Morris & Trammell Elected to HOF

[paul]

Jack Morris has the worst ERA of any Hall of Fame pitcher. Worse even than the pitchers who played in 1930 when the league batting average was .300.

[paul]

I finally found the vote totals here:

https://baseballhall.org/news/modern...t-results-2018

Ted Simmons fell one vote short. No one else was close.

[mattsey9]

Lost in all the hoopla, Ted Simmons was only one vote away from the HOF.

[orly57]

Regardless of where you stand on steroid-era guys getting into the Hall, I think we can agree that with no Bonds, no Pete Rose, no Joe Jackson, and no Roger Clemens, the HOF has lost its luster. Nothing against these new inductees, but they aren't in the same stratosphere as many guys who aren't in Cooperstown and probably never will be.

[insidethewrapper]

Congratulations to both Morris and Trammell, the 1978 Topps Set just went up in value. The Molitor/Trammell HOF Rookie Card. That doesn't happen often !

If Phil Rizzuto is in, then most should be in the HOF. If only the Ruth's and Cobb's were in, the Hall would be very empty. Still only a few hundred of the almost 20,000 players (1-2%) of all players. I don't think it is watered down yet.

[calvindog]

Steve Garvey was an All-Star eight years in a row and during that period finished in the top six in the MVP vote five times. He was a dominant player of his era. I don't see how Morris gets in and he doesn't.

[billyb]

Personally, I am thrilled about Trammell making it into the hall of fame. Yes his offensive stats are questionable. I got the pleasure of watching Trammell play during his entire career and to appreciate him not just as a player, but as a person. A leader on the 1984 team, as he was named team captain over strong personalities like Gibson and Parrish. But he kept his entire career unsullied of any kind. Just his defensive achievements, along with Lou Whitaker, as the longest double play combination in the history of the game. They completed more double plays then any other combination in the game. And both averaged over 280 for their career.
If you look at the players that support Trammell, that says more then anything else. He was well respected through the league. Hats off to Alan Trammell. You can match numbers to Trammell all you want, but you can't match many players to his professionalism.

Morris, I cannot agree more with all of you.

[btcarfagno]

Trammell deserves to be in the Hall. Jack Morris is pretty much a joke.

Tom C

[btcarfagno]

Great Fangraphs post here. He also did posts on the pitchers and the other candidates. Love how he mentions some of my cause celebre guys like Grich and Dwight Evans as well as some I feel need to get a longer look like Nettles and Reggie Smith and Darrell Evans.

https://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/mode...-lou-whitaker/

Tom C

[rats60]

Originally Posted by calvindog

Steve Garvey was an All-Star eight years in a row and during that period finished in the top six in the MVP vote five times. He was a dominant player of his era. I don't see how Morris gets in and he doesn't.

It certainly opens it up for Garvey, Murphy and Mattingly from this group to be elected over the next few ballots by this committee. Simmons looks like a lock for the next ballot.

[kailes2872]

Originally Posted by calvindog

Steve Garvey was an All-Star eight years in a row and during that period finished in the top six in the MVP vote five times. He was a dominant player of his era. I don't see how Morris gets in and he doesn't.

During the time that I started watching baseball 1978/1979, there was no bigger star than Steve Garvey. Popeye arms, playing in LA, married to Cindy - you could not tell the story of baseball in the '70's without him. He went to San Diego and didn't have the longevity of others. However, I am convinced that if he stayed in Los Angeles with similar numbers - and maybe a couple of bad end of the career years to add to the counting stats, he walks in.

In my mind, similar with Parker. Along with George Foster, Rod Carew, George Brett and Garvey, they were the biggest stars. I measure this by the baseball books that I would buy at book fairs in elementary school that would tell the stories of the players of the day. He had his mid-80's resurgence with the Reds as well.

I don't begrudge Trammel and Morris - and the '91 WS game 7 is forever etched in my brain - but when I think about that era and the true stars - I think of Garvey and Parker.

[soxinseven]

Originally Posted by kailes2872

During the time that I started watching baseball 1978/1979, there was no bigger star than Steve Garvey. Popeye arms, playing in LA, married to Cindy - you could not tell the story of baseball in the '70's without him. He went to San Diego and didn't have the longevity of others. However, I am convinced that if he stayed in Los Angeles with similar numbers - and maybe a couple of bad end of the career years to add to the counting stats, he walks in.

In my mind, similar with Parker. Along with George Foster, Rod Carew, George Brett and Garvey, they were the biggest stars. I measure this by the baseball books that I would buy at book fairs in elementary school that would tell the stories of the players of the day. He had his mid-80's resurgence with the Reds as well.

I don't begrudge Trammel and Morris - and the '91 WS game 7 is forever etched in my brain - but when I think about that era and the true stars - I think of Garvey and Parker.

Add Jim Rice to that list and those were my thoughts exactly. I still have some of those same books from my younger years. Good post...

[ccre]

Originally Posted by calvindog

Steve Garvey was an All-Star eight years in a row and during that period finished in the top six in the MVP vote five times. He was a dominant player of his era. I don't see how Morris gets in and he doesn't.

I agree 100%.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Mattingly's career numbers are pretty similar to Puckett's in a lot of respects. If you look at Baseball Reference for Puckett, they have Mattingly as the most similar batter, in fact.

[sreader3]

Originally Posted by insidethewrapper

Congratulations to both Morris and Trammell, the 1978 Topps Set just went up in value. The Molitor/Trammell HOF Rookie Card. That doesn't happen often !

Yeah -- I thought about this too. Is there any other Topps multi-player rookie card with two Hall of Famers? If there is I'm drawing a blank . . . .

[Mark]

Back in the day, Trammell was considered an elite player. A shortstop with an MVP and a 70 WAR is a pretty good candidate to get in, in my opinion.

[Jenx34]

I must be stupid here because I don't see how in the hell Ted Simmons belongs nor has a resume than Don Mattingly. The ONLY argument for Simmons is longevity. Basically Simmons stats give him about a 3 year advantage over Mattingly, yet it took him 7 more years to get there.

Mattingly had 9 Gold Gloves, 3 Silver Sluggers, an MVP, a batting title, 2 other top 5 MVP finishes... What Mattingly didn't have was longevity due to a back injury. And he didn't have a World Series Title.

Simmons was a very good catcher. Give him a bump because catcher production isn't typically as high as a 1B.

One can argue whether Mattingly belongs, but those that watched him regularly, know well his value was far greater than the stats showed. His defense was as good as it gets for any 1B ever. But I can't fathom an argument where Ted Simmons is closer to a HOFer than Mattingly.

[pclpads]

Based on today's vote, guess there is still hope for Darryl Spencer and Ray Sadecki. LOL! The only way either new electee should get into the HOF is if they buy a ticket. Pity there is no HOF for the "very good." Both would make that hall.

[Marchillo]

Originally Posted by orly57

Regardless of where you stand on steroid-era guys getting into the Hall, I think we can agree that with no Bonds, no Pete Rose, no Joe Jackson, and no Roger Clemens, the HOF has lost its luster. Nothing against these new inductees, but they aren't in the same stratosphere as many guys who aren't in Cooperstown and probably never will be.

Bonds and Clemens are slowly trending up as older voters fall off and new ones come on. They are getting in. I'd say 2 more years. Rose has been his own worst enemy in all of this but I'd like to see both those guys in as well.