Golden Era Hall of Fame Ballot announced

[kailes2872]

I like Tony Olivia - Pedro on the 63 Topps Card, #1 in your heart.

He was really nice to me at an old timers game in 1984 in Indianapolis. This was before the Colts came and they were finding ways to utilize the (then) Hoosier Dome so that the taxpayers didn't start banging fists on the table about the costs.

I was a 12 year old kid nuts about baseball history and was in heaven at a game that had Aaron, Mays and a ton of others. I walked out that night with my ball signed by Tony, Brooks Robinson, and Monte Irvin. I did a bunch of research after that and grew an apprciation for him. He was a crazy good hitter and looked to fade out quickly - was he injured?

In the if x is in, then y should be in, I use Ross Youngs and Wes Ferrell as X. therefore, be ready for Chris Sabo's inevitable induction.

[h2oya311]

Originally Posted by kailes2872

In the if x is in, then y should be in, I use Ross Youngs and Wes Ferrell as X. therefore, be ready for Chris Sabo's inevitable induction.

I like the logic, but it's flawed. Wes isn't in the HOF, but his brother, Rick, is. Hopefully there are only 1 or 2 inductees...my checkbook has taken a beating!

[packs]

I really do think Wes Ferrell deserves more credit than he gets. His ERA is ugly but its inflated by a few too many years trying to hold on to his career.

Over an 8 year stretch he won 20 games 6 times including 4 in a row. HIs 1935 season was one of the best ever for a pitcher. Led the league in wins and hit 347 with 7 homers and 32 RBIs. Unheard of for a pitcher.

But not a HOFer.

[Batter67up]

GIL Hodges

Hodges led all major-league first basemen of the 1950s in the following categories: home runs (310), games (1,477), at bats (5,313), runs (890), hits (1,491), runs batted in (1,001), total bases (2,733), strikeouts (882), and extra-base hits (585). He made the All-Star team eight times, every year from 1949-55 and again in 1957, the most of any first baseman of the time. In addition, Hodges won Gold Gloves the first three years they were given out (1957-59) and was considered the finest defensive first baseman of the era. Also, he was second among all players in the 1950s in home runs and RBIs, third in total bases and eighth in runs.

[Exhibitman]

That would make a very respectable-reading HOF plaque.

[Baseball Rarities]

Originally Posted by Batter67up

GIL Hodges

Hodges led all major-league first basemen of the 1950s in the following categories: home runs (310), games (1,477), at bats (5,313), runs (890), hits (1,491), runs batted in (1,001), total bases (2,733), strikeouts (882), and extra-base hits (585). He made the All-Star team eight times, every year from 1949-55 and again in 1957, the most of any first baseman of the time. In addition, Hodges won Gold Gloves the first three years they were given out (1957-59) and was considered the finest defensive first baseman of the era. Also, he was second among all players in the 1950s in home runs and RBIs, third in total bases and eighth in runs.

I also think Hodges should be strongly considered for the Hall of Fame. Anyone who dominates his position (perennial all-star) for a 10 to 12 year span should be given serious consideration. This is why I agreed with putting Jim Rice in the Hall of Fame. It is also why I think that Steve Garvey is a borderline HOFer also. His stats (besides home runs) from 1974-83 are very similar to Hodges' 10 year stats that were posted above.

Games 1,499 - 1,477
Home Runs 200 - 310
At Bats 5,967 - 5,313
Runs 820 - 890
Hits 1820 - 1,491
RBI 939 - 1,001
Total Bases 2,785 - 2,733
Extra-Base Hits 536 - 585
All-Star Teams 8 - 8
Gold Gloves 4 - 3 (Hodges was a superior fielder)

Plus, Garvey won an MVP while he finished in the top 6 in MVP voting 5 times in a 7 year span. That is pretty impressive.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Garvey doesn't look so good according to the new wave stats. His "JAWS" rating places him only a remarkable 47th among first basemen. Part of the issue I think is that his on base percentage was not much higher than his BA because he rarely walked. For someone with 6 200 hit seasons (or was it more?) to rate this low is baffling.

