PWCC & eBay - help us improve the hobby

[Joshchisox08]

Wow didn't know the owner of PWCC was on this site haha. I've got a couple of things from PWCC. Always seem to go a little higher than market value but I've never even had the thought cross my mind of fals scanning or shid billing.

I personally think it's the branding that drives the higher prices. People see PWCC and they trust the name.

[LKeeler]

I've bought numerous items from Brent, and have consigned perhaps over a hundred cards. I've never had any problems and will continue to buy from him, and consign to his auctions.

[swarmee]

I never realized in 2009-10 that PWCC permitted consignors to have a secret reserve bid, presumably against eBay's Terms of Service. Interesting.

Well, an easy thing for the people who identify shilling in his/any other auctions, is for people to report the listings to eBay and PWCC via the "Report Item" link at the right side under the box and select "Listing Practices", then "Fraudulent Listing Activities," then "Seller is using other accounts to inflate price." If people who care and are being shilled in these auctions would report it every time, eBay will be flooded with Report Item notifications. I am not sure if this would hurt Brent and his business directly; maybe he can chime in again and tell us. If it does, then it may be a solid topic of discussion at the meeting coming up with eBay's employees.

But, once reported, eBay and PWCC can check the auction history since they're being given a pointer to specific instances of presumed shill bidding.

Questions I'm interested in:
1) How often are items for certain sellers not paid for? If that number is over 10% (or on large $$ items), that would be a sign to me that shill accounts are being used and then stiffed, so that the "buyer" doesn't have to fork over cash to buy back their own card. They know you'll relist the card during your next auction.
2) Does your staff actively cross-check buyer addresses with consignor addresses of the same cards? Are they kept in the same line on your spreadsheet/database where they could be easily queried to see if your consigners are winning back their items?
3) If the top bidder does not pay, do you offer to underbidders? If so, this would also spur shill bidding. You could make a policy that you will never make offers to underbidders. Most bidders are wary of receiving "2nd chance" offers, figuring they were bid up in the first place.
4) Can you block/suspend all user accounts with over 5 bid retractions in the course of 6 months and all related (same IP, address) accounts? This would help cut down on overbidding to identify someone's top bid, and then backing out.

So, these are a few of my constructive comments for your discussion with your own team and eBay.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by swarmee

I never realized in 2009-10 that PWCC permitted consignors to have a secret reserve bid, presumably against eBay's Terms of Service. Interesting.

Well, an easy thing for the people who identify shilling in his/any other auctions, is for people to report the listings to eBay and PWCC via the "Report Item" link at the right side under the box and select "Listing Practices", then "Fraudulent Listing Activities," then "Seller is using other accounts to inflate price." If people who care and are being shilled in these auctions would report it every time, eBay will be flooded with Report Item notifications. I am not sure if this would hurt Brent and his business directly; maybe he can chime in again and tell us. If it does, then it may be a solid topic of discussion at the meeting coming up with eBay's employees.

But, once reported, eBay and PWCC can check the auction history since they're being given a pointer to specific instances of presumed shill bidding.

Questions I'm interested in:
1) How often are items for certain sellers not paid for? If that number is over 10% (or on large $$ items), that would be a sign to me that shill accounts are being used and then stiffed, so that the "buyer" doesn't have to fork over cash to buy back their own card. They know you'll relist the card during your next auction.
2) Does your staff actively cross-check buyer addresses with consignor addresses of the same cards? Are they kept in the same line on your spreadsheet/database where they could be easily queried to see if your consigners are winning back their items?
3) If the top bidder does not pay, do you offer to underbidders? If so, this would also spur shill bidding. You could make a policy that you will never make offers to underbidders. Most bidders are wary of receiving "2nd chance" offers, figuring they were bid up in the first place.
4) Can you block/suspend all user accounts with over 5 bid retractions in the course of 6 months and all related (same IP, address) accounts? This would help cut down on overbidding to identify someone's top bid, and then backing out.

So, these are a few of my constructive comments for your discussion with your own team and eBay.

With due respect, ebay doesn't give a damn. I have reported completely obvious shills when there was no possible innocent explanation (to be clear, not on any PWCC auction), and they politely did nothing.

[nolemmings]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

With due respect, ebay doesn't give a damn. I have reported completely obvious shills when there was no possible innocent explanation (to be clear, not on any PWCC auction), and they politely did nothing.

That's because you've never been very persuasive

[Peter_Spaeth]

Touche.

[calvindog]

"Doug, Your honesty is refreshing, but I'm concerned with the Mastro bidding policy."

2007

[Peter_Spaeth]

Brent, when your scans were previously questioned here at a time when in my opinion and many others' opinions they were sometimes bordering on thermonuclear (they are OK now as I have said), why did you come on here and claim that that was the first you had ever heard of your scans being questioned, when in fact you yourself had responded at length to a CU thread about the same topic not too long before? Just wondering? Had you somehow forgotten?

76 and 78 in this thread.

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=177348

As for whether you tolerate shill bidding by consignors, only you can know that for sure, but I and several people I know have on many occasions observed bidders with high percentages of bidding activity with you and high numbers of retractions bidding on a wide spectrum of high dollar items in your auctions. You can tell it's the same bidder by the abbreviation and feedback number. It sure looks suspicious even if it isn't.

[clydepepper]

Brent - I have always been very satisfied with my dealings with PWCC. I count you as a dealer I can trust and I certainly don't understand why anyone would say otherwise...unless they have unrealistic expectations...which is probably true.

Thanks again,
Raymond
EBAY user ID: clydepeppper

[wonkaticket]

So you used to allow bidders to bid on their lots, and you used to enhance your scans, but you don't do that anymore. Good to know.

At least you haven't announced finding god to a courtroom, or been charged with any crimes. So as a dealer/AH addressing concerns go your way ahead of the curve...I guess.

[ls7plus]

Originally Posted by Joshchisox08

Wow didn't know the owner of PWCC was on this site haha. I've got a couple of things from PWCC. Always seem to go a little higher than market value but I've never even had the thought cross my mind of fals scanning or shid billing.

I personally think it's the branding that drives the higher prices. People see PWCC and they trust the name.

+1.

Happy collecting, guys!

Larry