Mantle 1953 PSA : here is why you should never put cards is heavy screw downs OUCH

[ruth-gehrig]

Originally Posted by megalimey

I did call them straight away , but they just read of their cheat sheet
and said they would be unable to give a specific reason why it received
authentic altered
and here is a direct quote for a Net 54 member in 2017

11-13-2017, 12:24 PM

bigfanNY bigfanNY


"I had a long talk with 2 graders who sat down at lunch table with me at national. We only discussed 2 issues min size requirement and altered. What they said about altered was most altered cards were placed in heavy plastic screw downs and pressure was applied to the card. Hence the term altered stock. SGC has the same term. I have had cards from Goudey's to 80's rookies get this grade.And for a time I like many used large screwdowns to display cards at shows so I accepted them at their word. Hope this helps.
Jonathan"

so I guess that may be the reason on mine

So they measure card thickness?

[megalimey]

Originally Posted by ruth-gehrig

So they measure card thickness?

I could not get an answer from customer service
they just referred me to their website about AUTHENTIC ALTERED

also based on what I have read , with decades of pressure in a screw down
cards can show evidence of pressure , and considered altered ???
its a shame the card has great centering sharp registration , no printers marks
apart from some white spots

[KCRfan1]

Nice card!

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Am I the only one seeing the dip in the top border to the left of Mick's head???

[icurnmedic]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Am I the only one seeing the dip in the top border to the left of Mick's head???

First thing I seen....

[megalimey]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Am I the only one seeing the dip in the top border to the left of Mick's head???

I never really noticed that possible , will inspect it closer when I get it back ? , its not really evident on the back , also would that be sufficient reason to say its altered , who knows , they would not elaborate
the Girl I spoke to in customer service
said many of calls received about submissions are from people questioning grade ?
and why it only got the grade it did, her answer I paraphrased , the card is looked at by more than one grader normally 3 different graders some times four , and the ultimate grade is then decided , if the majority agree on identical grade or in my case non grade , then thats the final determination , with no specific reason given other than an obvious qualifier, if it had one , PSA AUTHENTIC ALTERED never come with a qualifier , they just take your money and leave you hanging

[samosa4u]

Here is what you need to do:

Buy some 1953 Topps commons from eBay. Once they arrive, then compare their thickness to your Mantle. If you notice a big difference in size, then there is your answer. If you don't, then there might be another reason why it got rejected.

Originally Posted by megalimey

her answer I paraphrased , the card is looked at by more than one grader normally 3 different graders some times four , and the ultimate grade is then decided , if the majority agree on identical grade or in my case non grade , then thats the final determination

That's bullsh*t - you actually believe that? If PSA had that many graders examining a single card, then you wouldn't see all those trimmed cards sitting inside their holders. Think about it. If the first grader fails to spot the trimming, then at least the second one would catch it or the third grader would catch it, right? It's obvious that only one grader examines the card and he does it very quickly. Let's not forget that PSA has trillions of cards being sent to them each year and it's just not possible for them to have two, three or even four graders examine a single card - they don't have the time for this!

[megalimey]

Originally Posted by samosa4u

Here is what you need to do:

Buy some 1953 Topps commons from eBay. Once they arrive, then compare their thickness to your Mantle. If you notice a big difference in size, then there is your answer. If you don't, then there might be another reason why it got rejected.



That's bullsh*t - you actually believe that? If PSA had that many graders examining a single card, then you wouldn't see all those trimmed cards sitting inside their holders. Think about it. If the first grader fails to spot the trimming, then at least the second one would catch it or the third grader would catch it, right? It's obvious that only one grader examines the card and he does it very quickly. Let's not forget that PSA has trillions of cards being sent to them each year and it's just not possible for them to have two, three or even four graders examine a single card - they don't have the time for this!

please do not shoot the messenger , I just relaying what I was told
I did not believe her either ,
also
first of all the first thing I did was check the size against several 1953 cards I had 100% identical , did not check the thickness , do not have a micrometer , maybe being in heavy screw down holder squeezed the stock
but one thing I know If I tried to sell the card raw A i would get fraction of its potential value , (B) most people would question why I did not get it graded , so I did what made sense to me ,
at least its real , and has great centering all round .
I have had 3 decent offers , I wonder if that would be the case if I tried to sell it raw

[toledo_mudhen]

Originally Posted by megalimey

I never really noticed that possible , will inspect it closer when I get it back ? , its not really evident on the back , also would that be sufficient reason to say its altered , who knows , they would not elaborate
the Girl I spoke to in customer service
said many of calls received about submissions are from people questioning grade ?
and why it only got the grade it did, her answer I paraphrased , the card is looked at by more than one grader normally 3 different graders some times four , and the ultimate grade is then decided , if the majority agree on identical grade or in my case non grade , then thats the final determination , with no specific reason given other than an obvious qualifier, if it had one , PSA AUTHENTIC ALTERED never come with a qualifier , they just take your money and leave you hanging

Don't know what you paid on Grading Fee but am assuming it was pretty substantial. To not receive any type of explanation on the "why" question is absolutely ludicrous.

