OT: Hall of Fame - Edgar Martinez?

insidethewrapper · #1 01-24-2018, 01:24 PM

I thought the Hall had higher standards - only 2247 hits for Edgar. Let everyone in, except some of the Best players of all time ( Pete Rose, Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens ). These greats must continue to have their hands slapped.

Rookiemonster · #2 01-24-2018, 01:42 PM

Greatest DH of all time yes. Hall of famer not really. I feel like putting him in is a way of just putting fan favorites to please the masses. A lot of the greats from the 80s and 90s have been tarnished by the roids. So now the Hall wants to put in players that make you feel good. Like we can�t see the major holes in the halls inductees. No Rose no Bonds no clemens and joe Jackson ? Oh but we got Jack Morris , Alan trammel and Edgar Martinez.

Peter_Spaeth · #3 01-24-2018, 01:46 PM

Mussina is much much better than many pitchers in the HOF. I don't think Hoffman was that good personally.

damonh23 · #4 01-24-2018, 02:17 PM

man that's a tough one, though he had some big forearms! He could hit! But I'd rather see the guy with the most hits in the 1990s get in before Edgar! And that's Mark Grace!

71buc · #5 01-24-2018, 02:19 PM

Absolutely Edgar belongs.

Peter_Spaeth · #6 01-24-2018, 02:59 PM

From Baseball Reference's Similarity Scores.
Similar Batters
1.Will Clark (902.2)
2.Matt Holliday (894.3)
3.John Olerud (885.6)
4.Moises Alou (879.2)
5.Magglio Ordonez (875.3)
6.Bob Johnson (863.0)
7.Bernie Williams (860.3)
8.Paul O'Neill (852.6)
9.Lance Berkman (851.6)
10.Ellis Burks (850.2)

My opinion -- a definite tier short. Thome, not enthusiastic about, but I guess you have to say yes to a guy with 600 HR if he isn't named Sosa or ARod.

darwinbulldog · #7 01-24-2018, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

From Baseball Reference's Similarity Scores.
Similar Batters
1.Will Clark (902.2)
2.Matt Holliday (894.3)
3.John Olerud (885.6)
4.Moises Alou (879.2)
5.Magglio Ordonez (875.3)
6.Bob Johnson (863.0)
7.Bernie Williams (860.3)
8.Paul O'Neill (852.6)
9.Lance Berkman (851.6)
10.Ellis Burks (850.2)

My opinion -- a definite tier short. Thome, not enthusiastic about, but I guess you have to say yes to a guy with 600 HR if he isn't named Sosa or ARod.

Let's hear it for ol' Indian Bob, the pre-war Edgar Martinez (apparently).

btcarfagno · #8 01-25-2018, 05:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darwinbulldog

Let's hear it for ol' Indian Bob, the pre-war Edgar Martinez (apparently).

Except that Indian Bob was also one of the best defensive left fielder's of all time. He should be in the Hall before Martinez.

packs · #9 01-24-2018, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

From Baseball Reference's Similarity Scores.
Similar Batters
1.Will Clark (902.2)
2.Matt Holliday (894.3)
3.John Olerud (885.6)
4.Moises Alou (879.2)
5.Magglio Ordonez (875.3)
6.Bob Johnson (863.0)
7.Bernie Williams (860.3)
8.Paul O'Neill (852.6)
9.Lance Berkman (851.6)
10.Ellis Burks (850.2)

My opinion -- a definite tier short. Thome, not enthusiastic about, but I guess you have to say yes to a guy with 600 HR if he isn't named Sosa or ARod.

This is an instance where similarity score means very little if you ask me. Edgar put up an OPS over 1.000 5 times in his career, including a stretch of 3 seasons in a row. Will Clark never had an OPS over 1.000 over a full season. Neither did Holliday, Johnson, Bernie, or Berkman.

Ordonez put up a 1.000 OPS once, as did Alou, Olerud, and O'Neill (strike season).

Burks only accomplished the feat twice over a full season.

