Ted Williams -full PSA and Green Diamond?

[Mr. Zipper]

Originally Posted by shelly

Not true Steve. John Henry and his girlfriend sold hundreds of pieces after his dad died. I know that both PSA and JSA turned down most of the items that came out after his death.
The problem with finding such pieces is they are not on the market place.
Steve, having a sticker from Green Diamond does not make a piece authentic.
I never thought that John Henry did the forgery. In fact the only bad pieces where photos not baseballs.

Are you confident in your source on this?

One of the TPAs you mentioned specifically told me they never failed a Green Diamond and did not believe JH signed for Ted.

[Ryan1125]

If there are indeed JH examples out there, would love to add them to my exemplars if anyone can share. Like many, I have always *heard* of this, but have never seen any proof, or even highly questionable Green Diamond pieces.

[tazdmb]

Just to add to the myth is the story that John Henry once told a dealer he was selling fakes of his father, in which the dealer replied something to the fact that "I want my money back then, I bought these Green Diamonds from you".

There is a good book "The last Days of Dead Celebrities" and one the features is Ted Williams. His chef tells how horrible he felt because all day John would make Ted sign autographs, even during his last few weeks of life.

Also, here is a copy of the John Henry "Ted Williams" Forgery:

https://www.robertedwardauctions.com...-signed-sheet/

[tazdmb]

Here is an old ESPN article that helps contribute to the "myth"

http://www.espn.com/sportsbusiness/s...8/1403337.html

But it is well known in the sports-collectibles community that Ted Williams' signature is among the most-forged, prompting some dealers to caution collectors about the so-called authenticated items, as well. Phil Castinetti, owner of New England-based Sportsworld, believes that even some Williams autographs authenticated by the slugger's son might be forgeries.

"There's no way all the stuff that has come from his companies is legit," Castinetti said of the volume of paraphernalia the younger Williams has sold to dealers over the years. "I would bet my life that there are autographs that he has authenticated and sold that he signed himself."

Castinetti said two experiences cause him to question the authenticity of signatures authenticated by John Henry Williams. In 1991, Castinetti said John Henry showed him the perfect Ted Williams signature. "John Henry and his partner Brian Interland would sign 'Ted Williams,' " Castinetti said, "and they'd laugh, because you couldn't tell theirs and Ted's apart."

Then in 1999, Williams made his final public appearance at the All-Star game at Fenway Park. "I saw him sign there, and he could barely write; his signature was a scribble," Castinetti said. "Then the next week, I see signed panoramic photos of the moment authenticated by Green Diamond, and the signature was flawless."

[shelly]

Originally Posted by Mr. Zipper

Are you confident in your source on this?

One of the TPAs you mentioned specifically told me they never failed a Green Diamond and did not believe JH signed for Ted.

I said that he was not the one signing. After Ted died there was a flood of Photos sold by GD. They were not signed by Ted and you are going back to early 90's a lot of guys that worked for the TPA people are no longer there to tell you if they turned it down or not.

[MikeKam]

Like Steve, I believe the whole "John Henry signing Green Diamond items" story to be a myth. There's no evidence of such other than JH claiming he could replicate his father's signature perfectly (also showing what seems to be his infamous stubborn side) and even then, the paper Steve mentions (which I believe is the one I have attached), is quite off.

Ted signed the highest signature, John Henry the other two.

[RichardSimon]

You can see from those examples that John Henry was terrible at signing Ted's name.
But Shelly has said that it was not John Henry doing the forging but that it was coming from Green Diamond.

[Case12]

Hello everyone. I got the Ted Williams today. It is amazing. The autograph alone is huge 2x7". Framed and matted it is about 22x25. A great pose. And it's authentic. $200 including matt and framed and shipping. Beautiful in my study. It is a pearl! You guys are great!! Casey