PWCC Statement on Recent Card Trimming Concerns

[Peter_Spaeth]

Meanwhile, after promising there were no Moser cards in the current auction, they have taken down quite a few more. I suppose it could be unrelated.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/401777740858?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/352682160064?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/401778998920?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/352680563526?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/352680532262?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/352680537796?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/401777760222?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/401777757855?nordt=true

[Bram99]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Meanwhile, after promising there were no Moser cards in the current auction, they have taken down quite a few more. I suppose it could be unrelated.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/401777740858?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/352682160064?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/401778998920?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/352680563526?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/352680532262?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/352680537796?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/401777760222?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/401777757855?nordt=true

and many with the added comfort of a PWCC high-end or exceptional sticker. Maybe that was the error - they shouldn't have the sticker...

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Bram99

and many with the added comfort of a PWCC high-end or exceptional sticker. Maybe that was the error - they shouldn't have the sticker...

My understanding is they were from the outed subs.

[sportscardtheory]

I think if PWCC turns on Moser in an effort to deflect FBI attention from themselves, this could get very interesting. Especially if he can in turn, disclose proof that they were complicit.

I also think some here's questioning of the legality of committing fraud is pretty suspect. Using some of the mental gymnastics I've seen in this thread, you can dismantle any case of fraud under the guise of righteous intent, ie claiming someone wanted to conserve the cards doesn't absolve them of possible fraud charges. You don't get a free pass to commit fraud simply by stating you meant well.

[luciobar1980]

Yup, I came here to post this as well. I had my eye on this auction:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/352680537796?nordt=true

[sportscardtheory]

Originally Posted by luciobar1980

Yup, I came here to post this as well. I had my eye on this auction:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/352680537796?nordt=true

You can tell with a quick glance the card has been soaked. The backs are never that washed out.

[luciobar1980]

Originally Posted by sportscardtheory

You can tell with a quick glance the card has been soaked. The backs are never that washed out.

Hmmm.. is that not hindsight, honestly??

[Rhotchkiss]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Meanwhile, after promising there were no Moser cards in the current auction, they have taken down quite a few more. I suppose it could be unrelated.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/401777740858?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/352682160064?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/401778998920?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/352680563526?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/352680532262?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/352680537796?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/401777760222?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/401777757855?nordt=true

Thank you Peter. I’d appreciate if you keep posting links to cards removed from the auction and other outed cards on other forums - I am not a member of any other forums and I am a tech idiot, so I get all my news here and appreciate the links.

Meanwhile, the jacked T206 Jennings one hand AB 460, psa 6 is still live, which means they have not taken out all the bad eggs; I suspect they have removed a mere fraction so far.

[joshuanip]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

Thank you Peter. I’d appreciate if you keep posting links to cards removed from the auction and other outed cards on other forums - I am not a member of any other forums and I am a tech idiot, so I get all my news here and appreciate the links.

Meanwhile, the jacked T206 Jennings one hand AB 460, psa 6 is still live, which means they have not taken out all the bad eggs; I suspect they have removed a mere fraction so far.

Good that they did this, I was bidding on the Red Cobb.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

Thank you Peter. I’d appreciate if you keep posting links to cards removed from the auction and other outed cards on other forums - I am not a member of any other forums and I am a tech idiot, so I get all my news here and appreciate the links.

Meanwhile, the jacked T206 Jennings one hand AB 460, psa 6 is still live, which means they have not taken out all the bad eggs; I suspect they have removed a mere fraction so far.

right...another 1000 this auction and they'll be home free.

[Leon]

Card is gone, disregard my pm

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

Thank you Peter. I’d appreciate if you keep posting links to cards removed from the auction and other outed cards on other forums - I am not a member of any other forums and I am a tech idiot, so I get all my news here and appreciate the links.

Meanwhile, the jacked T206 Jennings one hand AB 460, psa 6 is still live, which means they have not taken out all the bad eggs; I suspect they have removed a mere fraction so far.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Leon

Card is gone, disregard my pm

Sounds like a good business, Leon's Card Removal Service.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Sounds like a good business, Leon's Card Removal Service.

Leon, can you see if you can get all the remaining cards for this auction pulled? I bet there are 100's still in there? He seems to like you best.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

Leon, can you see if you can get all the remaining cards for this auction pulled? I bet there are 100's still in there? He seems to like you best.

I doubt every single one is tainted. . If a card is obviously trimmed, or altered in a bad way, and is in a live auction, I will be happy to send Brent an email. He said in a post, some will believe him some won't, that he has counsel and is working with authorities. At least those are 2 good things. I am watching how it plays out just like everyone else. There is some great detective work going on. I am all for getting rid of fraud in the hobby. I hope those committing fraud are all held accountable. It only helps all of the good collectors/dealers/flippers/LCS owners, AH's etc..