Martinez is better than all of them. His lifetime OPS is 933.

clydepepper · #10 01-24-2018, 03:52 PM

Anyone have a link to the tracker?

Andrew1975 · #11 01-24-2018, 04:30 PM

.418 career OBP, which is 21st ALL TIME, and top 35 all time in OPS. Those statistics are very significant. To me, no question he belongs.

perezfan · #12 01-24-2018, 04:32 PM

"Anyone have a link to the tracker?"

Here you go....

75% is needed for Induction to the Hall.

At the time of this post, 239 ballots are in, which represents 57.5% of the total. Traditionally, the support levels drop a bit as the late ballots are tallied.

This is updated in real-time. Here is the link....

https://onedrive.live.com/view.aspx?...AAsz3uDsmqy_Vw

Tabe · #13 01-26-2018, 03:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by packs

This is an instance where similarity score means very little if you ask me. Edgar put up an OPS over 1.000 5 times in his career, including a stretch of 3 seasons in a row. Will Clark never had an OPS over 1.000 over a full season. Neither did Holliday, Johnson, Bernie, or Berkman.

???

Berkman had three seasons of 1.000 OPS - 2001, 2004, 2006. He also had a .982 and a .986.

Matt Holliday had one season over 1.000 - 2007.

Correct that Bernie Williams never had a 1.000 but he did have a .997.

Personally, I think Edgar should be in the Hall. Two batting titles, career OPS+ of 147. Yes, he hit "only" 309 homers. So what? Rogers Hornsby hit 301. Rickey Henderson hit 297 and is renowned for his OBP but his OBP was lower than Edgar's.

Yep, 'gar was one-dimensional. But when that one dimension is SO good, you can overlook it. And, let's be real - he could have played 1B if needed. But the Mariners had an all-time elite defensive 1B (who could also hit) in John Olerud, so Edgar played DH.

parker1b2 · #14 01-26-2018, 07:37 AM

If we are going to go by OPS what about a guy like Fred McGriff who seems to get no love or the HOF.

McGriff: led the league once in OPS

2 times over 1.000
9 other times over .900

Martinez : led the league once in OPS

5 times over 1.000
3 other times over .900

Peter_Spaeth · #15 01-24-2018, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by insidethewrapper

I thought the Hall had higher standards - only 2247 hits for Edgar. Let everyone in, except some of the Best players of all time ( Pete Rose, Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens ). These greats must continue to have their hands slapped.

It's hard to take an institution seriously that excludes a 7 time MVP winner and 7 time Cy Young winner.

packs · #16 01-24-2018, 01:50 PM

I think it would be harder to take them seriously if they put them in.

kailes2872 · #17 01-24-2018, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

It's hard to take an institution seriously that excludes a 7 time MVP winner and 7 time Cy Young winner.

Especially with Selig, Pudge, Bagwell, and Piazza in. Oh and look at Ricky Herderson�s power in the early �90s while with the bash brothers. The selective outrage is nauseating. Let them in

Peter_Spaeth · #18 01-24-2018, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kailes2872

Especially with Selig, Pudge, Bagwell, and Piazza in. Oh and look at Ricky Herderson’s power in the early ‘90s while with the bash brothers. The selective outrage is nauseating. Let them in

Not to mention, again lol, all the greenie poppers we worship. Oh BTW Randy Johnson's best years were in his mid and late 30s. Just saying.

Rookiemonster · #19 01-24-2018, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Not to mention, again lol, all the greenie poppers we worship. Oh BTW Randy Johnson's best years were in his mid and late 30s. Just saying.

I feel that some teams had a PED culture. I think the mariners were one of those teams as well as the Oakland A�s. As players moved they took the culture with them.

darwinbulldog · #20 01-24-2018, 02:10 PM

I don't feel strongly about Edgar either way, but I wouldn't have put Hoffman in. I don't have any objection in principle to voting in a closer or a DH, but Mariano's the only 1-innning guy I've seen who warrants a spot in the Hall. I've seen at least a couple of DHs who were good enough, but on Edgar I'm undecided.

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