[Baseball Rarities]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Garvey doesn't look so good according to the new wave stats. His "JAWS" rating places him only a remarkable 47th among first basemen. Part of the issue I think is that his on base percentage was not much higher than his BA because he rarely walked. For someone with 6 200 hit seasons (or was it more?) to rate this low is baffling.

Yeah, his stats do not stack up very well to modern metrics. I just think that it is pretty special when a player was considered the best at his position for a 10 to 12 year span. His MVP voting was pretty good too.

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by Baseball Rarities

I also think Hodges should be strongly considered for the Hall of Fame. Anyone who dominates his position (perennial all-star) for a 10 to 12 year span should be given serious consideration. This is why I agreed with putting Jim Rice in the Hall of Fame. It is also why I think that Steve Garvey is a borderline HOFer also. His stats (besides home runs) from 1974-83 are very similar to Hodges' 10 year stats that were posted above.

Games 1,499 - 1,477
Home Runs 200 - 310
At Bats 5,967 - 5,313
Runs 820 - 890
Hits 1820 - 1,491
RBI 939 - 1,001
Total Bases 2,785 - 2,733
Extra-Base Hits 536 - 585
All-Star Teams 8 - 8
Gold Gloves 4 - 3 (Hodges was a superior fielder)

Plus, Garvey won an MVP while he finished in the top 6 in MVP voting 5 times in a 7 year span. That is pretty impressive.

This is my thinking exactly, including the comments about Garvey and Hodges. If a player dominates his era he deserves induction to the HOF because comparing stats over decades is simply unfair. Rice deserved to be in as probably does Garvey and certainly Hodges. Was Don Sutton a more dominant player of his era or did he just play longer than many others? If Tommy John won a few more games he would have had 300 -- and easily been inducted. It's silly to have bright line cutoffs on stats and not simply determine if the player dominated when he played.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by calvindog

This is my thinking exactly, including the comments about Garvey and Hodges. If a player dominates his era he deserves induction to the HOF because comparing stats over decades is simply unfair. Rice deserved to be in as probably does Garvey and certainly Hodges. Was Don Sutton a more dominant player of his era or did he just play longer than many others? If Tommy John won a few more games he would have had 300 -- and easily been inducted. It's silly to have bright line cutoffs on stats and not simply determine if the player dominated when he played.

How did Steve Garvey "dominate" his era? He won no batting titles, no HR or RBI titles, never led the league in doubles. Not to say he was not a great player, but dominant seems overstating it.

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by packs

HIs 1935 season was one of the best ever for a pitcher. Led the league in wins and hit 347 with 7 homers and 32 RBIs. Unheard of for a pitcher.

Not to be too harsh but...man, that is REALLY exaggerating things. You want to make the case for it being the best offensive season by a pitcher? Go for it. But all around best season? Not a chance. You gotta do better than 7th in your league in ERA for that.

Ferrell actually hit 9 HRs one year (1931). .319/9/30. Heckuva year.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Notwithstanding those 50s numbers, the stats don't seem to treat him well, which surprised me.

Hall Of Fame StatisticsPlayer rank in (·)


Black Ink Batting - 2 (619), Average HOFer ≈ 27

Gray Ink Batting - 128 (140), Average HOFer ≈ 144

Hall of Fame Monitor Batting - 83 (227), Likely HOFer ≈ 100

Hall of Fame Standards Batting - 32 (272), Average HOFer ≈ 50

JAWS First Base (34th), 44.9 career WAR/34.2 7yr-peak WAR/39.6 JAWS
Average HOF 1B (out of 19) = 65.9 career WAR/42.4 7yr-peak WAR/54.2 JAWS

[kailes2872]

Originally Posted by h2oya311

I like the logic, but it's flawed. Wes isn't in the HOF, but his brother, Rick, is. Hopefully there are only 1 or 2 inductees...my checkbook has taken a beating!

Google is my friend! I couldn't remember which one and flipped a coin versus taking 10 seconds to look it up!