T206 Reference / Reflections.....Tuesday Nite Trivia

sreader3 · #1 06-26-2017, 12:57 PM

Hi Ted and Sean,

Nothing to add to Ted's P42 list.

I keep thinking I have seen Murray (Portrait) P42 some time in the distant past but you know how the mind can play tricks about such things. I'm probably confusing it with Schlei (Portrait) or Seymour (Portrait).

Scot

tedzan · #2 06-26-2017, 08:54 PM

I too, some years back thought I has seen a PIEDMONT 460/42 of Murray (portrait).

Since then, though, I realize I was mistaken.

TED Z
.

tedzan · #3 06-26-2017, 08:56 PM

* * * * * * * * T206 Reference, Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * *

. .

Connie Mack was a staunch anti-tobacco guy, who did not want his image portrayed on tobacco cards. **

Here's his E96 card. And, of course he can be found on various E-type cards. One of notoriety is the E104-1 set which features the 1910 World Champions A's.
Connie Mack was quite thrilled about this set of cards, as is noted in his Biography **. The same printing firm also produced the Cullivan's Fireside (T208) set,
which of course is a tobacco issue.

Connie Mack recruited most of his ballplayers from College. He felt they had better training and they could think better than players from the farm system. He
would often personally scout the College guys, or his brother (Tom) would.

** Note....Connie Mack (and the Early Years of Baseball), Norman Macht

Hey guys

I highly recommend this book. While reading it, you'll imagine the guys in your T206 set come alive. Almost every player from that era is covered in this book.

TED Z
.

tedzan · #4 06-26-2017, 09:13 PM

* * * * * * * * T206 Reference, Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * *

. .

Connie Mack recruited most of his ballplayers from College. He felt they had better training and they could think better than players from the farm system.
Jack Coombs is a perfect example of Connie's recruiting style. Jack was a 4 sport (baseball, basketball, football and track) athlete at Colby College (Maine).
Tom Mack (Connie's brother) scouted Jack during his College days. In his senior year (1905), Jack signed with the A's. His first 4 years, Jack's pitching record
was unimpressive. Then in 1910, Jack's W-L record was an amazing 31-9 with 1.30 ERA. Furthermore, he won 3 games in the World Series defeating the Cubs.

In the Fall of 1910, American Lithographic was designing their 460-only series cards; therefore, why didn't they include Jack Coombs in this series ? Given, the
tremendous year he had. I do not really understand why he is missing in the T206 set.

Incidentally, Coombs won 28 games in 1911, and 21 games in 1912. WOW !....80 games won in 3 consecutive years. **

Is that a record, or what ?

Incidentally, for whatever reason, Jack Coombs is not featured in the E104-1 set, nor the 1910 Cullivan's Fireside (T208) set, both of which feature the 1910
World Champions A's. The same printing firm produced both of these sets.

** ....Connie Mack (and the Early Years of Baseball), Norman Macht

TED Z
.

tedzan · #5 06-27-2017, 11:24 PM

* * * * * * * * T206 Reference, Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * *

Shoeless Joe Jackson

.

Connie Mack recruited Joe Jackson in 1908, and Joe started with the Philadelphia A's in Sept 1908. Joe's style just did not fit in with the "College Boys" on the A's.
Part of the problem (believe it, or not) was that some Americans were still "fighting" the Civil War. Check-out the players in your T206 set and you'll discover that
very few of them were from the "deep South". Of course Cobb is one of these few Southerners. But, Cobb was sort of a unique dude. **

Joe played in only 10 games for the A's (1908 & 1909). Connie Mack traded Joe to Cleveland in July 1910. 1911 was Joe's 1st full Major Lge. season (147 games).
Joe was amazing....233 Hits for a .403 BA. So, the real question to any one on this forum is....why wasn't Joe in subsequent T-card sets ? We know that American
Lithographic (ALC) was introducing T205 cards as late as the Fall/Winter of 1911. But, where was Shoeless Joe ? ?

Then in 1912, I would think ALC would have included Joe in their T202 set. But hold it for a moment....is this Joe in this T202 centerfold sliding into 3rd base ?

** ....Connie Mack (and the Early Years of Baseball), Norman Macht

Smoky Joe Wood

Info forthcoming....stay tuned.

TED Z
.

tedzan · #6 06-29-2017, 08:23 PM

* * * * * * * T206 Reference, Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * *

Smoky Joe Wood

From 1908 - 1910, Smoky Joe's performance pitching for Boston (AL) was less than impressive. Nevertheless, during this timeframe American Lithographic
was planning, designing, and printing the 388 different subjects for the T206 set. They included Smoky Joe's battery mates (Bill Carrigan & Tubby Spencer)
in the T206 set....but no Joe.
Interestingly, Smoky Joe is even featured in the 1909 American Caramel (E91-C) set. So, I really don't understand why he was not included in the T206 set.
Anyone on this forum have any thoughts regarding this omission ?

