Another Probstein LOL

[hangman62]

I have and will continue to bid and buy from Probstein .
Never had a single problem or issue
He gets his hands on loads of good stuff
prices are prices...bidding get carried away sometimes...if you dont like it then dont bid
Why must cry babys keep bringing up the same old sour grapes
You dont think the big auction houses " protect" their rare items in one way or another ?..good ole boys secretly bidding on their own stuff ?
The guys sells tons of stuff... he must be doing something right

Ralph G

[Rob D.]

I wonder if eBay had never shown bidders identities in the first place (email addresses in the early days, followed by user IDs), would people object now to not being able to see them? The reason I wonder is because I don't know of a single auction house in our hobby that shows bidder ids of any kind in its online auctions. Yet that doesn't seem to be an issue for most people, but the inability to see identities on eBay is.

[bobbyw8469]

I have yet to hear of a collector who was pleased to learn his item sells for 40% less than what he paid.

Happens all the time. Welcome to Ebay. I have actually lost more than 40% on items before. Nature of the beast when you run 99 cent auctions.

[drcy]

I should clarify. When I said everyone's going to Hell, I didn't mean me. I'm clean. Or at least I apologized profusely.

[Cardboard Junkie]

Originally Posted by drcy

I should clarify. When I said everyone's going to Hell, I didn't mean me. I'm clean. Or at least I apologized profusely.

Well, it's easier to ask for forgiveness, than to beg for permission.

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by hangman62

I have and will continue to bid and buy from Probstein .
Never had a single problem or issue
He gets his hands on loads of good stuff
prices are prices...bidding get carried away sometimes...if you dont like it then dont bid
Why must cry babys keep bringing up the same old sour grapes
You dont think the big auction houses " protect" their rare items in one way or another ?..good ole boys secretly bidding on their own stuff ?
The guys sells tons of stuff... he must be doing something right

Ralph G

I've seen some idiotic posts on Net 54 but this one might take the cake, right up there with San Quentin.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by hangman62

I have and will continue to bid and buy from Probstein .
Never had a single problem or issue
He gets his hands on loads of good stuff
prices are prices...bidding get carried away sometimes...if you dont like it then dont bid
Why must cry babys keep bringing up the same old sour grapes
You dont think the big auction houses " protect" their rare items in one way or another ?..good ole boys secretly bidding on their own stuff ?
The guys sells tons of stuff... he must be doing something right

Ralph G

Ralph gets it. Thanks for posting this, Ralph.

When my Mom would catch me with my hand in the cookie jar, I always argued that after she punished my sister, I was more than willing to submit to a similar punishment. Funny, I got my ass beat anyway.

Perhaps I should have used the argument that my Sister was fat and happy from all the stolen cookie calories, so she must be doing something right.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by hangman62

I have and will continue to bid and buy from Probstein .
Never had a single problem or issue
He gets his hands on loads of good stuff
prices are prices...bidding get carried away sometimes...if you dont like it then dont bid
Why must cry babys keep bringing up the same old sour grapes
You dont think the big auction houses " protect" their rare items in one way or another ?..good ole boys secretly bidding on their own stuff ?
The guys sells tons of stuff... he must be doing something right

Ralph G

Is this post a joke? Is it April fools day again?

1. He gets his hands on loads of stuff.- Well good for him. But it has nothing to do with what is being talked about.
2. Prices are prices- Most idiotic statement, in the context of this thread, that I have seen in a while. The problem is, prices we see aren't real prices, they are shilled. So, no, prices aren't prices.
3. Cry babys (sic) keep bringing up sour grapes. Yes, and each time a bank robber robs a bank, darn it, it makes the news again.
4. Big auctions protecting their rare items? Of course, it's called a reserve or a higher opening bid. Just like a consignor could tell Rick if he wanted to. That would be the moral and legal way to do it. And yes, there are a few hobbyists in a lot of hot water for doing it the wrong way.
5. The guy sells a ton of stuff, he must be doing something right. I think Rick is probably a very hard worker and is smart. A little more due diligence, when issues are brought to his attention, is all some of us are asking ie...ban bidders with a gazillion retractions and other issues. And maybe part of the reason he gets stuff is that the consignors know they can protect their consignments by shilling.


