How much should I spend on a 1952 topps psa 1 Mantle?

[begsu1013]

pretty strong finish for a 1951 psa 4.5!

sounds like it "mighta" been a 6 at some point, but the guy cracked it out and resubmitted and lost (maybe). if not, brilliant marketing strategy!

but get's back to the point where people are appreciating the cards vs the flips. gotta be a new high for the grade!

(apologize, used to be able to do links properly, but something is messed up)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1951-Bowman-...vip=true&rt=nc

EDIT: AND HE INITIALLY THREW IT UP W/ A BIN @ $6500.

[CW]

I think that may be a record for a PSA 4.5, although an SGC 55 sold at REA last summer for $7800.

The auction did have a few red flags, too, like the fact that he had it graded this year yet the holder had no front hologram (I guess early this year they still weren't out?). The seller mentioned he pulled the card from a pack at age 8, and the photo made the holder appear to possibly have some frosting on the right edge. Just seemed like a weird auction. I had a snipe placed and was somewhat relieved it was blown out of the water.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by CW

I think that may be a record for a PSA 4.5, although an SGC 55 sold at REA last summer for $7800.

The auction did have a few red flags, too, like the fact that he had it graded this year yet the holder had no front hologram (I guess early this year they still weren't out?). The seller mentioned he pulled the card from a pack at age 8, and the photo made the holder appear to possibly have some frosting on the right edge. Just seemed like a weird auction. I had a snipe placed and was somewhat relieved it was blown out of the water.

Yeah on the one hand he did post the old flip (I had asked him to but on the other hand the candy store story, the lack of any feedback for a year, and just the whole karma of the auction did not feel reassuring.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Yeah on the one hand he did post the old flip (I had asked him to but on the other hand the candy store story, the lack of any feedback for a year, and just the whole karma of the auction did not feel reassuring.

plus the lack of paperwork he said he had in the questions and answers and wouldn't produce it....it funny though there probably like 5 or 6 guys ..several here from net54 who are the first responders on all new listings....

still though peter there was your centered 4 that you keep asking about on net54....I been waiting on a yellow/red ruth ....maybe someone has a psa 6 ruth they will submit for a bump and it will come back a 4.5 ...

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by begsu1013

pretty strong finish for a 1951 psa 4.5!

sounds like it "mighta" been a 6 at some point, but the guy cracked it out and resubmitted and lost (maybe). if not, brilliant marketing strategy!

but get's back to the point where people are appreciating the cards vs the flips. gotta be a new high for the grade!

(apologize, used to be able to do links properly, but something is messed up)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1951-Bowman-...vip=true&rt=nc

EDIT: AND HE INITIALLY THREW IT UP W/ A BIN @ $6500.

I really doubt the card was real, he said he had paperwork to prove the submittal and then wouldn't provide it ...if trying to sell a high dollar card why say you have something and not provide it...big red flag

..Q: Kind of strange that you re-submitted the card this year yet it doesn't have the new PSA Hologram on the flip. Also I've never heard of a company downgrading a card 1.5 points on a re-submit. If this occurred I assume... Continue reading
A: DAN, THIS CARD IS EXACTALLY AS I GOT IT BACK FROM PSA. I HAVE THE PAPERWORK TO PROVE IT.AND I ALSO HAVE THE ORIGINALGRADING STRIP FROM THE FIRST TIME IT WAS GRADED. AND NO..I DID NOT GET ANY MONEY FROM PSA. THEY EVEN CHARGED... Continue reading


aside from there being a long back story on a key card ie. (found in the attic, got from a storage locker...had it regarded'.....

[begsu1013]

I read that prior to posting which makes me assume it was a crack-out resub, hence the pic of the old flip. psa would never give the flip back.



as for the hologram. I just got cards back yesterday from psa via fedex that didn't have the new label/barcode on the back...

am i missing something on where he never produced paperwork?

and not much recent feedback but looks like he did sell another 51 mantle about a year ago and posi fb left.

hell, who knows.

[MattyC]

Real or not, we are really starting to see the 51B grab some props. What impresses so much about the difficulty of the 51B Mick is the registration problems-- if the Yankee cap isn't blurry, it's the outline of the bat. Then there's the centering. Then there's those two, or sometimes one, vertical lines. It's a major card and also so hard to find a nice one, despite the very misleading overall pop number.

[pokerplyr80]

I actually discussed this one while it was up with another member who was considering it. My thought was that the answers to the questions, will possibly true, were strange to say the least. And I didn't like the face that the only other card he had sold was another 51 Mantle a year ago. Given the uncertainty I'm surprised it closed as high as it did.

Nice card though and certainly an unfortunate downgrade if the story is true. That one probably goes for 4-5k more in a 6 holder.

[begsu1013]

we all agree that there was a degree of shadiness to the seller / listing. maybe it was legit. maybe it wasn't.

BUT...

imagine if there wasn't the slightest bit of doubt and what this card really woulda sold for...

let's not lose sight that it garnered $7700 w/ a questionable seller. couple that w/ the referenced sgc card that sold @ $7800.

definitely some nods to the 51 and good to see!

it may be the 51's proverbial turn at bat since just about everybody is getting pushed outta the 52 market.

