Veterans Investment Group

USMC03VET · #1 12-20-2016, 03:50 PM

Rob,

Thank you for the "warm" welcome, it is easy for people to be TOUGH and haze in a blog thread...fortunately this is not the "real world" otherwise the conversation would have likely taken on a different tone and went in a different direction.

As much as it pains me to credit the hazers, I understand that this hobby is filled with folks who's sole goal is to manipulate and defraud collector's so the vetting process here and elsewhere is somewhat warranted.

Look forward to getting to know and doing business with some of you guys in the future.

Semper Fi!
Joe

swarmee · #2 12-20-2016, 04:28 PM

I think the main reason people questioned your account on eBay was because the first couple of cards you/your team bought seemed to be awful investments, and they were worried that you were going to bankrupt a military charity. The pattern of buying and selling seemed schizophrenic and from a low feedback eBay seller buying and selling cards with such high values, it really looked like a scam.
Glad to know you've joined our board. Welcome!

Aquarian Sports Cards · #3 12-20-2016, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by botn

Saw this thread and felt I needed to post. Joe does not know I am on this board nor does he know I am making this post. I know this board has seen its share of clowns and the hobby has seen endless amounts of scammers so I understand people�s skepticism when someone like Joe pops up but Joe happens to be a friend of mine (hi Joe�I know I owe you a call) and I can tell you he is anything but a clown or a scammer. One conversation with him and you will know he is a passionate, incredibly friendly and genuine guy who does not have a single bad intention.

Joe jumped into the hobby full speed ahead and not too long ago and hit the ground running. Most, if not all, of the high profile dealers and houses know him as does PSA and pretty sure SGC does as well. If people want to offer constructive criticism I know he would greatly appreciate it otherwise cut the guy a little slack and save the interrogation for someone who has earned it. This is a man who served our country and risked his life protecting us. I think he deserves and is entitled to much better treatment than he has gotten so far.

Quote:

Originally Posted by autocentral

Agreed. Joe is a great guy and definitely deserves better treatment than he has gotten so far.

I know Joe personally and he is a stand up guy.

-Nick

Quote:

Originally Posted by USMC03VET

Rob,

Thank you for the "warm" welcome, it is easy for people to be TOUGH and haze in a blog thread...fortunately this is not the "real world" otherwise the conversation would have likely taken on a different tone and went in a different direction.

As much as it pains me to credit the hazers, I understand that this hobby is filled with folks who's sole goal is to manipulate and defraud collector's so the vetting process here and elsewhere is somewhat warranted.

Look forward to getting to know and doing business with some of you guys in the future.

Semper Fi!
Joe

I consider my words quite carefully, and make a very concerted effort to comport myself the same online as I would in person. I think I was very respectful and businesslike in my message. I made no accusations and certainly didn't question anyone's integrity even by implication. My tone if you and I, Joe, were standing two feet from each other, would not have changed one iota. I merely was asking you to look at the situation from the perspective of someone who DOESN'T know you, which I think to some degree you have done.

I'll take your word for it that there is some reason you can't share your full name (though why you insist on calling it your "personal information" is beyond me) and the fact that you have long-time reputable members standing up for you obviously means a lot. I wish you the best of luck in your hobby endeavors

Exhibitman · #4 12-21-2016, 08:54 AM

Well, Joe, I think you'd face the same reactions face to face as here. As a professional cynic (attorney) and amateur misanthrope I want to explain to you why I read an intro like yours on eBay and the alarm bells go off immediately.

First of all there are the myriad fraud and scam sellers who cloak their activities in asinine stories about grampy's attic find that is always a Wagner or Lajoie yet never a Clyde Klutz. They have no hobby credibility and no eBay experience yet they expect big money from people they don't know. An auction house called Coaches Corner built its entire business on defrauding the gullible with big ticket fake autographs.

Then there are the sellers who sell fake stuff with the tag line God Bless. Never seen one yet invoking the Lord in commerce who wasn't a crook.

