$400+ for 1952T Mantle....

[1952boyntoncollector]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1952-Topps-3...QAAOSwuYVWmvjH

cmon now..

[arexcrooke]

Final bid of $621. Wow

[JoeDfan]

WOW.

I have one of those Mantle reprint cards. I wonder if I take it outside and run it over a couple of times with my Jeep, and sub it to PSA, maybe I can make $600...

[angolajones]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/T206-Piedmon...p2047675.l2557

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1915-M101-Gr...8AAOSwbdpWY7Vt

Notice in the second listing that one of his example cards is the same as the first listing. Same person?

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by JoeDfan

WOW.

I have one of those Mantle reprint cards. I wonder if I take it outside and run it over a couple of times with my Jeep, and sub it to PSA, maybe I can make $600...

I say go for it, it might come back with a # grade. It would not be the first fake card in a PSA slab you own.

[Bored5000]

Originally Posted by arexcrooke

Final bid of $621. Wow

Seems legit with a "0" feedback member winning the auction.

[pokerplyr80]

The glasses are a nice touch.

[jchcollins]

Just sad. Personally I find it difficult to spend more than $100 on any single card for my entire collection. I realize not everyone has that type of budget constraint - but still - even if you were loaded and didn't care, why anyone would purchase a card that is faked that often in such horrible shape without doing any research is beyond me. Spend 10 minutes reading the history of this card online and more importantly - over the past year - and this becomes a questionable purchase at best. You see the same type of "questionable authenticity" auctions on '33 Goudey Ruth cards. "This could not be verified to be authentic, but maybe you can get it at a steal - only $200 instead of more than $2,000!" I guess I just can't believe that people actually go for that, but apparently they do.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by jchcollins

Just sad. Personally I find it difficult to spend more than $100 on any single card for my entire collection. I realize not everyone has that type of budget constraint - but still - even if you were loaded and didn't care, why anyone would purchase a card that is faked that often in such horrible shape without doing any research is beyond me. Spend 10 minutes reading the history of this card online and more importantly - over the past year - and this becomes a questionable purchase at best. You see the same type of "questionable authenticity" auctions on '33 Goudey Ruth cards. "This could not be verified to be authentic, but maybe you can get it at a steal - only $200 instead of more than $2,000!" I guess I just can't believe that people actually go for that, but apparently they do.

really no different than Ponzi schemes were investors think they will get 25% profit on their investment.....next on American Greed....shady ebay auctions...

[pawpawdiv9]

I can see this being shipped off to one of those 'other' TPGs and even come back with a numerical grade. Then have it re-listed on Ebay again.
I remember seeing a 52 Mick with a milk mustache, where the person rubbed so much for some odd reasons, but i do belive it was 'real'. (if not mistaken)

[Bestdj777]

Originally Posted by pawpawdiv9

I can see this being shipped off to one of those 'other' TPGs and even come back with a numerical grade. Then have it re-listed on Ebay again.
I remember seeing a 52 Mick with a milk mustache, where the person rubbed so much for some odd reasons, but i do belive it was 'real'. (if not mistaken)

It was very ugly but real. It was passed around like crazy for a while and sold for pretty cheap a couple of times. I think it was in a PSA holder.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by Bestdj777

It was very ugly but real. It was passed around like crazy for a while and sold for pretty cheap a couple of times. I think it was in a PSA holder.

the card is back on ebay

[Bestdj777]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

the card is back on ebay

Not seeing it. Could you share a link?

[1952boyntoncollector]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1952-Topps-3...QAAOSwuYVWmvjH

[pokerplyr80]

Does anyone know if that PSA tag with the ? authenticity is given for any card that's not authentic, or only if they are unable to determine authenticity? If the card is so beat up that they can't make a determination, but there is still a decent chance it's real, I guess I can see it going for a few hundred.

[TheNightmanCometh]

Why would anyone wanna spend a few hundred on that card though, even if it turns out that it is real? In the back of your mind you'll always question if you paid a few hundred for a card that may be a reprint, at least I would. Plus, it's beat to all heck. Ugly card, even if it is a authentic Mantle.

[CW]

This may be a case of the seller getting greedy and shooting himself in the foot.

He had what looks like 3 legit bidders over $415.99 but couldn't resist using his new 0 feedback shill account to bid way too much. Either that, or someone used the new account to prevent someone from getting ripped off, then simply didn't pay.

http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.d...p2047675.l2565

[pokerplyr80]

Originally Posted by TheNightmanCometh

Why would anyone wanna spend a few hundred on that card though, even if it turns out that it is real? In the back of your mind you'll always question if you paid a few hundred for a card that may be a reprint, at least I would. Plus, it's beat to all heck. Ugly card, even if it is a authentic Mantle.

