Buying Slabbed cards...security...or the contrary?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

My estimate is based on the fact I have a few friends who are inventors of sorts and are making Proto types occasionally so I know what it cost to make a Proto type. Additionally to take a digital image of a slab would be very simple and inexpensive once you have this information finding someone to fabricated cannot be difficult or expensive.

If you're right we're in even more trouble than I thought.

[bxb]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

If you're right we're in even more trouble than I thought.

Considering there is now a $400,000 profit in changing a PSA 6 flip to a PSA 8, and the Chinese can duplicate almost anything, heap o' trouble on the horizon.

[botn]

A card having been graded is not an excuse for the buyer to not know if what they are buying is in fact graded correctly. If you are relying solely on the flip to tell you the condition of the card then you are in trouble. Just like 30 years ago if you were relying solely on the dealer telling you what the grade of the card is instead or using your own judgement then you were in trouble back then.

Holders will be compromised but as has been pointed out and what I was alluding to in my first post--altered cards managing to find their way into holders has always been far more of a threat to the hobby. I have virgin 60s commons come back as trimmed yet not a day goes by where I do not come across an obviously trimmed 4 figure star card that is obviously altered.

It is my understanding the 52 Mantle in question was an actual PSA holder. Apparently the person doing this does not need to go to the expense of fabricating holders in China as he is able to use original holders.

[steve B]

There's really no need to send a slab to china.

The material used is most likely polycarbonate, and that can be printed in a 3d printer. Most hobby machines probably can't achieve the quality needed to produce a nice clear item, but the professional machines can.

Check out some of the items shown on this page and ask yourself how hard it would be to make a slab. Or a mold to produce some slabs if you had an injection molding machine. (Or even a press that can both heat and press at the same time)

https://www.makexyz.com/printer/medspark

And he charges just $1.75/ cubic centimeter.

The printer he uses can be had for about 20,000 used, sometimes less.

Steve B

[conor912]

This is why PSA is putting more effort into their flips. They've realized that the future of their security lies in holograms and barcodes and not the slabs themselves, which are now reproducable by just about anyone with a good 3D printer. The good ones are still very big and expensive now, but as they get cheaper, watch out. Any jackass will eventually have the tools to 3D print a slab and put a fake card in it.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by conor912

This is why PSA is putting more effort into their flips. They've realized that the future of their security lies in holograms and barcodes and not the slabs themselves, which are now reproducable by just about anyone with a good 3D printer. The good ones are still very big and expensive now, but as they get cheaper, watch out. Any jackass will eventually have the tools to 3D print a slab and put a fake card in it.

The same can be said about the flips. All those holograms are is more expensive ink that anyone that knows someone that works in a print shop can get.

[MetsBaseball1973]

I remain 100% fine buying graded cards from trusted sellers on eBay, or reputable auction houses. Anytime a thing is expensive and affords status there will be attempts to defraud-- it could be a Rolex or a Basquiat or a Mickey Mantle.

I try to educate myself, cultivate a network of savvy collector colleagues who can help me with an opinion, buy only from reliable sources, and above all scrutinize the card, to make sure it is not either over graded or one that slipped passed the proverbial goalie. In my experience thus far, this works out just fine.

Once we start talking about an invasion of Chinese slabs, I feel the discussion is on a slippery logic slope, the kind of sky-is-falling, tin hat hyperbole for which the Internet has become so famous, LOL.