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by Leon

I doubt every single one is tainted. . If a card is obviously trimmed, or altered in a bad way, and is in a live auction, I will be happy to send Brent an email. He said in a post, some will believe him some won't, that he has counsel and is working with authorities. At least those are 2 good things. I am watching how it plays out just like everyone else. There is some great detective work going on. I am all for getting rid of fraud in the hobby. I hope those committing fraud are all held accountable. It only helps all of the good collectors/dealers/flippers/LCS owners, AH's etc..

Not sure if it was this thread or a few of the others... it’s getting tough to keep track...

But Brent was asked multiple times which branch of law enforcement he is working with. Has he provided an answer? Is it the FBI, Local Police, State Police, Internet Police? Or perhaps it’s the branch of law enforcement OJ used to find the Real Killer. Perhaps we shouldn’t set our hopes too high.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Leon

I doubt every single one is tainted. . If a card is obviously trimmed, or altered in a bad way, and is in a live auction, I will be happy to send Brent an email. He said in a post, some will believe him some won't, that he has counsel and is working with authorities. At least those are 2 good things. I am watching how it plays out just like everyone else. There is some great detective work going on. I am all for getting rid of fraud in the hobby. I hope those committing fraud are all held accountable. It only helps all of the good collectors/dealers/flippers/LCS owners, AH's etc..

Respectfully, to me knowingly enabling a card doctor (even one) for a decade makes one a fraudster, and if one wants to get rid of fraud in the hobby, one should not associate or affiliate with fraudsters. Just my opinion.

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by Leon

I doubt every single one is tainted. . If a card is obviously trimmed, or altered in a bad way, and is in a live auction, I will be happy to send Brent an email. He said in a post, some will believe him some won't, that he has counsel and is working with authorities. At least those are 2 good things. I am watching how it plays out just like everyone else. There is some great detective work going on. I am all for getting rid of fraud in the hobby. I hope those committing fraud are all held accountable. It only helps all of the good collectors/dealers/flippers/LCS owners, AH's etc..

Oh here we go...i’m having flashbacks to reagans statements during the iran contra affair.

[Rhotchkiss]

Originally Posted by Leon

Card is gone, disregard my pm

Yes it is. Thank you, and I think another fellow board member helped as well. I am glad. One less bad one out there. I have no skin in that game (not my card and never was), but I strongly believe it used to sit in a psa 4 case and had brown crap under the right arm.

[Rhotchkiss]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

Yes it is. Thank you, and I think another fellow board member helped as well. I am glad. One less bad one out there. I have no skin in that game (not my card and never was), but I strongly believe it used to sit in a psa 4 case and had brown crap under the right arm.

And I agree with Leon, many - in fact, most - of the cards in pwcc’s auction are probably 100% fine. Bid accordingly or boycott altogether, but I do fear collateral damage that comes from this.

[irv]

Originally Posted by joshuanip

Good that they did this, I was bidding on the Red Cobb.

Just curious but were you aware of what is currently going on with PWCC and PSA prior to bidding on that card or was it a card you knew was coming up long before this latest scandal came to light?

[Republicaninmass]

Originally Posted by irv

Just curious but were you aware of what is currently going on with PWCC and PSA prior to bidding on that card or was it a card you knew was coming up long before this latest scandal came to light?

IMO NOBODY aware of the current climate can come bellyaching here or to PSA, if any PWCC card bid on from today forward is found to be altered, regardless of the grade assigned by a TPG.

[joshuanip]

Originally Posted by irv

Just curious but were you aware of what is currently going on with PWCC and PSA prior to bidding on that card or was it a card you knew was coming up long before this latest scandal came to light?

I was an aware, as much as my fellow bidders. Also aware if something was wrong with the card, I’d return it...
(But I guess that carries a bit of default risk)

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Meanwhile, after promising there were no Moser cards in the current auction, they have taken down quite a few more. I suppose it could be unrelated.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/401777740858?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/352682160064?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/401778998920?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/352680563526?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/352680532262?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/352680537796?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/401777760222?nordt=true
https://www.ebay.com/itm/401777757855?nordt=true

wow, that's quite a list of pulled cards there. I hope that gives everyone a scope of this problem created and 10 years running. These cards and others just like it, month after month after month. All those conservators better have paid their taxes on that income... Thanks for pulling these and the Wagner. If it had happened 3 weeks ago like you said it would have held more weight. Better late than never.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

wow, that's quite a list of pulled cards there. I hope that gives everyone a scope of this problem created and 10 years running. These cards and others just like it, month after month after month. All those conservators better have paid their taxes on that income... Thanks for pulling these and the Wagner. If it had happened 3 weeks ago like you said it would have held more weight. Better late than never.

More like 10 years ago.