...would be just plain impolite to call it the "trickle down effect", but it looks like that's exactly what could be happening

and brings this thread around full circle.

[pokerplyr80]

I can't argue with that. For the price of a beat up 52 PSA 1 that the OP was asking about someone bought Mantle's true RC dead centered in a PSA 4.5. I think the gap will narrow eventually between the two. The 51 is one of the most under valued cards, and certainly the highest profile card that's under valued, if by no other standard than when compared to the 52, in my opinion.

[MattyC]

I agree with the two posts above. As someone who's been collecting mostly Mantle for over a year now, always looking to acquire pretty cards, I see it happening to all his basic issues lately. Last year we saw the 62 pop. Now the 56. Recently the 57 went nuts at auction. That 53T in 8 went crazy high on eBay, great card that was. Come to think of it the 59 also has a few very high sales lately.

The 52B, 53B, and 54B are so hard to find with great eye appeal, I think the next pretty one of each and every of those will turn heads with auction results. I look like a madman for those and can't find them. The one time I saw a nice 52B and 53B, I made sure to reel them in. Love the man's cards!

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by MattyC

Real or not, we are really starting to see the 51B grab some props. What impresses so much about the difficulty of the 51B Mick is the registration problems-- if the Yankee cap isn't blurry, it's the outline of the bat. Then there's the centering. Then there's those two, or sometimes one, vertical lines. It's a major card and also so hard to find a nice one, despite the very misleading overall pop number.

Gum stains on the back too -- and a slightly blurry face too, and/or washed out color -- believe me I know every damn reason I haven't bought one yet.

[MattyC]

Man, I forgot the gum stains, too, Peter. Good call. I think half the total pop across all grades or maybe worse suffers from one or more of the aforementioned flaws. I've seen 7s that have some of these problems. These are the challenges that make card collecting so fun. It's like when I found a 67 that had no red dot over the YANKEES, or a 57 that was actually in focus, LOL. I swear if I ever see let alone hold a 57 Mantle that is both dead nuts centered and focused I might have a heart attack on the spot.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by MattyC

Man, I forgot the gum stains, too, Peter. Good call. I think half the total pop across all grades or maybe worse suffers from one or more of the aforementioned flaws. I've seen 7s that have some of these problems. These are the challenges that make card collecting so fun. It's like when I found a 67 that had no red dot over the YANKEES, or a 57 that was actually in focus, LOL. I swear if I ever see let alone hold a 57 Mantle that is both dead nuts centered and focused I might have a heart attack on the spot.

I had one in an 8 years ago, or at least by memory it was. Pretty nice focus on this one at least by my standards, although the centering isn't quite there.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by begsu1013

pretty strong finish for a 1951 psa 4.5!

sounds like it "mighta" been a 6 at some point, but the guy cracked it out and resubmitted and lost (maybe). if not, brilliant marketing strategy!

but get's back to the point where people are appreciating the cards vs the flips. gotta be a new high for the grade!

(apologize, used to be able to do links properly, but something is messed up)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1951-Bowman-...vip=true&rt=nc

EDIT: AND HE INITIALLY THREW IT UP W/ A BIN @ $6500.

the fact the no one bought it at a bin for 6500 still says somethings...I wouldn't be assuming all 4.5s go for 7k now...

[begsu1013]

disagreeing, jake. it's simply another case of the auction factor.

i couldn't even count the number of times the same exact card has been sitting at a BIN (for months) and then it gets auctioned off and absolutely shatters the bin price

but, will agree not all 4.5's will go for $7K. but well centered ones w/o roller marks and that have that eye appeal probably will!

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by begsu1013

disagreeing, jake. it's simply another case of the auction factor.

i couldn't even count the number of times the same exact card has been sitting at a BIN (for months) and then it gets auctioned off and absolutely shatters the bin price

but, will agree not all 4.5's will go for $7K. but well centered ones w/o roller marks and that have that eye appeal probably will!

right but there are certain price points that the card would sell at BIN...its becomes more sketchy when need an auction to go over...if that card was listed for $3,000..it sells right? doesn't go to auction.....always a risk to hope to get at a future auction what a card wouldn't sell for on BIN that is close in time...

[begsu1013]

ya lost me.

[pokerplyr80]

Auctions have an element of risk to them as you need two bidders who want the card to drive the price up. Sometimes they may get more than a BIN price because of this, sometimes less. I agree with Bob and MattyC though in that nice centered cards without common flaws are going for big premiums, especially the big Mantle cards. I would not expect to find a dead centered 4.5 51 Mantle again for less than this one sold for. If I did I would probably buy it.

[begsu1013]

not if i get there first! 😉

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

Auctions have an element of risk to them as you need two bidders who want the card to drive the price up. Sometimes they may get more than a BIN price because of this, sometimes less. I agree with Bob and MattyC though in that nice centered cards without common flaws are going for big premiums, especially the big Mantle cards. I would not expect to find a dead centered 4.5 51 Mantle again for less than this one sold for. If I did I would probably buy it.

so next buy it now for 6500 its all you..

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

the fact the no one bought it at a bin for 6500 still says somethings...I wouldn't be assuming all 4.5s go for 7k now...

When it had the BIN he had not posted the flip of the old 6 which lent some measure of credibility.