20 retraction high bidder PWCC

vintagetoppsguy · #1 08-12-2017, 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by botn

There you go again with your agenda beating up on Brentsy. Wait until David James Attorney At Law hears about this!

Good to see that all is normal on a Saturday night and that you're being your usual douchebag self, Greg.

For the record, I have never defended bid retractions.

botn · #2 08-12-2017, 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Good to see that all is normal on a Saturday night and that you're being your usual douchebag self, Greg.

For the record, I have never defended bid retractions.

Is there anyone with thinner skin than you on the board? For once, try not to be so predictable.

vintagetoppsguy · #3 08-12-2017, 11:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by botn

Is there anyone with thinner skin than you on the board? For once, try not to be so predictable.

Not thin skinned, Greg, I just don't like being called out in a thread on which I didn't even post. Do you have some issue with me that you would call me out specifically by name? You obviously have an issue with PWCC and their bid retractions. I don't like bid retractions either because everyone knows that it's just a cover up for shill bidding. But the difference between you and me is that I have every right to voice my opinion while you have absolutely no right...

Quote:

Originally Posted by botn

Over, at least, the last 4 years I was advised and urged to not make a post like this so this comes as a great relief to me that I can finally write this. There is nothing noble in my decision to do this since my name is out there as a consignor with Mastro and associated with items which were identified as shilled but I feel I owe an explanation to those who were harmed and to those who call me a hobby friend. I made a mess so I have to clean it up.
During roughly 2005 to 2009 we consigned a few hundred thousand dollars worth of material to Mastro. Our consignments generally consisted of our more expensive inventory since that type of material did not seem to do as well on eBay�our only other outlet for retail sales AND auction houses like Mastro seemed to be setting record prices. At some point after less than stellar auction results and being completely incensed and frustrated, we decided to protect items rather than allowing them to sell below what we felt were fair values.

At no point did we ever conspire with anyone at Mastro on those bids. We never knew who was bidding on our items or what their bids were. I have no recollection which of our consignments I was the one to place a bid and which my former business partner bid on but since he is no longer here I have to take responsibility for our actions. Sometimes a top all would be placed and other times we would bid incrementally so as to not open ourselves up to being shill bid, as ironic as that might sound. In each instance our bids were made with the intent to buy back the item and a willingness to pay the buyer�s premium, as we did each time we bought back a lot. It did not feel right doing this but I never thought of it as being illegal.

Not to make excuses but the practice described above, of protecting a lot, was very prevalent at that time even among collectors. I will not call out anyone by name but some are current posters here who would frequently ask me to bid up their auction listings on eBay. I now understand why the government considers this shill bidding however our intent with Mastro was never to defraud anyone but to simply protect what was ours. Obviously we should not have consigned if we were not willing to accept that our items might fall far short of our expectations. I cannot take back what I was a part of but I can be a better person going forward. I am sorry to those I harmed and to those who I have disappointed.

As a side note the list may not be as accurate as the government might think. There are a couple errors that I know of in regards to items identified as my consignments according to my records.

Greg

It's always funny to me how those with shady pasts are the first to point fingers at others. I like the part though when you try to justify it by saying everyone was doing it at the time. Classy.

Now, do you want to STFU like you should have done originally or do you want to keep going?

botn · #4 08-13-2017, 12:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Not thin skinned, Greg, I just don't like being called out in a thread on which I didn't even post. Do you have some issue with me that you would call me out specifically by name? You obviously have an issue with PWCC and their bid retractions. I don't like bid retractions either because everyone knows that it's just a cover up for shill bidding. But the difference between you and me is that I have every right to voice my opinion while you have absolutely no right...

It's always funny to me how those with shady pasts are the first to point fingers at others. I like the part though when you try to justify it by saying everyone was doing it at the time. Classy.

Now, do you want to STFU like you should have done originally or do you want to keep going?

I did not call you out. I made a joke. I did not know you were off limits but given your borderline personality disorder I probably should have let you be.

Aquarian Sports Cards · #5 08-13-2017, 10:32 AM

To be clear it is NOT illegal for an owner to bid on his own items in most jurisdictions that I am aware of. That being said, we have a rule against it as we feel it is unethical, especially in an absolute auction.

Brent Huigens · #6 08-13-2017, 11:28 PM

This user ID has been placed on our block list. Thank you for bringing this to our attention.

Betsy Huigens
PWCC Auctions

irv · #7 08-14-2017, 04:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brent Huigens

This user ID has been placed on our block list. Thank you for bringing this to our attention.

Betsy Huigens
PWCC Auctions

Yet, as of 5:54 am EST, it still shows him as the highest bidder? What am I missing?

Peter_Spaeth · #8 08-14-2017, 11:31 AM

It would have been nice to see the bids cancelled, but what can you do.

Peter_Spaeth · #9 08-18-2017, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brent Huigens

This user ID has been placed on our block list. Thank you for bringing this to our attention.

Betsy Huigens
PWCC Auctions

And yet the same bidder managed to place a bid the next morning (first one on the list). Odd. (Brent's I mean Betsy's message is time stamped 08-14-2017, 12:28 AM.)

http://www.ebay.com/bfl/viewbids/401...p2047675.l2565

Bidder on the 63 Topps:
1***3(1023) $7,601.00 12 Aug 2017 at 5:53:45PM PDT

Bidder on the Unitas:
1***3(1023) $5,100.00 14 Aug 2017 at 9:58:46AM PDT

1952boyntoncollector · #10 08-14-2017, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

To be clear it is NOT illegal for an owner to bid on his own items in most jurisdictions that I am aware of. That being said, we have a rule against it as we feel it is unethical, especially in an absolute auction.

I actually dont have a problem if someone is going to eat the BP......on a 10,000 card..thats 2,000 for example...they really going to try to shill it again? The problem is that very few actually 'eat' the card.. They probably call the consignor and say if they want to sell their 100,000s of value of cards in the future they will not make them eat the card.

Aquarian Sports Cards · #11 08-14-2017, 10:09 AM

I agree and not sure on the legality of shilling AND retracting. Individually both activities are legal, but combined it heads into an area I don't feel competent to call.

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