And I just want to make sure you are serious in believing what you wrote? It's hard for me to imagine anyone could really believe what you wrote. It's freaking crazy.


.

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by Leon

Is this post a joke? Is it April fools day again?

1. He gets his hands on loads of stuff.- Well good for him. But it has nothing to do with what is being talked about.
2. Prices are prices- Most idiotic statement, in the context of this thread, that I have seen in a while. The problem is, prices we see aren't real prices, they are shilled. So, no, prices aren't prices.
3. Cry babys (sic) keep bringing up sour grapes. Yes, and each time a bank robber robs a bank, darn it, it makes the news again.
4. Big auctions protecting their rare items? Of course, it's called a reserve or a higher opening bid. Just like a consignor could tell Rick if he wanted to. That would be the moral and legal way to do it. And yes, there are a few hobbyists in a lot of hot water for doing it the wrong way.
5. The guy sells a ton of stuff, he must be doing something right. I think Rick is probably a very hard worker and is smart. A little more due diligence, when issues are brought to his attention, is all some of us are asking ie...ban bidders with a gazillion retractions and other issues. And maybe part of the reason he gets stuff is that the consignors know they can protect their consignments by shilling.


And I just want to make sure you are serious in believing what you wrote? It's hard for me to imagine anyone could really believe what you wrote. It's freaking crazy.


.

Leon- I want to ask a stupid question, nothing to do with the majority of your post....How many people on this board, being 100% completely honest, have either engaged in shilling or had it done or their behalf? I'm just curious, be honest....I personally know of 2 fellow collectors (nameless) who told me they did in the hopes of getting higher prices for their cards....Would it be fair to say that this is a plague to our hobby?

[Leon]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

Leon- I want to ask a stupid question, nothing to do with the majority of your post....How many people on this board, being 100% completely honest, have either engaged in shilling or had it done or their behalf? I'm just curious, be honest....I personally know of 2 fellow collectors (nameless) who told me they did in the hopes of getting higher prices for their cards....Would it be fair to say that this is a plague to our hobby?

Shilling? I don't do it. I haven't asked anyone to bid on my stuff before either. Maybe that is the reason I lose money often when I sell? But to answer your question, yes I think it's prevalent and I think it's a big problem. I don't know if I would call it a plague?

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by Leon

Shilling? I don't do it. I haven't asked anyone to bid on my stuff before either. Maybe that is the reason I lose money often when I sell? But to answer your question, yes I think it's prevalent and I think it's a big problem. I don't know if I would call it a plague?

Me neither Leon, but trust me when I say, we are the minority, period......

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

Me neither Leon, but trust me when I say, we are the minority, period......

Kevin,

Please allow me to join the vocal minority, then.

I have not (and have never) shilled an auction. It's just plain wrong.

Best regards,

Eric

[4815162342]

I've never shilled, and never will. Have I been shilled? Probably.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

Leon- I want to ask a stupid question, nothing to do with the majority of your post....How many people on this board, being 100% completely honest, have either engaged in shilling or had it done or their behalf? I'm just curious, be honest....I personally know of 2 fellow collectors (nameless) who told me they did in the hopes of getting higher prices for their cards....Would it be fair to say that this is a plague to our hobby?

I have been buying/selling on ebay since 96 or 97 and I have never shilled any auction for myself or anyone else. I also have never retracted a single bid in that time.

As far as what Rick could do, I think he should have a 1 strike and you are out policy for anyone that shills there items he is selling.

[hangman62]

Wow,
I got myself smack dab in the middle of a good ole hootin and hollerin contest with dem thar Good Ole Boys !

