Do you believe there are any undervalued Mantle items?

[KCRfan1]

Brian,

Can you post an image of your Stahl-Meyer Franks Mantle? Would it be safe to say that, even though you paid 4x back in the day, the value far exceeds that price now? Again, I suppose the term " undervalued " may apply to regional issues of Mantle.

Are there some Mantle cards that are a little too obscure? Someone mentioned Transogram. Is there a market for them or the 68 Topps game cards? Both sets have star power, are they undervalued or just no interest from collectors?

[Bestdj777]

The 68 Game cards were produced in large quantity and the supply definitely outweighs the demand. The Transogram cards are a bit more difficult and bringing a lot stronger prices, particularly in complete box form. Shameless plug, but if anyone is looking for a decent Transogram I've got one I picked up at Clean Sweep Auction that I'd let go at cost--I finally got a complete box.

I love the Red Hearts, but my understanding is that they continued to release those for many, many years through the mail.

[AustinMike]

Originally Posted by KCRfan1

Brian,

Are there some Mantle cards that are a little too obscure? Someone mentioned Transogram. Is there a market for them or the 68 Topps game cards? Both sets have star power, are they undervalued or just no interest from collectors?

I don't think there are any Mantle cards that are too obscure. And as far as undervalued, I guess what you're really asking is, 'Are there any cards we think will see a significant uptick in price?"

As we all know, the main determination of price is supply and demand. Supply is supposedly (legally) fixed (or decreasing as items are destroyed). Demand fluctuates. So the question boils down to, "Will demand increase enough in the future to cause an increase in the price?" That's the $64,000 question; and I think mainly a question for speculators. If enough speculators think it's value may go up, they may jump in causing a self-fulfilling prophecy. If that were to happen, in my opinion, that would make the card overvalued. Only if the collector base were to significantly increase in the future (in relation to a card's supply) would the card be undervalued today, again, in my opinion.

An example, the 1968 Topps game card. Like Chris said, the supply of the 1968 Topps game card exceeds the demand, hence it has a low "price." Is it undervalued? No, not according to today's demand. Will demand increase for this card in the future? It's anyone's guess. In my opinion, there are enough cards out there that, I think, the demand for this card will be met for some time to come.

There are some cards that may not have a large supply, but they are butt ugly and only a completest would want it (e.g., the 1965 Bancroft Tiddlers Giants of Sport (that's just my own personal opinion)). I can't ever see a card like this being in high demand.

Generally, I'm a pessimist in regards to the long-term "value" of Mantle cards and I'm amazed at the price increases I've seen. I'm also disappointed; there are still a bunch of his cards I'd like to get and I hate to see their "value" increasing before I can get them.

[Bestdj777]

Originally Posted by AustinMike

There are some cards that may not have a large supply, but they are butt ugly and only a completest would want it (e.g., the 1965 Bancroft Tiddlers Giants of Sport (that's just my own personal opinion)). I can't ever see a card like this being in high demand

Wow, in my opinion the Bancroft Tiddlers card is one of the nicest period pieces of Mantle there is, I mean apart from the fact it does not really resemble him, the colors are all off, and you have to purchase two cards to get both the front and back. Other than that, not sure why it isn't seeing the same prices as the 52 Topps I actually wanted that one because I have a thing for foreign issued cards and generally think they are underrated, but I agree it's far from an ideal piece.

[brian1961]

Originally posted by AustinMike-----An example, the 1968 Topps game card. Like Chris said, the supply of the 1968 Topps game card exceeds the demand, hence it has a low "price." Is it undervalued? No, not according to today's demand. Will demand increase for this card in the future? It's anyone's guess. In my opinion, there are enough cards out there that, I think, the demand for this card will be met for some time to come.

YES, THAT'S FOR SURE. FOR A FREEBIE IN A 1967 TOPPS NICKEL WAX PACK, HOW IN THE WORLD DID WE COME TO HAVE SO MANY OF 'EM? WHEREAS, THE BASIC 1964 COINS ARE MUCH TOUGHER. THE ALL-STARS SEEM MUCH MORE PLENTIFUL.

There are some cards that may not have a large supply, but they are butt ugly and only a completest would want it (e.g., the 1965 Bancroft Tiddlers Giants of Sport (that's just my own personal opinion)). I can't ever see a card like this being in high demand.

YOU GOT THAT RIGHT, BROTHER. 1965 TOPPS PUSH-PULL, TOPPS WHO AM I?, 1965 TOPPS EMBOSSED CAMEO, TOPPS PUNCH-OUT, and a few etcetras.

