I see it, gentlemen, is widespread indifference within the hobby. It's not just one or two sellers with questionable ethics, or a particular tpg accepting cards from these sellers, that should draw our ire here (though I am certainly not above cracking a bad egg or two publicly). There is an all-encompassing malaise that nurtures this kind of unethical behavior, and the biggest companies within the industry seem perfectly content to keep things the way they are. Topps, with it's exclusive rights to MLB licensing through 2020, is making money, even as the overall quality of their product has fallen off a cliff. Ebay is making money hand over fist. The tpgs are making their money, one cracked slab resubmission at a time. The auction houses are making their money. And these crooked sellers are making money, too. And while it is not easily proven, it is quite possible that at least some of these participants within the industry are acting in concert. But whatever their intentions, whether or not there is any collusion, their apathy is greatly detrimental to the hobby. Until these major players change their way of doing business, honest hobbyists will continue to suffer.

Look how long it took PSA to change their slabs. I returned to the baseball card hobby a little over three years ago, and it didn't take long after seeing my first graded card to discover how easily these cases could be cracked, leaving little to no evidence of chicanery. PSA continued to insist that their "tamper evident" slabs sufficiently deterred crooks, but the videos on Youtube showed otherwise. So, not only were collectors doling out huge sums of money for another person's expert opinion, now they had to worry about the very authenticity of the cards they were buying. I was horrified by PSA's indifference to the issue, as I'm sure many of you have been.

Knowing what we know, why would anybody want to get into our hobby for the first time? Kids aren't doing it, because companies like Topps, Donruss, and Upper Deck priced them out of the market. When I was a child, I'd get a couple bucks from my dad, go down to the local card shop, and buy some packs. Then, I'd come home, and trade with my friends. Kids can't afford to spend $100 on a box that has 10 cards inside. And if kids aren't getting into the hobby, they're not likely to invest in vintage or pre-war cards when they are older.

The hobby is saturated with the stench of greed, and crookedness. If we're ever going to see positive change, we need to band together, and exercise our buying power. Or, we'll just continue to get more of the same. More Josephs, and more tpgs not delivering what they promise.

doug.goodman · #2 08-29-2013, 04:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the 'stache

The problem as I see it, gentlemen, is widespread indifference within the hobby.

I agree.

Quote:

Originally Posted by the 'stache

But whatever their intentions, whether or not there is any collusion, their apathy is greatly detrimental to the hobby.

I agree.

Quote:

Originally Posted by the 'stache

Until these major players change their way of doing business, honest hobbyists will continue to suffer.

I respectfully disagree.

It's the honest hobbyists who need to change their ways. The major players who you speak of have no reason to change, because to them the "hobby" matters less than their bottom line.

If honest hobbyists were to stop paying money to the people who get paid for their opinions, many of the problems within the hobby would go away.

The advent of the "chase" card was the beginning of the end, that's when people started looking at packs of cards as lottery tickets, that's when prices started being paid based on the potential lottery winner in the pack.

Quote:

Originally Posted by the 'stache

... they're not likely to invest in vintage or pre-war cards ... The hobby is saturated with the stench of greed, and crookedness. If we're ever going to see positive change, we need to band together, and exercise our buying power.

The fact that you use the word "invest" illustrates why the "stench of greed, and crookedness" will always be with us, unless we follow your suggestion to "band together, and exercise our buying power" to NOT BUY lottery ticket items, be them cards or numbers on pieces of plastic.

But that will never happen, so my advice is to enjoy the part of the hobby that you enjoy, and do your best to ignore the rest of it.

Obviously, with this rant, I am failing miserably on that last part.

Happy hobbying,
Doug "I pretty much stopped buying new product in 1992" Goodman

ullmandds · #3 08-29-2013, 08:00 AM

je me souviens!

john.clowes · #4 08-29-2013, 09:32 AM

The competitiveness of the set registries over the past few years is driving a lot of folks to bend (or break or ignore) the rules, in my opinion. Folks are sitting on slabs, or perhaps buy new ones, but yet they watch their holdings get passed by in the standings on the registries. Pressure builds to crack slabs and do things to improve their positions. If the registries went away, perhaps the collective pressure to get to mint at all costs would be reduced to a more manageable level. My 2 cents that you got for free.

robw · #5 08-29-2013, 10:00 AM

Like with graded memorabilia, put an invisible stamp/id# only visible under blacklight, to the card....plus, the TPG's should have a scanned copy of all cards in their internal database. If a card is resubmitted with a stamp, they now can cross reference to see if card has been altered. I would gladly pay a few bucks more per card.

Rob

conor912 · #6 08-29-2013, 10:34 AM

The saddest part is that this will all soon fade from the front page and it will be back to business as usual for Joe and his cohorts.

botn · #7 08-29-2013, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by conor912

The saddest part is that this will all soon fade from the front page and it will be back to business as usual for Joe and his cohorts.

Exactly. Joe really did not have to reply. I think it hurt him more than it helped him. Despite evidence having been gathered very quickly on just a few cards, obviously there are many others, law enforcement will not do anything with this information and the hobby has memory problems and a very high tolerance for crap like this. Before this even fades from the first page I can assure you most people who have read and/or posted on the threads have already moved on.

If you look at the thread created by Joe, I think there are more OT and humorous posts than posts attributed to the topic. So Joe, if you are reading this, do not lose sleep over this thing.

ullmandds · #8 08-29-2013, 11:16 AM

Maybe there should be a section in the archive on this site that discusses suspect sellers/auction houses. Maybe a timeline of hobby indescretions over the last decade up to present...naming names...so users of this message board will have such info to help with future transactions?

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