Leon,

You ripped into my points pretty good ! LOL

Oh you forgot to comment on my first point -
Ive been bidding and will continue to bid on Probstein stuff ( and lets be honest..look at all the action/bidders on his stuff he gets thousands of bids...Im sure half the members of Net54 bid on his items..and they must be OK with it ?? ) .

I see you guys point ..all this talk of shills and questionable items...but for a long time fun loving lower grade cheapskate collector like me..... Who Cares !

Dont bid ... then maybe I can get that beat up T205 Cobb a bit cheaper

And that question that was raised by someone about shill bidding....come on guys..lets be honest.... Of the Thousands of members of net54.... I would say 50% have done some "type" of shill bidding at least once...

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by hangman62

Of the Thousands of members of net54.... I would say 50% have done some "type" of shill bidding at least once...

Ralph,

No, I have not engaged in shilling. Sorry to contribute to proving you wrong.

Best,

Eric

[drcy]

...

[CW]

Originally Posted by hangman62

I have and will continue to bid and buy from Probstein .
Never had a single problem or issue
He gets his hands on loads of good stuff
prices are prices...bidding get carried away sometimes...if you dont like it then dont bid
Why must cry babys keep bringing up the same old sour grapes
You dont think the big auction houses " protect" their rare items in one way or another ?..good ole boys secretly bidding on their own stuff ?
The guys sells tons of stuff... he must be doing something right

Ralph G

wow, this post has so much fail I don't even know where to begin!

[Sean1125]

Does anyone have suggestions to help?

Since some of you seem to think consigners are the only ones Rick listens to I will be happy to voice quality suggestions to him.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Sean1125

Does anyone have suggestions to help?

Since some of you seem to think consigners are the only ones Rick listens to I will be happy to voice quality suggestions to him.

Sean- Lets start with an easy one. Anyone with more than 7 bid retractions in the last year can't bid with him. Keep it simple, that is all I am asking.

Most good ebayers, of which I hope to include myself, haven't had that many in 10+ yrs. I think I might have had 1, in over 14 yrs, but honestly can't even remember that, specifically.

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by Leon

Sean- Lets start with an easy one. Anyone with more than 7 bid retractions in the last year can't bid with him. Keep it simple, that is all I am asking.

Most good ebayers, of which I hope to include myself, haven't had that many in 10+ yrs. I think I might have had 1, in over 14 yrs, but honestly can't even remember that, specifically.

+1, agree completely....

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by Sean1125

Does anyone have suggestions to help?

Since some of you seem to think consigners are the only ones Rick listens to I will be happy to voice quality suggestions to him.

Originally Posted by Leon

Sean- Lets start with an easy one. Anyone with more than 7 bid retractions in the last year can't bid with him. Keep it simple, that is all I am asking.

+1

Here's another easy one. If it's pointed out to Rick (which it has been) that certain consigners are shilling, then ban that individual from consigning or bidding with him in the future. How hard is that?

Sean, the next time you talk to Rick, ask him a simple question: "Why didn't you ban Joe P from future auctions when he was caught shill bidding over a year ago, and why haven't you banned him since as he's been caught doing it again?" I would love to hear his answer.

[markf31]

Originally Posted by Sean1125

Does anyone have suggestions to help?

Since some of you seem to think consigners are the only ones Rick listens to I will be happy to voice quality suggestions to him.

Originally Posted by Leon

Sean- Lets start with an easy one. Anyone with more than 7 bid retractions in the last year can't bid with him. Keep it simple, that is all I am asking.

Most good ebayers, of which I hope to include myself, haven't had that many in 10+ yrs. I think I might have had 1, in over 14 yrs, but honestly can't even remember that, specifically.

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

+1

Here's another easy one. If it's pointed out to Rick (which it has been) that certain consigners are shilling, then ban that individual from consigning or bidding with him in the future. How hard is that?

Sean, the next time you talk to Rick, ask him a simple question: "Why didn't you ban Joe P from future auctions when he was caught shill bidding over a year ago, and why haven't you banned him since as he's been caught doing it again?" I would love to hear his answer.