Generally, I'm a pessimist in regards to the long-term "value" of Mantle cards and I'm amazed at the price increases I've seen. I'm also disappointed; there are still a bunch of his cards I'd like to get and I hate to see their "value" increasing before I can get them. [/QUOTE]

YOU GOT THAT OH SO RIGHT AGAIN, BRO. WISH I HAD HELD ONTO SOME OF MINE. WISH I HAD TRIED MUCH HARDER TO GET A FEW OF THEM YEARS AGO.

PART OF THE LIFE OF A COLLECTOR. IT HAPPENS. IT'S HARD; VERY HARD.

THANKS FOR A GOOD POST. ---Brian Powell

PS--The 1960 Post Cereal was the very first Mickey Mantle card I ever saw. I've got a very compelling story about the experience in my forthcoming book, NEVER CHEAPER BY THE DOZEN. I don't want to tell it here for obvious reasons, and it may not be that compelling of a tale to some, but it left a huge impression on me as a little 6-year old boy. Did you happen to see the photo of an example PSA graded AUTHENTIC? The owner cut it on the inside black frame where it just shows the picture, and no wooden frame to be seen. Kinda like a beautiful Bengal Tiger with his teeth pulled out. Made me sick.

[AustinMike]

Originally Posted by brian1961

PS--The 1960 Post Cereal was the very first Mickey Mantle card I ever saw. I've got a very compelling story about the experience in my forthcoming book, NEVER CHEAPER BY THE DOZEN. I don't want to tell it here for obvious reasons, and it may not be that compelling of a tale to some, but it left a huge impression on me as a little 6-year old boy. Did you happen to see the photo of an example PSA graded AUTHENTIC? The owner cut it on the inside black frame where it just shows the picture, and no wooden frame to be seen. Kinda like a beautiful Bengal Tiger with his teeth pulled out. Made me sick.

Yes, I did see it. It made me very sad, but not sick. I can imagine some kid at the time thinking the frame was unnecessary and doing away with it. Considering these were free on the back of cereal boxes, I figure there's nothing to feel sick about some kid making the card the way he wanted. It's sad that that was the fate of that particular card, but mine ended up in the dump. Which is worse? Like you, I was 6 when these came out in 1960. When I think about it, I'm sure the condition of my post cereal cards was not that great. I'd be willing to bet that I let the scissors stray inside the border. I handled mine constantly so I'm sure there were creases, bent corners, etc. Instead of feeling sick about it, I marvel that any survived in decent condition.

[brian1961]

Originally Posted by AustinMike

Yes, I did see it. It made me very sad, but not sick. I can imagine some kid at the time thinking the frame was unnecessary and doing away with it. Considering these were free on the back of cereal boxes, I figure there's nothing to feel sick about some kid making the card the way he wanted. It's sad that that was the fate of that particular card, but mine ended up in the dump. Which is worse? Like you, I was 6 when these came out in 1960. When I think about it, I'm sure the condition of my post cereal cards was not that great. I'd be willing to bet that I let the scissors stray inside the border. I handled mine constantly so I'm sure there were creases, bent corners, etc. Instead of feeling sick about it, I marvel that any survived in decent condition.

AUSTINMIKE---

You are right on all counts. It would be far better to have that glorious picture of Mickey Mantle, than not have the card at all.

I guess where I was coming from is that I interpreted from viewing the piece that the gent recently cut up a card having a damaged frame, submitted it, and PSA gave its AUTHENTIC, which in fact is justifiable. At least the picture area had been preserved well, which counts for something.

Moreover, on the side of the cereal package, the company provided explicit instructions as to how to mount the card. Without having them in front me, you were to fold the corner frames outward, following the frame line at each of the four corners. Once done it would resemble a three-dimensional framed portrait of the star. Like most six-year-olds, you would not have been able to read the instructions, though most kids that age would tend to seek the help of a parent or older sibling, if one had one. The instructions were carefully illustrated, however.

Me, I never got a Post Cereal package with the Sports Stars. Boy they were beautiful!

Your fascinating response of your own experience with the 1960 Post Cereal Mantle was marvelous, and so epitomizes what I wrote in my book's second chapter, where I discus this particular card. If I ever do a revised version, I would love to include your brief, pertinent story and comments if I may.

I love our gent's 1959 Bazooka Mantle. That's part of the focus of my book's eighteenth chapter. Mine's SGC AUTHENTIC. I'm extremely fond of this card, having bought it from none other than Lionel Carter, in the summer of '72.

