Ruth and Gehrig Balls - Authentic?

[thetruthisoutthere]

Originally Posted by VAYankee

Here's an update from the Broker. Looks like they really wanted a sale today.

"Tried to call you before I left for the evening. Seems we are getting nowhere trading emails. Want to see what it’s going to take, if anything humanly possible, to get you some of these bb’s you are missing out on, so you can start your own amazing collection, rather than admiring from afar.

Quite honestly, with the documented chain of command of ownership of these bb’s it is even more assured these are genuine signatures, than even professional 3rd party examiners who are rendering educated guesses after the fact."

And the broker is...............?

[VAYankee]

Joe DiMaggio Estate

[thetruthisoutthere]

Originally Posted by VAYankee

Joe DiMaggio Estate

That says it all.

[RichardSimon]

You just have to shake your head in wonder.
Brokers, hard sell salesman, COA's from the dead, guys with money to burn and no clue (not referring to you OP), what has this hobby come to?
It is repulsive and sickening.
Poor Joe DiMaggio. First a crooked authenticator uses his name and now this.
What a friggin' mess this is.

[VAYankee]

In one of my posts yesterday, I said these guys at JDE offered me a Gehrig ball back in December, which I didn't pull the trigger on. Went back-and-forth and frankly the whole thing fell apart when they couldn't produce the PSA/DNA cert they had advertised accompanied the ball. I was told I was being difficult, the name JDE was never a problem before, PSA/DNA virtually always certifies autos for which they've provided a quickie cert, blah, blah, blah...

Well, after further research this time when they came calling for the Ruth ball, as well as what I've learned here from you all in just a short period of time, I'm so glad I did not purchase that ball either. They actually fried their own goose with me a little more, before I had even posted here, because in the conversation around the Ruth ball, I had learned they had sold the Gehrig ball. My last conversation with them ended with JDE agreeing to send the ball to PSA/DNA for full certification, eating the cost and me agreeing to buy the ball if the cert came back clean and I still wanted it. I bet I still have the voicemail from them on my cell. When I said something to them about this, they said another buyer had come along willing to pay full price and not needing any add'l assurances the ball was real. Price this other guy paid was presumably just under $5k - unless they just took what they could get from CCA.

Here is a picture of the ball. I can only imagine the thoughts going through some of your heads as I write this....admittedly, at the time, I thought the sig looked fake when I first looked at it, but was willing to believe it was real if a reputable cert was provided....I know better now. Thanks.

[David Atkatz]

To be quite frank, if what you say is true, and you are really interested in becoming a collector of these relatively high-end pieces, then the amount of work you have to do is staggering. You show some of the worst, most blatant forgeries--balls that even a relative newcomer wouldn't give more than a glance before dismissing--and then pat yourself on the back because after much soul-searching you didn't buy them.

No one here can provide the education you so sorely need. Start by looking at old auction catalogs from reputable houses, and see how Ruth/Gehrig signatures actually look. Look at the Heritage Auction archives. Look at--and study--as many as you can. And spend time--a lot of time--doing so.

Then you might be ready to begin to talk to the people here.

[VAYankee]

Originally Posted by David Atkatz

To be quite frank, if what you say is true, and you are really interested in becoming a collector of these relatively high-end pieces, then the amount of work you have to do is staggering. You show some of the worst, most blatant forgeries--balls that even a relative newcomer wouldn't give more than a glance before dismissing--and then pat yourself on the back because after much soul-searching you didn't buy them.

No one here can provide the education you so sorely need. Start by looking at old auction catalogs from reputable houses, and see how Ruth/Gehrig signatures actually look. Look at the Heritage Auction archives. Look at--and study--as many as you can. And spend time--a lot of time--doing so.

Then you might be ready to begin to talk to the people here.

Not sure I agree with your assessment entirely. In each instance I thought the sigs were fake, although not "convinced". At some point, you weren't as experienced as you are now, so all I ask for is some patience. I have some old books from Hunt and Heritage still around, although not many as my wife tends to pitch them. One that i do have is the original books from the Halper Sotheby's auction in '99. Question for you and others, was all or most of Halper's stuff fake or mainly the late 19th century to early '20s jerseys and reported stolen merchandise (DiMaggio rings, papers from NYPL and Boston) about which so much has been written?

[jgmp123]

Originally Posted by RichardSimon

You just have to shake your head in wonder.
Brokers, hard sell salesman, COA's from the dead, guys with money to burn and no clue (not referring to you OP), what has this hobby come to?
It is repulsive and sickening.
Poor Joe DiMaggio. First a crooked authenticator uses his name and now this.
What a friggin' mess this is.

+1 - such a sad set of circumstances...

[RichardSimon]

Originally Posted by jgmp123

+1 - such a sad set of circumstances...

The hobby we all love is becoming sadder every day.
I started collecting autographs 20+ years ago by writing to addresses that were listed in Baseball Hobby News (now who remembers that one?).
Now it is lawsuits, informing LE of crooks, forgers, Florida forgery ring running amuck, NJ & PA forgery ring running amuck, CC, fakes, crooks overrunning the hobby, who knows how many fakes being sold on the two largest venue for autographs in the world and all the other assorted BS that goes along with it. What a shame.