Outed cards, now including a 130K gain on an Aaron rookie

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

I think you are Peter Chao (see how it looks when you say that).

You said what occurred rocked the foundation of the hobby. Do you mean the buyer or the sellers or both? Are prices at auctions getting rocked now versus before. Less submissions to PSA? No lines to get cards graded? The stock price for collector universe has gotten rocked? We already know no lawsuits.



Please advise as to how the foundation has been rocked. Ill say it slowly 'R o c k ed'

You’re an idiot and have the legal acumen of a flea. Which is why you are the only civil litigator aggressively discussing lawsuits against PSA and your own mother wouldn’t hire you. No one with any grey matter on this board will. You simply have no common sense. (See how it looks when I say that?)

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by calvindog

You’re an idiot and have the legal acumen of a flea. Which is why you are the only civil litigator aggressively discussing lawsuits against PSA and your own mother wouldn’t hire you. No one with any grey matter on this board will. You simply have no common sense. (See how it looks when I say that?)

well this idiot predicted you would bully on your posts and attempt to belittle.

Surprised you would resort to a 'your mother' joke. Guess thats why you are so expensive. Such original insults. I am not sure what yo mean about aggressively discussing lawsuits against PSA

I have been discussing the opposite. Have I not stated a number of times that I guess everyone is satisfied/refunded that NO lawsuits have been filed.

It seems you are the one that is stating that the hobby has been rocked and just because there are no lawsuits its a HUGE issue and worthy of litigation or other major fix. I also asked the questions about whether past sales at auctions shows how bad the hobby has been rocked as you stated which you didnt answer. I dont think recent auction sales reflect that. Thats a position that would be contra to discussing lawsuits.

It sounds like from what you are saying that you are encouraging aggressively discussing lawsuits. (see how that sounds) You just keep making up your own narrative no matter what i state and be a bully.


Also its interesting you yourself were critical of PWCC (one would think you were looking for clients) and now you represent them

Peter C lives!

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

well this idiot predicted you would bully on your posts and attempt to belittle.

Surprised you would resort to a 'your mother' joke. Guess thats why you are so expensive. Such original insults. I am not sure what yo mean about aggressively discussing lawsuits against PSA

I have been discussing the opposite. Have I not stated a number of times that I guess everyone is satisfied/refunded that NO lawsuits have been filed.

It seems you are the one that is stating that the hobby has been rocked and just because there are no lawsuits its a HUGE issue and worthy of litigation or other major fix. I also asked the questions about whether past sales at auctions shows how bad the hobby has been rocked as you stated which you didnt answer. I dont think recent auction sales reflect that. Thats a position that would be contra to discussing lawsuits. It sounds like from what you are saying that you are encouraging aggressively discussing lawsuits
(see how that sounds)

Peter C lives!

Jake, I'm expensive due to supply and demand. For the same reason you barely exist in the legal world.

These issues are very obvious to everyone on the board but you. Again, everyone is not satisfied or happy just because no lawsuits are filed. If everyone is satisfied and happy, why is there a present criminal investigation occurring? No harm, no foul, right? Why is there a statute of limitations on lawsuits? Why not just make the limitation period 3 months? Because that's all anyone needs to determine if they are satisfied and happy on a legal dispute, right?

The ramifications of the card alteration scandal will not be fully appreciated for a while as again everyone knows this but you. When enough 'before' pictures are outed and start causing most high grade cards to no longer be able to be sold, do you think that is a non-issue? And they can't be cracked out and resubmitted because the cards will just be outed again. If PSA is required to start replacing numerically cards from the registry and turning them into As, do you think this doesn't affect the hobby?

Do you think this is over just because one dullard says so?

And I'm sorry I hurt your feelings by calling you an idiot.

[Peter_Spaeth]

In my opinion the majority of altered cards are never going to be outed because they were purchased raw. Whether enough are going to be outed anyhow that destroy confidence in TPG high grade slabs altogether, we'll see.

[Rhotchkiss]

Was Mastro still operating biz as usual while under investigation, and if so, how long did that go on until Mastro closed up?

[benjulmag]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Whether enough are going to be outed anyhow that destroy confidence in TPG high grade slabs altogether, we'll see.

This to me is the 64 thousand dollar question. And it is very unclear to me that anything short of a new TPG that uses as part of its business model the outing of high grade slabbed cards in order to attract market share, confidence in the PSA slab will ever be impacted enough to provide the needed financial incentive to induce the type of litigation that could threaten PSA.

[JeremyW]

Anyone who is thinking about investing in high grade PSA cards needs to look at Peter's post (#274). From $60 to $4,000. should make people question what is going on.

[MULLINS5]

$60,000 value gain on an altered PSA 8 Bobby Hull rookie just surfaced on Blowout.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by calvindog

Jake, I'm expensive due to supply and demand. For the same reason you barely exist in the legal world.

These issues are very obvious to everyone on the board but you. Again, everyone is not satisfied or happy just because no lawsuits are filed. If everyone is satisfied and happy, why is there a present criminal investigation occurring? No harm, no foul, right? Why is there a statute of limitations on lawsuits? Why not just make the limitation period 3 months? Because that's all anyone needs to determine if they are satisfied and happy on a legal dispute, right?