Finally there are the sellers who cloak their commerce in charity or service to country. That is how you came across on eBay.

You are a vet. Good for you. A grateful nation salutes your service in many ways and contexts. Using your status as an effort to bypass developing real credibility on eBay or in the hobby doesn't play for many here who are too polite or afraid of self-righteous backlash to say it outright. I have no such qualms. In the context of an eBay seller, I don't care what you did or did not do: I don't know you and your accomplishments outside the hobby are irrelevant, unprovable and anonymous, especially when you are asking strangers for money. I've seen and sued too many con artists to take what you or anyone else says on its face before handing over the cheddar. You may not have considered this but your marketing appears to many to be a crass effort to monetize your military service.

Please consider the above in the context of an open and frank discussion of the reaction your eBay listings provoked.

Snapolit1 · #5 12-21-2016, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Well, Joe, I think you'd face the same reactions face to face as here. As a professional cynic (attorney) and amateur misanthrope I want to explain to you why I read an intro like yours on eBay and the alarm bells go off immediately.

First of all there are the myriad fraud and scam sellers who cloak their activities in asinine stories about grampy's attic find that is always a Wagner or Lajoie yet never a Clyde Klutz. They have no hobby credibility and no eBay experience yet they expect big money from people they don't know. An auction house called Coaches Corner built its entire business on defrauding the gullible with big ticket fake autographs.

Then there are the sellers who sell fake stuff with the tag line God Bless. Never seen one yet invoking the Lord in commerce who wasn't a crook.

Finally there are the sellers who cloak their commerce in charity or service to country. That is how you came across on eBay.

You are a vet. Good for you. A grateful nation salutes your service in many ways and contexts. Using your status as an effort to bypass developing real credibility on eBay or in the hobby doesn't play for many here who are too polite or afraid of self-righteous backlash to say it outright. I have no such qualms. In the context of an eBay seller, I don't care what you did or did not do: I don't know you and your accomplishments outside the hobby are irrelevant, unprovable and anonymous, especially when you are asking strangers for money. I've seen and sued too many con artists to take what you or anyone else says on its face before handing over the cheddar. You may not have considered this but your marketing appears to many to be a crass effort to monetize your military service.

Please consider the above in the context of an open and frank discussion of the reaction your eBay listings provoked.

+1. I appreciate vets and thank them. I don't like seeing it monetized as a business factor. My dad was a vet and a hero police officer and he was the last person to mention either of them. And my alarm bells go off real high when someone wants to use veteran status for some commercial or as a prestige factor and then refuses to provide their real name like most people on this board have. My experience in life is that the true heroes are people who never bring it up, and the people who bring it it up nonstop are more often than not working some kind of angle.
Joe could be a real nice guy and a good guy to deal with and the veteran thing could still be a complete crock. Guess no one will know any more than that.

EvilKing00 · #6 12-21-2016, 10:30 AM

Hey joe,

i totally understand the reason for this thread as your a "new" seller, selling high end cards with a ebay name a scammer would love to use.

But having respected members of net54 vouch for you is good enough for me.

Welcome to the board, hope to see you post in other threads besides this one lol

Thanks for your service

Peter_Spaeth · #7 12-21-2016, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

+1. I appreciate vets and thank them. I don't like seeing it monetized as a business factor. My dad was a vet and a hero police officer and he was the last person to mention either of them. And my alarm bells go off real high when someone wants to use veteran status for some commercial or as a prestige factor and then refuses to provide their real name like most people on this board have. My experience in life is that the true heroes are people who never bring it up, and the people who bring it it up nonstop are more often than not working some kind of angle.
Joe could be a real nice guy and a good guy to deal with and the veteran thing could still be a complete crock. Guess no one will know any more than that.

Perhaps instead of speculating that what Joe says could be a "crock" you could have taken him up on his invitation to message him (or call him) and make a more informed judgment (post 23). I did, and I believe him to be exactly who he says he is.