Wood won 23 games in 1911. Then followed it up with a 34-5 W-L record with a 1.91 ERA in that "magical" year of 1912. Furthermore, Joe single-handedly
beat the NY Giants in the World Series, winning 3 games (the final game in relief).

I traded my T207 Joe Wood card quite a few years ago (my regret)....so I don't have a card of him to display. I'd appreciate if some one here would post a
Joe Wood card.

TED Z
.

frohme · #7 06-30-2017, 07:13 AM

Per your request, Ted.

tedzan · #8 06-30-2017, 08:09 AM

Hi Mike

Your T207 Joe Wood is a beauty.

Thanks very much for posting it.

TED Z
.

irishdenny · #9 07-08-2017, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tedzan

* * * * * * * * T206 Reference, Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * *

Connie Mack was a staunch anti-tobacco guy, who did not want his image portrayed on tobacco cards. **
Of course he can be found on various E-type cards.

. .

Connie Mack recruited most of his ballplayers at from College. He felt they had better training and they could think better than players from the farm system.
Jack Coombs is a perfect example of Connie's recruiting style. Jack was a 4 sport (baseball, basketball, football and track) athlete at Colby College in Maine.
Tom Mack (Connie's brother) scouted Jack during his College days. In his senior year (1905), Jack signed with the A's. His first 4 years, Jack's pitching record
was unimpressive. Then in 1910, Jack's W-L record was an amazing 31-9 with 1.30 ERA. Furthermore, he won 3 games in the World Series defeating the Cubs.

In the Fall of 1910, American Lithographic was designing their 460-only series cards; therefore, why didn't they include Jack Coombs in this series ? Given, the
tremendous year he had. I do not really understand why he is missing in the T206 set.

Incidentally, Coombs won 28 games in 1911, and 21 games in 1912. WOW !....80 games won in 3 consecutive years. **

Is that a record, what ?

TED Z
.

Hey there Ted!,

No Doubt Mr. Coombs had an impressive 3 Year Run!
80 Wins in Just 3 Years Will Nevar Happen AgaiN....

Being a "BiG" Ed Walsh Rooter, I Do Know THaT
Mr. Walsh Had His Own Nice Run of 81 Wins From 1906-08(17,24 & 40)
I'm Not Sure if it's the Record?, Mr. Walsh Certainly Holds Many!

Howevar, As You Know "BiG" Ed Holds the All Time Record fir ERA(1.82),
And Mr. Coombs Bested the Spitballer by 1.32 to 1.59 during their 3 Year Runs.
So, my Hats Off to Mr. Coombs!
~ Very Impressive during his time ~

*And I Just Moved Mr. Coombs to the "Head of the Pack"
Of my "Who Should of Bin Included inta the T206 Set"!!!

As Always Sir... Dankz fir the Education, "TRuLy!"

tedzan · #10 07-08-2017, 08:38 PM

Hi Denny

Thanks for the information on "Big Ed". Walsh (as you well know) was amazing from 1907 - 1912.....168 Wins. That's an average of 24 Wins per season !

Hey guy, we here in Pennsylvania have produced a lot of great ballplayers throughout the years. Dare I say the T206 set consists of more Pennsylvanians
than from any other state in the country back then.

Yes, for 3 consecutive seasons Jack Coombs was a tremendous pitcher. But your guy was tremendous for 7 consecutive years.

Thanks again for the memories,

TED Z
.

rats60 · #11 07-08-2017, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by irishdenny

Hey there Ted!,

No Doubt Mr. Coombs had an impressive 3 Year Run!
80 Wins in Just 3 Years Will Nevar Happen AgaiN....

Being a "BiG" Ed Walsh Rooter, I Do Know THaT
Mr. Walsh Had His Own Nice Run of 81 Wins From 1906-08(17,24 & 40)
I'm Not Sure if it's the Record?, Mr. Walsh Certainly Holds Many!

Howevar, As You Know "BiG" Ed Holds the All Time Record fir ERA(1.82),
And Mr. Coombs Bested the Spitballer by 1.32 to 1.59 during their 3 Year Runs.
So, my Hats Off to Mr. Coombs!
~ Very Impressive during his time ~

*And I Just Moved Mr. Coombs to the "Head of the Pack"
Of my "Who Should of Bin Included inta the T206 Set"!!!

As Always Sir... Dankz fir the Education, "TRuLy!"

Cy Young won 97 games from 1891-93. Walter Johnson matched that from 1912-14.

Sean · #12 07-09-2017, 04:49 AM

And Grover Cleveland Alexander came close with 94 from 1915-1917.