I would propose that Rick institute a rule in every one of his listings, that every bidder would agree to when they place a bid, something along the lines of:

No bidder with more than 2 bid retractions in the past 6 months is eligible to bid on this auction. Any bidder who wins an auction and has more than 2 bid retractions in the past 6 months will forfeit the auction. (this is to eliminate last second snipe bids that Rick would be unable to monitor and cancel prior to the end of the auction)

The item could then be re-listed.

Now if Rick is able to determine that the bidder(s) in these situations are shilling for the seller, he should return the card to the consignor and ban the bidder and consignor and refuse to do business with the consignor. Period.

I do not sell on Ebay, so what I propose may not even be possible. I'm pretty sure that sellers are allowed to insert their own binding bidding rules as long as they do not violate current Ebay policies. And I'm not sure how consignment sellers could handle the Ebay fees charged to them after the conclusion of an auction in such a situation. Would Ebay dismiss the fees under this situation since the "winner" violated one of the seller stpulated rules? or not? Since I don't sell I'm not sure of all of this, but its an idea that popped into my head.

[jhs5120]

I've hired an armed guard to make sure I don't over bid on auctions, I suggest posters here do the same. I can't help myself otherwise.

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by hangman62

...good ole boys secretly bidding on their own stuff ?

Just the good ol' boys
Never meanin' no harm
Beats all you never saw
Been in trouble with the law
Since they took it online

Screwin' with bids
Paddin' the sales
Someday the bidders
Might get 'em
But the law never will

Makin' their way
The only way they know how
That's just a little bit more
Than the law should allow

Just the good ol' boys
Wouldn't change if they could
Fixin' the system
Like a true Internet Auction Hood

[CMIZ5290]

Originally Posted by Eric72

Just the good ol' boys
Never meanin' no harm
Beats all you never saw
Been in trouble with the law
Since they took it online

Screwin' with bids
Paddin' the sales
Someday the bidders
Might get 'em
But the law never will

Makin' their way
The only way they know how
That's just a little bit more
Than the law should allow

Just the good ol' boys
Wouldn't change if they could
Fixin' the system
Like a true Internet Auction Hood

Damn Eric, I've got to ask, how long did it take you to write that??

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by CMIZ5290

Damn Eric, I've got to ask, how long did it take you to write that??

Kevin,

It took me just a moment. Please know that I do not have a horse in this race. I have never placed a bid with the auctioneers mentioned in this thread.

Best,

Eric

[Acollector]

Originally Posted by hangman62

I have and will continue to bid and buy from Probstein .
Never had a single problem or issue
He gets his hands on loads of good stuff
prices are prices...bidding get carried away sometimes...if you dont like it then dont bid
Why must cry babys keep bringing up the same old sour grapes
You dont think the big auction houses " protect" their rare items in one way or another ?..good ole boys secretly bidding on their own stuff ?
The guys sells tons of stuff... he must be doing something right

Ralph G

I'm sure a lot of people liked (insert any evil dictator through history) because none of their relatives were killed by him and they were able to get a job during his reign while disregarding some of that other stuff he was doing to others because it did not affect them. I guess with your logic, (Insert any evil dictator through history) was great and must have been doing something right since he was in power and plenty of people were cheering at his speeches, therefore what could go wrong? People like you enable criminals and help make them more successful while everyone else gets screwed over thanks to you.

Fraud is illegal regardless of whether it gets you a good price on what you want. Using your logic you would be ok with it if a car you were buying came to you at a good price because it was stolen from someone else as long as the price was a steal.

You most likely think we have an honest government running as well since they got elected, they must be doing something right. Keep being blind, it will bite you pretty hard one day.

It was reading posts like yours a few months ago that got me screwed over dealing with him.

[Seattle799]

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

[Stonepony]

Originally Posted by Seattle799

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

Well done!

[WhenItWasAHobby]

Originally Posted by Seattle799

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

Chiming in late, but thanks for that nugget of information. Very true.