As for the propriety of mentioning his military background and the nature of his group, that's an individual judgment call, but personally I am willing to give a veteran the benefit of the doubt and I certainly would not impugn his motive.

botn · #8 12-21-2016, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

+1. I appreciate vets and thank them. I don't like seeing it monetized as a business factor. My dad was a vet and a hero police officer and he was the last person to mention either of them. And my alarm bells go off real high when someone wants to use veteran status for some commercial or as a prestige factor and then refuses to provide their real name like most people on this board have. My experience in life is that the true heroes are people who never bring it up, and the people who bring it it up nonstop are more often than not working some kind of angle.
Joe could be a real nice guy and a good guy to deal with and the veteran thing could still be a complete crock. Guess no one will know any more than that.

Speak for yourself when you state, "Guess no one will know any more than that." There are many who know that Joe is totally on the up and up. And Joe did provide his real name. I assume you are implying that somehow he would have been more legit if he had provided a last name, which is not an obligation in order to post here. I know our minds tend to gravitate to the worst possible scenario but most of us are civilians and have not served in the military. Think for a moment that there might possibly be other reasons why Joe does not want to put his last name all over the internet. And As Peter suggested, you could have taken a few minutes to contact Joe directly which in all likelihood would have resolved your concerns. I know it is a lot more fun to speculate and act on those speculations but you invested enough time reading, following and contributing to the post, what harm would it be to make a quick call?

CollectingAmericasPastime · #9 12-21-2016, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

+1. I appreciate vets and thank them. I don't like seeing it monetized as a business factor. My dad was a vet and a hero police officer and he was the last person to mention either of them. And my alarm bells go off real high when someone wants to use veteran status for some commercial or as a prestige factor and then refuses to provide their real name like most people on this board have. My experience in life is that the true heroes are people who never bring it up, and the people who bring it it up nonstop are more often than not working some kind of angle.
Joe could be a real nice guy and a good guy to deal with and the veteran thing could still be a complete crock. Guess no one will know any more than that.

All veterans are heroes for sacrificing part(s) of their lives for this country. Lots of veterans wear their veteran hats in public, all of the time, because they are proud of their service. Are they working some kind of angle? Maybe Joe is stating that he's a veteran because he's proud of his service. Maybe he knows that some people simply like to promote/donate to/help veteran-operated organizations. I don't think that's a bad thing, as long as there is proof of the donations being used properly.

I don't mind a veteran using their military service to promote something. I mind a company using "patriotism" to promote/sell something. There's a difference.

Throughout this thread, Joe has been vouched for by some great members. Along with that, he's extended the offer for people to reach out to him directly with any concerns, questions, etc.That is pretty respectable in my eyes.

Joe, thank you very much for your service. God Bless you, yours, and America.

Snapolit1 · #10 12-21-2016, 04:04 PM

Joe and I traded messages today and his was very informative and civil. I really appreciated it. I confess I'm suspicious of people's motives when I hear them coming out of the box with testimonials to things like military record of service, but perhaps in the realms Joe operates in that is not unusual at all. I appreciated his message and based on what he told me wouldn't hesitate to do business with him.

Perhaps the wisest thing I heard this year was uttered by some retired DC politician (believe it or not). He was reflecting on a career in government and he said one thing he always cautions people about it is "judge someone by their actions . . . by what they do . . . don't judge them by what you think their motives were. Because you maybe totally 100% wrong in why you think someone acted the way they did." I've thought of that often and it's really true. Signed, Trying to be a better person in 2017.

Luke · #11 12-21-2016, 04:13 PM

I wish you the best Joe, thanks for your service.

You guys might consider changing the name and re-branding though. If I had never seen this thread, I would just see the name and assume it was a scammer's account (based on the name and low feedback). It's unfortunate that so many scammers have used military and religious taglines, but they have kind of poisoned the well in that regard. Of course once you build a solid reputation, first impressions will be less of an issue.

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