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  #1  
Old 01-04-2016, 08:03 PM
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Peter Spaeth
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Originally Posted by btcarfagno View Post
Peter,

Are you so sure?

Take a look at JAWS using Fangraphs WAR instead of the BR WAR that you used. There are four HOFers at the CF position who are so far above the rest that they skew any "averages" as a result. Their career WAR numbers are so high that do you know whose career WAR is only a very small amount "above average" for a HOFer?

Ken Griffey Jr.

If you take Mays, Mantle, Cobb and Speaker out of the equation, take a look at where Edmonds rates against HOF CF in career WAR per Fangraphs:

DiMaggio 83.1
Griffey Jr 77.7
Hamilton (Billy) 70.3
Edmonds 64.5
Snider 63.5
Carey 60.1
Dawson 59.5
Ashburn 57.4
Doby 51.1
Roush 49.6
Duffy 48.3
Averill 47.9
Puckett 44.9
Wilson 42.1
Combs 41.3

Those are the OF used in the JAWS calculation on BR (plus Griffeyband Edmonds).

How about peak 7 year WAR without Cobb or Mantle or Mays or Speaker factored in?

DiMaggio 52.5
Griffey 51.1
Snider 47.5
Edmonds 45.4
Hamilton 45.2
Ashburn 40.8
Doby 39.8
Dawson 38.4
Wilson 38.4
Averill 37.3
Duffy 35.8
Carey 34.4
Puckett 33.9
Combs 33.3
Roush 32.7

Yet Edmonds is going to get less than 5% of the vote and not be eligible again? Seriously?

Tom C
All well and good, but he is a .284 hitter with 1900 hits. Who never led the league in a single category. I'm not beating the drum on this one.
Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 01-04-2016 at 08:07 PM.
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  #2  
Old 01-04-2016, 08:06 PM
btcarfagno btcarfagno is offline
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All well and good, but he is a .284 hitter with 1900 hits. I'm not beating the drum on this one.
I'm not saying he is a HOFer...but one and done? He's getting the Ted Simmons treatment?

Tom C
Last edited by btcarfagno; 01-04-2016 at 08:06 PM.
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  #3  
Old 01-04-2016, 08:09 PM
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I'm not saying he is a HOFer...but one and done? He's getting the Ted Simmons treatment?

Tom C
Fair enough, he was a very good player. Simmons was closer to a HOFer though I think.
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  #4  
Old 01-04-2016, 08:12 PM
btcarfagno btcarfagno is offline
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Fair enough, he was a very good player. Simmons was closer to a HOFer though I think.
I would agree. But both are going to be one time only players on the ballot it looks like.

I just don't get it.

Tom C
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  #5  
Old 01-04-2016, 08:44 PM
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I would agree. But both are going to be one time only players on the ballot it looks like.

I just don't get it.

Tom C
Defense only gets one into the hall of fame if by chance ones career happens to include a walk off home run in the seventh game of the World Series.
Last edited by Huck; 01-04-2016 at 08:45 PM.
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  #6  
Old 01-04-2016, 09:14 PM
btcarfagno btcarfagno is offline
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Defense only gets one into the hall of fame if by chance ones career happens to include a walk off home run in the seventh game of the World Series.
Very true. And apparently legendary defense plus 393 career home runs and an OPS+ of 132 gets you less than 5% of the vote.

Bah.

Tom C
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  #7  
Old 01-05-2016, 05:16 AM
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Defense only gets one into the hall of fame if by chance ones career happens to include a walk off home run in the seventh game of the World Series.
I don't know, I think being the very best defender to ever play ones position makes for a pretty compelling case all by itself.
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Old 01-05-2016, 01:27 PM
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I don't know, I think being the very best defender to ever play ones position makes for a pretty compelling case all by itself.
I totally agree with Bill Mazeroski that "defense belongs in the hall of fame". I just don't think the people who vote feel the same way. I also agree that Whitaker and Trammell should be enshrined.
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  #9  
Old 01-04-2016, 08:09 PM
btcarfagno btcarfagno is offline
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Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
All well and good, but he is a .284 hitter with 1900 hits. Who never led the league in a single category. I'm not beating the drum on this one.
Also, are we really going with batting average as a top factor for HOF consideration? This isn't 1925 anymore.

Tom C
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