Thoughts on Kaepernick & the national anthem

[SAllen2556]

Originally Posted by packs

In Minnesota, where Philando Castile was shot dead for no reason, 47 percent of all arrests were African Americans. Do you know how much of the population African Americans make up? 7 percent. Are you seriously suggesting 7 percent of the population are in fact committing nearly 50 percent of all crime? Or is it possible that the 7 percent of the population are held to a different standard than the other 93 percent?

In the NBA, 77% of all fouls are called on African Americans. Therefore, NBA officials must be racists, right? Oh wait, 77% of the NBA is made up of African Americans. Do poorer people drive crappier cars which in turn get pulled over more often? Most certainly.

And in one quick google search I found stats that disagree with yours. This site has crime stats for Minnesota broken down by race. Go to page 63. https://dps.mn.gov/divisions/bca/bca...Crime-Book.pdf

It lists the crimes by race. Whites outnumber Afr. Americans by more than 2 to 1.

Also, according to the Innocence Project the number 1 reason for wrongful convictions is false identification, not racism! In fact, false identification was the cause in over 75% of the cases.

Betting you don't respond directly to what's stated above. But maybe you're different than others on the far left. Let's see.

[packs]

Two things for you:

1. I was talking about the area in which Castile was stopped and murdered, not the state as a whole.

2. The issue with identification is simple: it was the black guy, officer. Except, surprise, it wasn't. Or, alternately, it was a black guy, officer. Probably that black guy that you happen to put in front of me, but maybe not.

[tschock]

Originally Posted by packs

2. The issue with identification is simple: it was the black guy, officer. Except, surprise, it wasn't.

So you're saying that of the 212, 159 (75%) were in there because a white person committed the crime instead?

[packs]

I would never suggest that because that's insane to suggest. What I am suggesting is that there are plenty of people out there who see one black guy as all black guys. It wouldn't matter who you put in front of them, if they're black that was probably the guy.

[tschock]

Originally Posted by packs

I would never suggest that because that's insane to suggest. What I am suggesting is that there are plenty of people out there who see one black guy as all black guys. It wouldn't matter who you put in front of them, if they're black that was probably the guy.

You did, before you edited your post to add "Or, alternately, it was a black guy, officer. Probably that black guy that you happen to put in front of me, but maybe not." Fair enough.

So let me ask. What is the breakdown for how many of the 159 wrongly identified were identified by a black witness and how many were identified by a white (or maybe, non-black) witness?

[SAllen2556]

Originally Posted by packs

Two things for you:

1. I was talking about the area in which Castile was stopped and murdered, not the state as a whole.

2. The issue with identification is simple: it was the black guy, officer. Except, surprise, it wasn't. Or, alternately, it was a black guy, officer. Probably that black guy that you happen to put in front of me, but maybe not.

1. So you admit you're cherry-picking the statistics. The stats for the entire state of Minnesota would be considered much more valid to use if you wanted to generalize anything.

2. Well, even if the witness misidentified the proper black guy, it is very likely the criminal probably was still a black guy. You're certainly not implying that a witness who saw a white guy commit a crime told the police that it was actually a black guy. That's an argument a 12-year old would make.

[packs]

Originally Posted by SAllen2556

1. So you admit you're cherry-picking the statistics. The stats for the entire state of Minnesota would be considered much more valid to use if you wanted to generalize anything.

2. Well, even if the witness misidentified the proper black guy, it is very likely the criminal probably was still a black guy. You're certainly not implying that a witness who saw a white guy commit a crime told the police that it was actually a black guy. That's an argument a 12-year old would make.

I picked that statistic because I was talking about a specific incident that happened in a specific place. What does the rest of Minnesota have to do with Philando Castile's murder? He was murdered where he was murdered.

The point is, maybe there was no black guy at all. Maybe the black guy was a police invention in the first place. Maybe a witness didn't see anything. Have you ever heard of Louis Scarcella? Why don't you look him up.

Edited to add: I bring up the statistics I bring up in an effort to demonstrate that police bias and judicial prejudice are real things and not made up things that don't exist. That is my sole purpose in my posting, to say that these concerns are real concerns. They aren't opinions and they can't be brushed aside. It is a daily reality for many African Americans across the country.

[celoknob]

Maybe the NFL needs to implement "safe spaces" similar to some universities these days so as to protect some sensitive feelings from the open expression of Kaepernick's free speech.

[tschock]

Originally Posted by packs

Edited to add: I bring up the statistics I bring up in an effort to demonstrate that police bias and judicial prejudice are real things and not made up things that don't exist. That is my sole purpose in my posting, to say that these concerns are real concerns. They aren't opinions and they can't be brushed aside. It is a daily reality for many African Americans across the country.

Please study the difference between correlation and causation. You have a lot of the former but none of the later.

And to your point on the statistics you bring, since you brought it up, let me ask again. What is the breakdown for how many of the 159 wrongly identified were identified by a black witness and how many were identified by a white (or maybe, non-black) witness?

[packs]

Originally Posted by tschock

Please study the difference between correlation and causation. You have a lot of the former but none of the later.

And to your point on the statistics you bring, since you brought it up, let me ask again. What is the breakdown for how many of the 159 wrongly identified were identified by a black witness and how many were identified by a white (or maybe, non-black) witness?

I don't know how you could possibly expect me to know that. The Federal Government found both the Baltimore and Ferguson Police Departments and judicial systems to be racially bias. That was a government finding. How can anyone say it doesn't exist?

[tschock]

Originally Posted by packs

I don't know how you could possibly expect me to know that. The Federal Government found both the Baltimore and Ferguson Police Departments and judicial systems to be racially bias. That was a government finding. How can anyone say it doesn't exist?

Wow. Really? You admit you don't know the answer to that simple question. "2. The issue with identification is simple: it was the black guy, officer. Except, surprise, it wasn't. Or, alternately, it was a black guy, officer. Probably that black guy that you happen to put in front of me, but maybe not. " Yeah, great evidence you got there. I wonder if the FG used the same criteria you use to find your 'racial bias'. Of course, they aren't bias at all. It's all objective.

I would highly recommend not parroting everything you hear just because it's what you want to believe and do some critical thinking on your own. Again, correlation, not causation. Look it up. Or maybe reading comprehension is the root cause here?

Again, no one is saying it doesn't exist. However your claim is that institutionalized racism is the reason. Bar none other, from what I can tell, since you are the only one arguing against all other possible causes.

I can just imagine your solution to this. More government involvement in a problem they have institutionalized (according to you). Makes perfect sense.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by packs

Edited to add: I bring up the statistics I bring up in an effort to demonstrate that police bias and judicial prejudice are real things and not made up things that don't exist. That is my sole purpose in my posting, to say that these concerns are real concerns. They aren't opinions and they can't be brushed aside. It is a daily reality for many African Americans across the country. It's not something they've done to themselves and seeing that people have that POV concerns me even more.

You're so full of crap its ridiculous. People make their own choices and are a product of their choices. Just like dropping out of school is a choice. You keep overlooking that statistic.

For the life of me I dont know why Leon continues to let you post without your full name.

[ALR-bishop]

Nessa Diab....no, that's not packs , but she may have a role in this