I'm not saying I would. But if PSA said they couldn't determine authenticity, but they couldn't tell it was a fake either, I could see someone paying that. If that exact card was in an SGC or BVG auth holder or a 1 it would still probably sell in the 3500-4000 range.

[TheNightmanCometh]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

I'm not saying I would. But if PSA said they couldn't determine authenticity, but they couldn't tell it was a fake either, I could see someone paying that. If that exact card was in an SGC or BVG auth holder or a 1 it would still probably sell in the 3500-4000 range.

I get the love for the '52 Mantle, I really do, but how that card could be $2000+, if real, is mind boggling. That's barely even a card anymore.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by TheNightmanCometh

I get the love for the '52 Mantle, I really do, but how that card could be $2000+, if real, is mind boggling. That's barely even a card anymore.

I agree.. think its less than 1000 if real

[TheNightmanCometh]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

I agree.. think its less than 1000 if real

Less than $1000? I don't know why anyone would pay more than $100. Just to say you own a '52 Mantle? Nobody would believe you until you showed it and once you did they wouldn't think much of it. I don't see any positives in owning that card. Unless your bag is messed up cards with weird things drawn on them. :-P

[Bestdj777]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1952-Topps-3...QAAOSwuYVWmvjH

Not the card I was referencing. I honestly can't tell whether this one is real or not as I don't know enough the differences between the two variations (I bought graded when I got mine).

If this was real, I'd throw out $1000 for it all day, every day.

[Bestdj777]

Originally Posted by TheNightmanCometh

Less than $1000? I don't know why anyone would pay more than $100. Just to say you own a '52 Mantle? Nobody would believe you until you showed it and once you did they wouldn't think much of it. I don't see any positives in owning that card. Unless your bag is messed up cards with weird things drawn on them. :-P

Don't judge Some people like that sort of thing....


I personally don't mind messed up cards, or cards with writing on them provided it isn't malicious (i.e., drawing glasses on Mantle is kind of funny while drawing x's through his face would be a deal breaker). I have a handful of cards in my collection that have been annotated by their original owners, etc.

[pokerplyr80]

I've seen some pretty hammered examples sell for over 4k. None as bad as this one. Maybe my estimate is a little high. But in an Ebay auction in an authentic holder I'd be surprised if any in tact 52 Mantle goes for less than 3k in any condition. Again I wouldn't be the buyer but I believe there would be many out there who just want to own one and that would be all they can afford.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

I've seen some pretty hammered examples sell for over 4k. None as bad as this one. Maybe my estimate is a little high. But in an Ebay auction in an authentic holder I'd be surprised if any in tact 52 Mantle goes for less than 3k in any condition. Again I wouldn't be the buyer but I believe there would be many out there who just want to own one and that would be all they can afford.

yeah i disagree....there are certian units people are willing to pay. 3000 is high...you wouldnt pay the 3000.....

its like when people on b/s/t say they love a card and the price, but not going to buy it....doesnt really mean anything if they not buying it....whats the most you woudl pay for the spectacle Mantle pokerplyr? i understand there could be others willing to pay more than you but want to see your ballpark..

[pokerplyr80]

I wouldn't buy that card to keep, only to flip. In an authentic holder I would take a shot around 2k. I would be confident I could sell it for at least 3k.

I'm not saying I love the card at 3k just that I think someone else would.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

I wouldn't buy that card to keep, only to flip. In an authentic holder I would take a shot around 2k. I would be confident I could sell it for at least 3k.

I'm not saying I love the card at 3k just that I think someone else would.

right so you don't even know if you buy it for 2k but you think it would go for 3k-3500..thats the first sign that your valuation is too high, which I think you were already beginning to admit..

[Bestdj777]

I think the valuation is spot on. I remember shopping before this recent spike and some really nasty cards were bringing 2k plus then. Given the difficulty of getting a low grade example at any reasonable price now I'd imagine you could find a buyer at 3k if you didn't mind holding it a couple months.

[begsu1013]

depending on the day and the mood, i'd throw $3k at it if it were in a sgc/psa holder but doubt i would win it...

it's got 2 things going for it:

it's a legit 52 mantle.
and it's a very unique and laughable 52 mantle.

it'd make me smile!

hell, i'd even prop it up on the desk at work just for the facial reactions...

