Old Judge Orotone Photo/Studio Proof "Jumbo" Davis **UPDATED**

[1880nonsports]

but why would you think it couldn't have been cut down from a larger image? These blank plates were sold to the photographer in a much larger size - the evidence of some cutting is naturally noticeable in the images provided on more than one side. The balance and proportions of the non-image area are off as well.
I would not think it to be a modern copy as the price of gold is now and in the recent past many times what it would have been whether original to 1887/88 shoot OR a subsequent re-issue at the turn of the century. Mostly I just can't see the incentive to produce with ill intent......
Interesting item.

[ramram]

Originally Posted by 1880nonsports

but why would you think it couldn't have been cut down from a larger image? These blank plates were sold to the photographer in a much larger size - the evidence of some cutting is naturally noticeable in the images provided on more than one side. The balance and proportions of the non-image area are off as well.
I would not think it to be a modern copy as the price of gold is now and in the recent past many times what it would have been whether original to 1887/88 shoot OR a subsequent re-issue at the turn of the century. Mostly I just can't see the incentive to produce with ill intent......
Interesting item.

I should correct my earlier statement - It probably is not a current fake due to the difficulty of producing it versus the return. It is more likely that it is an orotone produced in the early 1900's possibly from one of the glass plate negatives that we have seen showing up in the last few years. Much like the Omaha Old Judges that were believed to have been produced from them after the turn of the century. However, I would still doubt it was ever cut down. That would be difficult for the average person to do considering that it is glass and what purpose would it really serve? Certainly not just for the purpose of putting it in an old case.

Rob M.

[drcy]

I don't see it being a modern fake, in that it's an obscure process that few baseball collectors are familiar with. You generally don't forge items the potential buyers are ignorant about. Note that even Lelands didn't realize what they had. Plus most forgeries are something simple to make (ala, all those digital baseball card reprints). The orotone process is expensive and difficult. It's not something the normal person could make.

There are modern made orotones, including of Edward Curtis's famous images of American Indians, but the modern versions themselves are expensive, due to the laborious process and gold. The modern made Curtis orotones often sell for over $1,000.

Before he took it apart, I said that if it was a fake, it would most probably have a reproduction image of the player on a piece of paper placed behind the glass. But he took it apart and the back was gold as with a genuine orotone.

[BTFalls]

That's Myron Allen. OJ pose 4-3.

He and Jumbo were teammates and there is a resemblance.

Very cool piece!

[BTFalls]

Here's an image.

[GoCubsGo32]

That's really cool! Shame it's not a new/unknown pose, but very cool to see it's been correctly ID and that the card does exist.

Thank you!

[drcy]

One thing, perhaps only of interest to me, is that orotones had the photographic image printed from a negative onto the glass, which is unlike daguerreotypes, ambrotypes and tintypes. Those last three are essentially negatives (the images made to look positive by a backing). This should explain how everything, including any text, will appear normal on the orotone-- where everything is reverse in the other photos.