Opinions on this Babe Ruth auto

[Pickles]

David
Feel free to sue statistics ay way you choose, most people do
Fact is I will go to my grave not knowing if the signature is 100% authentic
I was pretty much there with the ball authenticity, and my ??? was whether Ruth was a "clubhouse" or not. A somewhat simpler problem to solve in my minds, as a good forgery is likely to have the basic characteristics of the original, but a clubhouse has specific "features" which may not be common and which I was trying to identify. I was looking for specifics matches to a "known" good signature, and trying to maximize the "matches" This is why I paid attention to the horizontal, the straight b, t, the epsilon e, the loops and teardrops etc. Not trying to prove A= Truth, but basically following the "zeroth Law of Thermodynamics" (If A=B and B=C, then A=C) so my work was not to establish he entire spectrum of Ruth, just the 1929.
As luck has it, there is a lot of common details on bigtrain, which, also helps me "zero in" on the "thin" areas of mine, so i do get some benefit from evaluating the better signature. If you have the time, pls compare one to the other and you will see a high degree of correlation.

I'll save the confidence level for a future date, suffice to say I like to use a Weibull distribution with different weigh factors for experts and non experts (hence JSA, PSA get a higher weigh) but, it is very helpful to have an extra dozen knowledgeable people contribute. After all, the future liquidity market will not be driven by "truth", but by the perception of the truth. If everyone believes an outcome to be the truth, it will become the truth....

As you may know by now, it is hard to find 2 PhDs to agree on anything, and, when they do, thy will agree for different reasons, just the nature of the beast.

[Pickles]

Originally Posted by Pickles

David
Feel free to sue statistics ay way you choose, most people do

Sorry USE not sue. A Freudian slip....

[w7imel]

Bernie your Ruth was not clubhouse! If it was JSA or PSA would have noticed! and on top of that Dave would have told you by now! Ruth clubhouses for companies like JSA and PSA are not hard to spot. What are you so hung up on this ball? Again it is not the only 29 yanks team ball in existance.

[Pickles]

Originally Posted by w7imel

Bernie your Ruth was not clubhouse! If it was JSA or PSA would have noticed! and on top of that Dave would have told you by now! Ruth clubhouses for companies like JSA and PSA are not hard to spot. What are you so hung up on this ball? Again it is not the only 29 yanks team ball in existance.

Simple answer: I like it.
What I am describing is the process I used to get comfortable with it's authenticity. What I suggested was to compare these as they were very similar. I bought the ball to have in my collection, but also I study it and analyze it to get "dividends" out of the investment.

I still have not solved Koenig's sig. Both Gutierrez and JSA say it is there. I can not find it. I have enjoyed deciphering the other sigs, though

[w7imel]

Any other opinions on the Ruth ball in question? Would like to know what the more experienced thought of it.

[Runscott]

A few points:

• If it looks like a Ruth, then it will get a COA from both PSA and JSA. A good forger will be able to make it 'look' like Ruth's signature. So what is the point of sending it in, other than for re-sell?
• If it looks like a Ruth but is not, it is not 'clubhouse', it is a forgery. PSA and JSA both seem to be good at spotting Ruth clubhouse sigs, not so good with Mantle.
• If it is a bad forgery, PSA and/or JSA might catch it. If this is a forgery, it isn't a bad one, so expect it to pass both.
• To new guys: tone down your expectations of what "civilized" behavior is - this is the autograph sub-forum. There are no pedestals in here and some people don't wear their gloves.

I wouldn't buy this baseball - it doesn't have the characteristics I look for, and it has some of the ones I avoid, such as shellac and a bold signature that, to put diplomatically, certainly does not look rushed. That doesn't mean it isn't good.

[Pickles]

Originally Posted by Runscott;1359738[LIST

[*]If it looks like a Ruth, then it will get a COA from both PSA and JSA. A good forger will be able to make it 'look' like Ruth's signature. So what is the point of sending it in, other than for re-sell?[/LIST]

Ok, one point at a time:

So in essence, your conclusion is PSA and JSA are not able to screen out a good forgery (not the first time I hear this comment BTW, just re stating)

Having seen some TPA Ruth's which I would not be comfortable owning, I can not argue with the conclusion you reach

This forum can be a help to others if doubts exist. It remains to be seen how much more effective the forum's "forger filter" can be if it has go past PSA/JSA, but I have seen a PSA which the forum rejected with ease so it can work

[Pickles]

[QUOTE=Runscott;1359738]A few points:

• To new guys: tone down your expectations of what "civilized" behavior is - this is the autograph sub-forum. There are no pedestals in here and some people don't wear their gloves.

If you refer to my post (which I am sure you did) I can take it and deal with it, you and I can have an intelligent conversation and have done so, without having to get personal. I appreciate that

When someone gets a bit personal, and sarcastic, I find it appropriate to put them back in their place. I do not expect church like behavior here, but I think all readers benefit from some professionalism in the discussion. Agree with the no pedestals, will fight with no gloves. Personal attacks/innuendos not acceptable to me. Other than that, I'm good.