Ronnie73 · #13 07-10-2017, 01:47 AM

While playing around with spreadsheet checklists for Polar Bears and Sovereigns, I came across something interesting that may or may not have been brought up in the past. The first part I'm sure everyone is aware of is that all Sovereign 150/350 cards do not exist with Polar Bear backs. The second part which I normally wouldn't think much into it but a magic number 55 comes into play. I combined the Sovereign and Polar Bear lists together. I then removed the Sovereign 150/350 cards. Then I removed the cards that shared Polar Bear and Sovereign backs. What I was left with was a list of Polar Bears that don't have Sovereign 350 & 460 counterparts, and a list of Sovereign 350's that don't have Polar Bear counterparts. Odd thing is that each list has 55 unique cards and the Sovereign's are all the Forest Green Backs. So, am I putting too much thought into this? What's everyone's thoughts that each list has 55 cards? All cards are from the Print Group 2 class except where noted.

Sovereign 350 Forest Green Backs that don't have Polar Bear counterparts.
Arndt, Harry
Bender, Chief (With Trees)
Brown, George (Washington) (PRINT GROUP 1)
Burns, Bill
Butler, John
Byrne, Bobby
Campbell, Billy
Cassidy, Peter
Collins, Eddie
Crawford, Sam (Throwing) (PRINT GROUP 1)
Cree, Birdie
Dahlen, Bill (Brooklyn) (PRINT GROUP 1)
Dineen, Bill
Donovan, Wild Bill (Throwing)
Doolan, Mickey (Fielding)
Downs, Jerry
Dubuc, Jean
Dunn, Jack
Dunn, Joe
Fiene, Lou (Throwing)
Hall, Bob
Hannifan, Jack
Hartsel, Topsy
Howell, Harry (Portrait)
Huggins, Miller (Hands At Mouth)
Huggins, Miller (Portrait)
Jennings, Hughie (Portrait) (PRINT GROUP 1)
Killian, Ed (Portrait)
Knabe, Otto
Lennox, Ed
Malarkey, Bill
Marquard, Rube (Portrait)
McCormick, Moose
McGinley, Jim
McIntyre, Matty
Mitchell, Fred
Mitchell, Mike
Moran, Herbie
Mowrey, Mike
Myers, Chief (Fielding)
Oberlin, Frank
O'Hara, Bill (New York)
Paskert, Dode
Phelan, Jimmy
Poland, Phil
Rhoades, Bob (Hands At Chest)
Rossman, Claude
Schmidt, Boss (Portrait)
Stephens, Jim
Street, Gabby (Portrait)
Summers, Ed
Sweeney, Bill
Thomas, Ira
Wilson, Owen
Zimmerman, Heinie

Polar Bear Backs that don't have Sovereign 350 or 460 counterparts.
Adkins, Doc
Arellanes, Frank
Barbeau, Jap
Barger, Cy
Bliss, Jack
Brashear, Roy
Bresnahan, Roger (Batting)
Burchell, Fred
Clark, Josh
Clymer, Bill
Collins, Jimmy
Davidson, Paul
Delehanty, Frank
Demmitt, Ray (St. Louis Amer.)
Dessau, Rube
Dorner, Gus
Downey, Tom (Fielding)
Engle, Clyde
Evans, Steve
Freeman, Jerry
Ganzel, John
Graham, Bill
Gray, Dolly
Groom, Bob
Hayden, Jack
Jones, Davy
Kleinow, Red (Boston - Catching) (PRINT GROUP 3)
LaPorte, Frank
Lattimore, Bill
Lavender, Jimmy (It was pointed out that this card doesn't belong on the list. So this list only has 54 cards.)
Lord, Harry
Maddox, Nick
Maloney, Billy
Mattern, Al
McLean, Larry
Milan, Clyde
Miller, Dots
Mullen, George
Murray, Red (Batting)
Nattress, Billy
O'Hara, Bill (St. Louis)
Pelty, Barney (Vertical) (PRINT GROUP 3)
Phillippe, Deacon
Puttman, Ambrose
Rhodes, Charlie
Ritter, Lou
Rudolph, Dick
Schirm, George
Schlafly, Larry
Schreck, Ossee
Shannon, Spike
Sharpe, Bud
Smith, Frank (Chicago & Boston) (PRINT GROUP 3)
Snodgrass, Fred (Batting)
Willett, Ed

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Consolidated access to the 15 - T206 T-brand (front/back) surveys....UPDATED	tedzan	Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions	58	03-13-2015 03:44 PM
Red Cobb survey of all its 30 backs....post your inputs ?	Archive	Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions	176	07-13-2009 04:17 PM
A survey about more surveys	Archive	Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions	22	05-13-2007 03:50 PM
POLAR BEAR subset....need your Inputs ?	Archive	Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions	50	04-06-2007 08:11 PM
T206 Wagner-Theory	Archive	Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions	24	03-20-2007 09:33 PM