All the best. ---Brian Powell

[AustinMike]

[Dup]

[brian1961]

Originally Posted by kcrfan1

brian,

Can you post an image of your Stahl-Meyer Franks mantle? Would it be safe to say that, even though you paid 4x back in the day, the value far exceeds that price now? Again, i suppose the term " undervalued " may apply to regional issues of mantle.

Lou, i'll have to see what I can do. I'd have to have my son help me load up some image of it. Yeah, I'm a real "brontosaurus". My '54 Stahl-Meyer Mantle gem is in my book, and it came out beautifully with the accouterments I chose for its portrait.

For most of the chapters, I don't own anything great to speak of, but for this one, I do. Graded SGC50 VG-EX. It was never imprisoned between the two rows of wet, greasy but delicious Stahl-Meyer frankfurters. Color is off the charts. Centering is dead 50-50 both ways. Its only flaw, and I mean only, is a half-inch back crease that starts on a side edge of the card and goes in, missing Mickey but reducing the grade from Mint to technical VG-EX. A technical knock-out for the grade; nevertheless, the card is simply breathtaking.

Are there some Mantle cards that are a little too obscure? Someone mentioned Transogram. (NOTE-----The Transogram is appreciated by quite a number of Mickey Mantle enthusiasts; recently I saw a PSA 9 on eBay. The seller's price escapes me, but it was colossal.) Is there a market for them or the 68 Topps game cards? Both sets have star power, are they undervalued or just no interest from collectors?

Some of the Topps test issues were either never issued or sold in a Brooklyn candy store for test purposes. Some of them are gorgeous; some are very obscure, and ugly to boot. I would even urge our resident Mickey Mantle master completionist not to lose any sleep over them. Be that as it may, whatever he chooses, he's my pal and I'm behind him.

Besides, these obscure Topps test issues are indeed Topps products, and have bus-loads of feverish fans, as well they should be.

'Nuf said. Regards, Brian Powell

[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by KCRfan1

Brian,
Would it be safe to say that, even though you paid 4x back in the day, the value far exceeds that price now?

Those regional issues in any kind of shape have always been pricey. I have the 2nd issue of Baseball Cards magazine from 1981, and they value the Stahl-Meyer Mantles at $700 and up even back then. To put into context, remember that in 1981 a gallon of gas cost $1, a dozen eggs cost about 90 cents, and the median household income in the US was less than 30K per year. Other run-of-the-mill star cards from the 1950's in "mint" condition could be mostly had for well less than $20.

[pawpawdiv9]

As i did my Mantle runs...I enjoyed the 60 post. That salmon color and wood frame was fantastic, mine was grade sgc10...I also had a Oklahome Today..pretty obscure piece with a nice shot of the Mick. I had several oddballs, even the 54 Dan-Dee which and the 52 BerkRoss and had the 65 Bancroft Tiddlers, that i consgined to Sterling this past Spring that went waaaayyy cheap!! Think they were PSa 5's.
After selling the collection (except the 51B and 52T RC) ..i am still happy where i am today with some Hof RC's. If i ever decide to try it again..I know know to buy the best centered ones and only do the Basic Topps runs. I know a few folks here are accomplishing this goal and have setup a nice collection thus far. But i believe that the 51 (52 WS?? determined) Wheaties B&W premium was by far my most prized oddball item.
And to my other bro, Begsu..i am still wowed by that signed 51B you have. Can i hold it next year??

[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by jchcollins

I have the 2nd issue of Baseball Cards magazine from 1981, and they value the Stahl-Meyer Mantles at $700 and up even back then.

Correction, it is the '81 Sport Americana price guide that has the Stahl-Meyers. The '81 BBCM I have lists a '52 Topps Mantle #311 for $1100 ($660 in VG), and a '53 Topps Mays for $575. Nolan Ryan's '68 Topps RC is $10.

[KCRfan1]

Those prices make us all ill.

So does anyone feel there is room for appreciation in price with mid-grade, standard Topps issues of Mantle? What about Mantle All-Star cards which typically are high numbers?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Self serving all the way.

[ALR-bishop]

Nice one Peter

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop

Nice one Peter

Thanks Al. With all the cut lines showing I think it actually would get a number grade by PSA, which they have only given to 5 cards -- the other 58 are all AUTH.

[ls7plus]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Self serving all the way.

Very nice '59 Bazooka Mantle, Pete. I had a TPG NrMt, sold it, and regretted it ever since.

Highest regards,

Larry

[Brian Van Horn]

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