Gone with the stain. Dick Towle

smokelessjoe · #1 03-26-2014, 12:34 PM

Question:

Say I spill red Kool aid on one of my wonderful T206s and stain the whole card red - three weeks later I make a new batch of red Kool Aid and discover that by removing the red dye (yet keep all chemical properties the same) and dumping it on the same card that I can remove the red stain... Essentially I have swapped one chemical for another or washed it with the same chemical.

Please note that at this time No One knows what Kool Aid will or will not do to the card as far as preservation or lack there of...

Would this be acceptable?

(I know Kool Aid jokes are coming)

Section103 · #2 03-26-2014, 12:41 PM

So the only difference between water and hydrogen peroxide is "one little oxygen atom"? Yeah, lets see the line of people willing to drink a glass of hydrogen peroxide.

T206Collector · #3 03-26-2014, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Section103

So the only difference between water and hydrogen peroxide is "one little oxygen atom"? Yeah, lets see the line of people willing to drink a glass of hydrogen peroxide.

If only baseball cards were made of living cells, this difference might matter.

Runscott · #4 03-26-2014, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by T206Collector

If only baseball cards were made of living cells, this difference might matter.

So, since they aren't, bleaching them with hydrogen peroxide is the same as soaking them in water?

I'm picturing two T206 collectors crawling through the desert, dying of thirst. They come upon a huge vat of hydrogen peroxide. The one who studied basket-weaving exclaims: "This is more water than we can possibly drink, and with all the extra oxygen, we should be able to jog out of this desert!!!"

To T206collector: This is all harmless fun. Please do not take offense, as I get what you are saying. I just don't think you chose a great example to support your argument.

Peter_Spaeth · #5 03-26-2014, 01:33 PM

Paul how do you feel about a trim that can't be detected by a grading company in their normal review process?

T206Collector · #6 03-26-2014, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Paul how do you feel about a trim that can't be detected by a grading company in their normal review process?

I appreciate the effort to find a slippery slope in my reasoning, but this isn't one of them.

A normal grading review that misses a trim is not the same thing. In any hypothetical where the fibers of the card are damaged by the treatment, I am on the side of the fence against the treatment. What I don't understand is why people build a fence between water and a chemical with the same properties of water when applied to a T206 card.

Stated another way, I think it is more intellectually honest to be against water and all chemicals, than to segregate water from the list of unmentionables.

wonkaticket · #7 03-26-2014, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by T206Collector

What I don't understand is why people build a fence between water and a chemical with the same properties of water when applied to a T206 card.

What chemical is being used that has the exact same properties of water? Did I miss something in this thread?

For me the line is easy the day a glass of tap water can make stains like these disappear, and the day items like this are sold with disclosure about the cleaning undergone be sure to let me know.

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=132902

Otherwise you are doing something to alter the appearance of the card found and therefore increasing its value with secrecy which to me is not on the up and up. Also if our hobby was so excepting of this it would be disclosed all the time hmmm I wonder why it's never mentioned in auction write ups?

Just because one may spread icing on a turd doesn�t make it chocolate cake in my book regardless if I can taste the difference or not.

Cheers,

John

DoctorK · #8 03-27-2014, 10:43 AM

I have not read the entire thread but have a hypothetical question:

When given the choice between two similar condition cards and you know one has been treated, cleaned, stain removed (whatever you want to call it)---Which one do you choose?

chernieto · #9 03-26-2014, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Runscott

So, since they aren't, bleaching them with hydrogen peroxide is the same as soaking them in water?

I'm picturing two T206 collectors crawling through the desert, dying of thirst. They come upon a huge vat of hydrogen peroxide. The one who studied basket-weaving exclaims: "This is more water than we can possibly drink, and with all the extra oxygen, we should be able to jog out of this desert!!!"

To T206collector: This is all harmless fun. Please do not take offense, as I get what you are saying. I just don't think you chose a great example to support your argument.

I'm imagining 2 T206 collectors at a estate sale and they find an old album with amazing T206 collection of HOF cards glued in the album. One wants to buy it and remove the cards from the album pages- and the other says "you can't do that! It will destroy the hobby! It's evil & illicit to do that and I will never sleep again!!"
Paul C

T206Collector · #10 03-26-2014, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Runscott

So, since they aren't, bleaching them with hydrogen peroxide is the same as soaking them in water?

To T206collector: This is all harmless fun. Please do not take offense, as I get what you are saying. I just don't think you chose a great example to support your argument.

I thought you understood that I was using a hypothetical, not that I was countenancing the use of hydrogen peroxide on a tobacco card. I have no idea what the interaction would be -- and severe damage or bleaching may certainly result.

I take no offense, and I don't mind the fun, but I do think it is critical to get at the heart of what people expect from their 100+ year old cardboard.

Runscott · #11 03-26-2014, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by T206Collector

I thought you understood that I was using a hypothetical, not that I was countenancing the use of hydrogen peroxide on a tobacco card. I have no idea what the interaction would be -- and severe damage or bleaching may certainly result.

I take no offense, and I don't mind the fun, but I do think it is critical to get at the heart of what people expect from their 100+ year old cardboard.

I did understand, but you definitely should have an idea as to what the interaction would be; if not, then it's hard to take you seriously when you are talking about chemicals and their effects.

T206Collector · #12 03-26-2014, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Runscott

I did understand, but you definitely should have an idea as to what the interaction would be; if not, then it's hard to take you seriously when you are talking about chemicals and their effects.

Actually, I am pretty sure you got sidetracked by the actual effects of H202 on a piece of cardboard, which is wholly irrelevant to what anyone was saying in this thread.

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