(again, if it were legit)

[begsu1013]

and yes, I have a couple of bags...

a serious one.
a sunday one.
and one that is more nuttier than a squirrel turd.

[pokerplyr80]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

yeah i disagree....there are certian units people are willing to pay. 3000 is high...you wouldnt pay the 3000.....

its like when people on b/s/t say they love a card and the price, but not going to buy it....doesnt really mean anything if they not buying it....whats the most you woudl pay for the spectacle Mantle pokerplyr? i understand there could be others willing to pay more than you but want to see your ballpark..

You find me one in similar condition, I'll give you 2k. I might even go a little more. I think it would bring at least 3k. If I won a card like that in that range, it would go straight to PWCC. I might even have it shipped directly there.

Bob knows the market better than I do and he said he might even throw 3k at it, and doesn't think he'd win it. I think my initial valuation is pretty close, although I doubt we'll get a chance to test this hypothesis.

[CW]

Sold for $3828 in Sterling back in Feb of '15, almost a year ago...

Original thread

[TheNightmanCometh]

Originally Posted by Bestdj777

Don't judge Some people like that sort of thing....


I personally don't mind messed up cards, or cards with writing on them provided it isn't malicious (i.e., drawing glasses on Mantle is kind of funny while drawing x's through his face would be a deal breaker). I have a handful of cards in my collection that have been annotated by their original owners, etc.

That's fair. I wasn't trying to disrespect anyone :-). I can see how someone could be into messed up cards like that, I just don't see how it can be worth as much as some are saying it could be, even if it is a '52 Mantle.

[begsu1013]

posting vcp info first solely in "a" condition for remaining 3 tpgs for the last 2 years:

PSA:

12/30/15 eBay Listing $7,995.95
11/28/15 eBay Listing $12,000.00
11/8/15 eBay Auction $7,777.00 Altered
11/1/15 eBay Listing $16,000.00
10/7/15 eBay Auction $4,464.00
9/24/15 eBay Auction $6,800.00 Altered
9/9/15 eBay Auction $11,877.00
8/9/15 eBay Auction $4,803.00
6/13/15 eBay $5,750.00
6/10/15 eBay $5,750.00
5/25/15 eBay $4,990.00 Altered
5/11/15 eBay $15,690.00 Altered
4/26/15 REA $4,800.00 Recolored
3/29/15 Love of the Game $10,200.00
3/9/15 eBay $5,111.00
10/18/14 eBay $1,590.00
6/5/14 eBay $3,790.00
5/30/14 Legendary $14,340.00
5/28/14 eBay $2,200.00 Altered
5/22/14 eBay $3,350.00 Altered
4/5/14 eBay $4,000.00
12/31/13 eBay $6,000.00


SGC:

1/18/16 eBay Listing $7,000.00
6/21/15 eBay $7,499.99
4/9/15 Huggins & Scott $4,481.25
11/2/14 eBay $7,000.00
10/19/14 REA $3,900.00
12/6/13 Greg Bussineau $13,320.00


BVG: (NOT MUCH)

11/16/15 eBay Auction $5,355.00 Altered
4/6/14 eBay $3,119.52

[sbfinley]

The higher valuations are correct. $5k is the buy in to be a contender for poor Mantle now, and that's just enough to sit at the table and bid. If this card was authentic and being auctioned by a legitimate seller the minimum estimate I would expect to see would be $2200-$2500 and it would likely hammer closer to a grand more.

As the for the card in question, it is a counterfeit type 1.

[begsu1013]

ok, w/ vcp pricing transparent (not that that really means anything) does anyone have any info on the psa 10/14 sale of $1590?

legit sale? I do not remember seeing it if so and usually check at least twice a day on the 52 for what pops up.

if it was an actual sale and not a hijacked quick scam account, I would love to see the condition of that card...


other than that other $2200 sale on 5/14, everything else is well above the $3k mark. and most of the "sorta" documented sales are prior to the explosion that has occurred this past 8 months or so.

and while I am not knocking vcp in any means and these are pretty much code/computer initiated recordings, these fake sales do slip past the goalie. here is the info that still registers on a signed 51 bowman that is completely fraudulent...I know because I hit the BIN as soon as I saw it. hijacked account, fake ups slip sent to some random address in my hometown...reported to vcp, they did nothing to remove it from their database:

1/8/16 Goodwin Auction $23,677.20
12/16/15 eBay Listing $5,990.00 (FRAUD SALE)

eta: and on the flip side, there's another completely legitimate one that did sell on 8/4/15 that is not listed on vcp.

i remember that day very whale! ; )

[1952boyntoncollector]

Also it has been discussed that 'A' cards can be worth as much as 2-4 depending on the condition... beat up PSA 1s are not worth as much as centered clearly altered centered Mantles without spectacles.