This hobby SO NEEDS an alternative TPG as PSA has long ago run out of their "give a shits"

[megalimey]

Authentic Altered - This means that while PSA is certifying that the item is genuine, due to the existence of alterations, the item cannot receive a numerical grade. The term altered may mean that the card shows evidence of one or more of the following: trimming, recoloring, restoration, and/or cleaning. Items receiving the "Authentic Altered" designation, in our opinion, are genuine with the presence of some type of alteration. This is done on a case-by-case basis only

mine could be
Altered Stock - This includes, but is not limited to characteristics on the card that appear to show some form of alteration such as paper restoration, crease/wrinkle pressing or enhanced gloss.

PSA could do better saying what in particular caused them not to grade my card , but with millions of submissions , and my approx 500 total submissions over a 8 year span ,I would be naive to expect tier one top level customer service. Their people were very polite and courteous but unable to give exact clarification

and I have another batch of cards on the way to them , fingers crossed, and FYI none of these were in heavy screw downs

[NYYFan63]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Am I the only one seeing the dip in the top border to the left of Mick's head???

Good catch!


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[BenitoMcNamara]

You are either user. ___meadows on eBay or bought this from him, I’m not using the full user name because I don’t want to get in trouble with the mods cause I know they don’t want people getting called out. But I’ve had this very exact card in my possession about 6 months ago and sent it back because the top had very clearly been attempted at being trimmed. I also purchased a koufax rookie from this user that was trimmed and I sent back. These purchases were made when I first started getting into vintage and was hoping for the best buying raw cards on eBay that had a great back story that made me think I was getting steal. But I was in fact getting altered cards.
In my opinion, this card was marked altered 1000% because of the top.

[campyfan39]

Originally Posted by benitomcnamara

you are either user. ___meadows on ebay or bought this from him, i’m not using the full user name because i don’t want to get in trouble with the mods cause i know they don’t want people getting called out. But i’ve had this very exact card in my possession about 6 months ago and sent it back because the top had very clearly been attempted at being trimmed. I also purchased a koufax rookie from this user that was trimmed and i sent back. These purchases were made when i first started getting into vintage and was hoping for the best buying raw cards on ebay that had a great back story that made me think i was getting steal. But i was in fact getting altered cards.
In my opinion, this card was marked altered 1000% because of the top.

**grabs popcorn

[megalimey]

Originally Posted by BenitoMcNamara

You are either user. ___meadows on eBay or bought this from him, I’m not using the full user name because I don’t want to get in trouble with the mods cause I know they don’t want people getting called out. But I’ve had this very exact card in my possession about 6 months ago and sent it back because the top had very clearly been attempted at being trimmed. I also purchased a koufax rookie from this user that was trimmed and I sent back. These purchases were made when I first started getting into vintage and was hoping for the best buying raw cards on eBay that had a great back story that made me think I was getting steal. But I was in fact getting altered cards.
In my opinion, this card was marked altered 1000% because of the top.

I am not the ebay user you reference , I am not the Original owner of the card never claimed to be i did not buy this card on ebay
but really what difference does it make whether you owned it or not , I own it now it says clearly it STATES PSA AUTHENTIC ALTERED , I am not trying to hide anything it could have been cut in half and stuck together who cares ,
I OWN it now , and when I get it my hands , I will offer for it for sale as is
in a PSA AUTHENTIC ALTERED HOLDER , so yes it could be trimmed at top will clarify when i get it , it could be squeezed , but its real authentic, and a nice looking card , maybe some one will want it for a fair price , if not I will keep it.
thats coming from some one with over 600 posts on net 54 , sold many things, bought many things , satisfaction all round buying and selling ,

[Hxcmilkshake]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Am I the only one seeing the dip in the top border to the left of Mick's head???

I missed it initially but yeah its obvious in the 1st pic...that's gotta be it. It's curved like a v neck t shirt.

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