Bob Feller - Is he a top tier Hall of Famer?

[bosoxfan]

Originally Posted by slipk1068

Can't argue with putting him on the list. I just consider him a half a step below. To me elite means:
Cobb
Speaker
Wagner
Lajoie
Johnson
Mathewson
Alexander
Hornsby
Ruth
Foxx
Williams

Add Feller and you also must consider Spahn, Carlton, and Seaver. Maybe Dizzy Dean? and what about Willie Mays. All a half a step below my elite list except maybe Willie Mays.

I think we're talking pre war but, Seaver and Carlton a half step below? WOW

[Hankphenom]

All depends on the definition of top-tier. Because of the prime years lost to war service and his overall profile of dominance in his time, he's in my top 15 all-time great pitchers, maybe closer to 10 than 15. That makes him a top 50 player, IMO, and that's a truly elite group.

As for his personality, I had several "encounters" with Feller, and you can put me down in the not-a-fan camp. I do like the fact, however, that in every interview I've seen where he was asked whether he thought he was the fastest pitcher ever, he says without hesitation that he thought that Walter Johnson had to be the fastest ever, and also the greatest pitcher ever. You have to feel a little sorry for the guy coming into the league just a few years after Johnson left, and having everyone who had seen both of them say how great he was but that he wasn't as fast, or as good, as Johnson. It had to bother the heck out of him.

And I agree with those who find no excuse for his grumpiness. The guy had a fabulous life, and even if he hadn't, it's no more trouble to be kind than to be unpleasant. My personal observation from seeing him up close several times is that he had a huge ego, and I think being able to be gruff and cranky and getting away with it was his way of proving what a great man he was.

[the 'stache]

Originally Posted by bosoxfan

I think we're talking pre war but, Seaver and Carlton a half step below? WOW

Ya, and what about Sandy Koufax and Bob Gibson? Koufax, in his prime was, in my opinion, the second best pitcher ever behind Johnson.

The last five seasons of his career, Koufax was 111-34 (.766 win percentage!) with a 1.95 ERA, 33 shutouts, 1,444 Ks vs 316 BB in 1,377 IP. He allowed 6.3 hits per nine innings, and compiled a 0.926 WHIP. That's downright obscene for a modern pitcher, regardless of how high the mound was.

I'd also add Pedro Martinez and Greg Maddux to that top tier of Hall of Famers (once Pedro gets in, obviously).

[the 'stache]

Jesus, Pedro's 7 year peak from 1997 to 2003: 118-36 (again, .766 WP), with a 2.20 ERA, 11 shutouts, 1,761 Ks vs 315 BB in 1,408 IP. He allowed 6.4 hits per 9 IP, and compiled a 0.940 WHIP.

He won 3 Cy Young Awards (he also finished second in the Cy Young twice, and third once. He wasn't in the top 3 only once, because he only started 18 games in 2001), led his league in ERA five times (once in the NL when he played for Montreal, the others in Boston).

Greg Maddux, in his 7 year peak from 1992 to 1998: 127-53 (.706 WP), with a 2.15 ERA, 19 shutouts, 1,286 Ks vs 269 BB in 1,675 IP. He allowed 7.3 hits per 9 IP, and compiled a 0.968 WHIP. That 1.4 BB per 9 IP is just too good.

And Greg won 4 consecutive Cy Youngs.

Can Greg Maddux be a top tier Hall of Famer now? 355-27 career (.610 WP), 3.16 ERA, 35 shutouts, 3,371 Ks against 999 BB in 5,008.1 IP.

4 Cy Youngs, 18 Gold Glove Awards. He's eighth all-time in wins. He never struck out 200 hitters in a season. He did it with control.

Please tell me these guys are top tier.