T206 Bates Variation?

[wazoo]

Looks like the red was never there in the first place. But I'm no expert.

[Luke]

It's also possible that Wazoo is right. I've just seen so many cards missing the red that also have glue residue on the back, that I assume the glue removed it.

Another thing that I didn't think of initially is that red backgrounds came out looking differently on Hindus than the other 150 series print runs. A lot of the red background cards like Chance and Elberfeld came out looking orange. So, actually your red was probably pretty faint on the Bates to begin with.

I'm including my Chance Hindu to show what I'm talking about.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by LukeLyon

It's also possible that Wazoo is right. I've just seen so many cards missing the red that also have glue residue on the back, that I assume the glue removed it.

Another thing that I didn't think of initially is that red backgrounds came out looking differently on Hindus than the other 150 series print runs. A lot of the red background cards like Chance and Elberfeld came out looking orange. So, actually your red was probably pretty faint on the Bates to begin with.

I'm including my Chance Hindu to show what I'm talking about.

I think that I was the underbidder on that Chance. I'm glad you got it. You need it for your Hindu HOF set, much more than I need it.
Here's another example of a Hindu missing the red pass:


scan0001.jpg

scan0002.jpg

[Sean]

I can't be sure about the Bates card, but I don't think it got the red pass.

[bnorth]

I am not sure if it got the red pass or not but that card is definitely faded.

[Laxcat]

Originally Posted by bnorth

I am not sure if it got the red pass or not but that card is definitely faded.

Thanks for the help, Ben. I agree that it is faded. I still believe that it didn't get the red pass to begin with. I am going to get it slabbed Authentic and keep it. It does none the less look cool. Thanks for everyone's input.

[jhs5120]

Originally Posted by wazoo

Looks like the red was never there in the first place. But I'm no expert.

+1

No way that's just normal fading.

Also, I have minimal knowledge of the t206 set, but how much of a variation is there in the space between the player's name and bottom black border? There is a large difference between the two.

[z28jd]

There can be differences in where the name is to the point I've seen it inside the photo on a couple occasions. I'll try to find the scan I have of three Carrigan cards, all Polar Bear backs and all three have the name in different places

Originally Posted by jhs5120

+1

No way that's just normal fading.

Also, I have minimal knowledge of the t206 set, but how much of a variation is there in the space between the player's name and bottom black border? There is a large difference between the two.

[z28jd]

Here are the Carrigan cards. As you can see, the caption is in three different spots

[Luke]

I could definitely be wrong. Ultimately perception will be reality and people would bid on this according to their theory of what happened to the red. Here is another Bates Hindu for comparison. The red is pretty faint, and could fade rather easily in my opinion.

[tedzan]

The red ink was the last printed in the 6 color process.

That Bates card never got the final inking (red) pass. And, this is not unusual for brown HINDU cards.

Any given day on Ebay, check out the HINDU listing, and you will see quite a number of normally
red background cards (with brown HINDU backs) that are more or less Orange (due to lack of red ink).


TED Z
.

[Sean]

Originally Posted by tedzan

the red ink was the last printed in the 6 color process.

That bates card never got the final inking (red) pass. And, this is not unusual for brown hindu cards.

Any given day on ebay, check out the hindu listing, and you will see quite a number of normally
red background cards (with brown hindu backs) that are more or less orange (due to lack of red ink).


ted z
.

scan0001.jpg

[insccollectibles]

A lot of cards with back damage are missing the red ink due to the adhesive as mentioned before. This one is tough to call for me but most peoples consensus is to stay away from a high price if there is back damage and I'm not sure SGC would label it missing red ink but if you ever sell it would be worth a shot. As Ted mentioned Hindu's are known for this issue so it very well could be missing the ink.

[Bpm0014]

Although the glue/adhesive on back can definitely affect the ink on front, on this particular card it's 100% missing red. Guaranteed.

[Bpm0014]

The Bates is a known card for missing red ink. There are numerous other "Bates" also missing the red ink....

[Laxcat]

Thanks y'all. Great info. My pre-war knowledge is shite. I'll post some other things I have questions on.

[MVSNYC]

Master Bates never got his red color pass.

Great card.

[wazoo]

Originally Posted by MVSNYC

Master Bates never got his red color pass.

Great card.

[sb1]

I am gonna be the contrarian, I believe the card was glued in a display that was exposed to sunlight and faded the entire red pass. Years ago I would have said missing Red color, but after examining many T205's and T206's that are missing the Red, the vast majority have glue damage. I am not of the school that the glue did the damage, it's the fact they were most likely in a frame and hung where the sunlight/UV rays did their work. As others have stated Red is the least colorfast.

[clydepepper]

Originally Posted by MVSNYC

Master Bates never got his red color pass.

Great card.

Beat me to it!