Alteration vs. Conservation Defined

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by calvindog

The reason I'm laughing can be found in these threads which make a total mockery of Brent's "Marketplace Tenets" on issues of alterations and disclosure of alterations. His refusal to acknowledge the 600 pound gorilla on his shoulders is almost Mastronian.

https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1290614

https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1292005

Suffice it to say, this isn't going to end well for him.

Just laughing remembering Doug Allen's Code of Conduct.

[irv]

Originally Posted by Brent Huigens

PWCC will soon publish our Marketplace Tenets, which describes the rules of engagement for transacting on the PWCC Marketplace and the commitments and responsibilities of all parties involved. Among other things, the Tenets will describe what cards we will allow to be sold on our marketplace and will draw a distinction between cards that were altered and cards that were conserved. Cards that are proven altered through physical evidence are not allowed to be sold, while cards that are proven conserved are indeed allowed to be sold.

In an effort to define an enforceable PWCC policy, we want to open up the dialogue with the community to allow for feedback before our official Tenets are published. Acceptable forms of conservation exist in all collectibles markets, ranging from coins to comics to fine art, and we feel it’s time the trading card market better defines a stance on what is acceptable conservation. The following is a draft of our current understanding of majority opinion, and this is subject to edit.

Conservation. PWCC believes conservation, as defined, to be healthy, sustainable, and supportive of the marketplace and the investors and collectors who participate. Assets that have been conserved can be sold on the PWCC Marketplace.

Conservation is defined as an act which returns an asset closer to its as-manufactured condition but does not otherwise enhance or artificially distance the asset beyond the as-manufactured status. An act which removes a foreign substance from an asset and does so in a way which doesn’t otherwise alter the condition of the as-manufactured product is usually considered acceptable and generally renders the asset worthy of professional grading. Dirt, glue, writing, wax and other foreign substances can be removed from an asset and the result is considered acceptable conservation, so long as the professional Third-Party Authenticators agree the asset is void of unnatural aspects induced as a result of the conservation. Lying flat a warped or bent region of a card (i.e. in a screw down holder), so long as it doesn’t disrupt the card’s natural properties, is generally considered acceptable conservation, whereas pressing a card and thereby changing its as-manufactured properties (i.e. thickness of the card stock) is generally not acceptable and may render the card altered. Laying flat a nonplanar corner, crease, or edge, so long as the card stock is not pressed to a state of artificial thickness, is typically acceptable so long as no other unnatural change to the as-manufactured card stock is discernable.

Alteration. PWCC believes alteration, as defined, is damaging to the marketplace. Altered assets cannot be sold on the PWCC Marketplace unless this detail is disclosed during the sale.

Alteration includes any act which meaningfully renders a change to the as-manufactured qualities of the asset, outside of the normal wear and deterioration inherent to circulation. Any purposeful material addition or material removal to or from the as-manufactured asset, outside of normal wear or environmental degradation, is generally considered an alteration. Trimming, recoloring, autograph retracing, rebuilding of corners or other surfaces, swapping of patches, or any other action which distances a card from its as-manufactured attributes is considered an act of alteration. Altered cards which are stated as such in a transparent nature are permitted for sale on the Marketplace.

Alteration is only ever officially determined by the presence of physical evidence. Speculation is not considered evidence. Evidence of alteration can be determined in two different ways; either in technical review by a reputable Third-Party Authenticator, or when digital content asserts beyond a reasonable doubt that an alteration took place (i.e. before and after photos of trimming, recoloring, etc).

Your comments and feedback would be appreciated. The best way to share feedback is to send me a direct email at betsy@pwccmarketplace.com. I will come back onto this thread to gather feedback periodically, but won't be responding to comments actively. Thank you!

Why don't you just admit that you are trying to change the hobby to a point where all "alterations" and "Modifications" are the norm.

There is so much gray area now, or what you're trying to accomplish, that most anyone will feel comfortable to do almost anything to a card now with no ill feelings in doing so. Imo, your policies to define open the door even further for doctors and the like to further their skills. Before long, everything nefarious will become acceptable.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Any "tenet" that says taking out a crease is OK is a crock, in my opinion. Man, the hubris.

[HRBAKER]

What, you don't see the similarity between a '52 Topps and the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel?

[oldjudge]

Who made this guy king?

[brianp-beme]

Originally Posted by oldjudge

Who made this guy king?

With tenets, he would more rightly be identified as The Landlord, and with this proclamation the rent is now due for all asset-minded investors.

Brian (Words are so darn confusing)

[sayheykid54]

The question PWCC is why? Why would you want your business model to involve what many view as alterations?

You are promoting the fact of ENCOURAGING collectors to "conserve" cards. Seems ridiculous to me.

[slidekellyslide]

Originally Posted by oldjudge

Who made this guy king?

The Lady Of The Lake when she held aloft Excalibur?

[calvindog]

If PWCC doesn’t acknowledge the altered cards they’re selling why would the card doctors acknowledge it? And what’s the point in expecting the card doctors to announce their work? After all, they slipped the cards past the TPG for a reason.

I think Brent and Betsy need better advisers.

[bobbyw8469]

Originally Posted by oldjudge

Who made this guy king?

He who makes the money, makes the rules.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by oldjudge

Who made this guy king?

I think PWCC is the King, The King of submitting doctored cards to PSA and then selling them. I'll bet 50% of everything he has been selling is doctored, IMHO

[RCMcKenzie]

Originally Posted by HRBAKER

What, you don't see the similarity between a '52 Topps and the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel?

This is the driving defense. My concern is not about an n162 that had stains cleaned off. It's about an n162 that is hot off the press. Just my .02. I mostly buy cards graded 3 and lower. Rob