Basically some As have much more eye appeal than 1s and people pay extra for that.......the same person that pays 1000 for a certain A may be 5000+ for the best A...on a 1000 dollar card you rarely see that type of a difference in price

[TheNightmanCometh]

Sat there and studied a pic of an authentic Mantle compared to this one and I can't help but feel that this is a fake. I looked at the two printings that Topps came out with and immediately ruled out one. The one I studied was the "missing pixel" version of the card, where the corner of the black border is missing a pixel, thus creating an angle where the point should be. This card either has a less severe angle or is completely rounded.

Authentic...

http://goodwinandco.com/ItemImages/0...52-10a_lg.jpeg

Mantle in question...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/161957962758...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

[jmb]

Originally Posted by CW

Sold for $3828 in Sterling back in Feb of '15, almost a year ago...

Original thread

How is it that the beat to hell cards are always centered perfectly ?

[MattyC]

I have noticed the exact same thing! It seems whenever I am seeking a card, I encounter a beat one that has ultra rare centering. Hysterical.

[Peter_Spaeth]

I question that 1. It doesn't seem to have the lower left missing pixel. Agree with above poster.

[irv]

Originally Posted by begsu1013

ok, w/ vcp pricing transparent (not that that really means anything) does anyone have any info on the psa 10/14 sale of $1590?

legit sale? I do not remember seeing it if so and usually check at least twice a day on the 52 for what pops up.

if it was an actual sale and not a hijacked quick scam account, I would love to see the condition of that card...


other than that other $2200 sale on 5/14, everything else is well above the $3k mark. and most of the "sorta" documented sales are prior to the explosion that has occurred this past 8 months or so.

and while I am not knocking vcp in any means and these are pretty much code/computer initiated recordings, these fake sales do slip past the goalie. here is the info that still registers on a signed 51 bowman that is completely fraudulent...I know because I hit the BIN as soon as I saw it. hijacked account, fake ups slip sent to some random address in my hometown...reported to vcp, they did nothing to remove it from their database:

1/8/16 Goodwin Auction $23,677.20
12/16/15 eBay Listing $5,990.00 (FRAUD SALE)

eta: and on the flip side, there's another completely legitimate one that did sell on 8/4/15 that is not listed on vcp.

i remember that day very whale! ; )

Side question. Can you please tell me what VCP and BIN is?
Thanks.

Originally Posted by jmb

How is it that the beat to hell cards are always centered perfectly ?

Originally Posted by MattyC

I have noticed the exact same thing! It seems whenever I am seeking a card, I encounter a beat one that has ultra rare centering. Hysterical.

Just to make you guys feel better, here is another rough one that doesn't have perfect centering. Not sure what difference it would make on this card, but I assume it wouldn't be much?

[Bored5000]

VCP = vintagecardprices.com. It is a subscription website that lists previous sale prices for cards by grade.

BIN = Buy It Now on eBay or other fixed price listing.

[irv]

Originally Posted by Bored5000

VCP = vintagecardprices.com. It is a subscription website that lists previous sale prices for cards by grade.

BIN = Buy It Now on eBay or other fixed price listing.

Thank you!

[1952boyntoncollector]

in this climate..who the heck would pay 400k for a Mantle..but there is insider trading in the stock market too.....so wherever you look there is corruptness out there with a capital C

[Bored5000]

Originally Posted by irv

Thank you!

Glad to help.

[Bestdj777]

Delete.

[pokerplyr80]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

in this climate..who the heck would pay 400k for a Mantle..but there is insider trading in the stock market too.....so wherever you look there is corruptness out there with a capital C

I doubt the Mastro information release will have much of an impact on the high end 52 Mantle market. I'd be surprised if the next PSA 8 goes for less than 500k.

[Bestdj777]

Originally Posted by pokerplyr80

I doubt the Mastro information release will have much of an impact on the high end 52 Mantle market. I'd be surprised if the next PSA 8 goes for less than 500k.

Agreed. I doubt it will have any impact at all on it. It's an iconic card and the prices aren't going anywhere anytime soon--and I say that as someone that bought in before the recent price increase and doesn't really care where the prices end up. In fact, I'd almost prefer if they started to tank as there is one 1952 Topps example that I passed up years ago that I've always wanted to see come up for sale again, and preferable at a price close to where it was at that time....