Some states have 1 year or 2 statue of limitations by the way. Yeah can argue federal and other ways to pursue a case but why let your statute SOL blow if this issue is rocking the hobby.

The ramifications of the card alteration scandal will not be fully appreciated for a while as again everyone knows this but you. When enough 'before' pictures are outed and start causing most high grade cards to no longer be able to be sold, do you think that is a non-issue? And they can't be cracked out and resubmitted because the cards will just be outed again. If PSA is required to start replacing numerically cards from the registry and turning them into As, do you think this doesn't affect the hobby?

Do you think this is over just because one dullard says so?

And I'm sorry I hurt your feelings by calling you an idiot.

right so now you saying the statute of limitations didnt expire so its still early for lawsuits. What about 3 months before the statute of limitations or a year. I dont know about you but most lawyers dont wait until right before the statute of limitations to file anything as there is added risk such blowing an issue and thus blowing the statute or class action occurs earlier and there is no opt out along with hundreds of other problems in waiting to the last minute etc

The fact you are mentioning statute of limitations being an issue as to why no lawsuits have been filed does prove that you do think lawsuits would be filed since this current scandal is a huge issue but only because enough time has not passed no lawsuits have been filed. If lawsuits or not didnt mean anything why bother to bring up the statute of limitations.

So its not absurd I am bringing up the fact that no lawsuits have been filed. 2 years from now, if still no lawsuits are filed, would you then agree that its far from rocking the hobby in that it would appear most people are happy/refunded with the outcome..

Its ok you said i am an idiot....you spent time to write that and there is much supply and demand for your services so your time in so expensive that you still took what little free time you have to call me names and make a your mama joke. i am honored. Peter C lives..

[samosa4u]

Somebody trimmed AND recolored an $18,000 USD card?

You have to have a REALLY large set of balls to do that - larger than Tony Montana's.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by samosa4u

Somebody trimmed AND recolored an $18,000 USD card?

You have to have a REALLY large set of balls to do that - larger than Tony Montana's.

It's all relative. If you have millions, it's not much to risk particularly if you think there's a decent chance you'll succeed. People bet a hell of a lot more than that every day.

[MULLINS5]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

It's all relative. If you have millions, it's not much to risk particularly if you think there's a decent chance you'll succeed. People bet a hell of a lot more than that every day.

I agree with you, but I'm starting to feel like they know ahead of time what the grade will be before going through the trouble.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by samosa4u

Somebody trimmed AND recolored an $18,000 USD card?

You have to have a REALLY large set of balls to do that - larger than Tony Montana's.

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

It's all relative. If you have millions, it's not much to risk particularly if you think there's a decent chance you'll succeed. People bet a hell of a lot more than that every day.

Or if you have an in at PSA...

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

right so now you saying the statute of limitations didnt expire so its still early for lawsuits. What about 3 months before the statute of limitations or a year. I dont know about you but most lawyers dont wait until right before the statute of limitations to file anything as there is added risk such blowing an issue and thus blowing the statute or class action occurs earlier and there is no opt out along with hundreds of other problems in waiting to the last minute etc

The fact you are mentioning statute of limitations being an issue as to why no lawsuits have been filed does prove that you do think lawsuits would be filed since this current scandal is a huge issue but only because enough time has not passed no lawsuits have been filed. If lawsuits or not didnt mean anything why bother to bring up the statute of limitations.

So its not absurd I am bringing up the fact that no lawsuits have been filed. 2 years from now, if still no lawsuits are filed, would you then agree that its far from rocking the hobby in that it would appear most people are happy/refunded with the outcome..

Its ok you said i am an idiot....you spent time to write that and there is much supply and demand for your services so your time in so expensive that you still took what little free time you have to call me names and make a your mama joke. i am honored. Peter C lives..

I'm saying that the lawsuit issue is meaningless. That the lack of them does not mean people are happy. My point by noting that statutes of limits exist is to explain that not everyone who can sue MUST sue immediately as you are suggesting. How you, allegedly a lawyer who may have one client, cannot see this is stunning. I scored a $4.35 million settlement on a claim recently with a single letter. No lawsuit. Does that mean my client was thrilled because she didn't file a lawsuit? Do you not understand how this works? Ask Mastro's co-conspirators who paid my clients six figures if they felt a lawsuit was necessary to get them to pay back money they stole.

And if you don't mind me calling you an idiot, then I will again. You're an idiot. And yeah, I always have time for pointing this out, although, again, that no one from here hires a crack civil litigator like yourself surely makes clear I'm not alone in my opinion.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Not up to the standards of the old Point Counterpoint on 60 Minutes.

More like the parody on SNL, with Dan Aykroyd famously saying to Jane Curtin, Jane, you ignorant slut!!

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Not up to the standards of the old Point Counterpoint on 60 Minutes.

More like the parody on SNL, with Dan Aykroyd famously saying to Jane Curtin, Jane, you ignorant slut!!

"2 years from now, if still no lawsuits are filed, would you then agree that its far from rocking the hobby in that it would appear most people are happy/refunded with the outcome.."

Tough to have a cogent argument with someone whose only point is that nearly everyone in the hobby is actually thrilled that PSA is putting thousands of trimmed cards into holders simply because no single victim has individually sued a public company for the price of their worthless card. That's his only point. Peter, let me know how many people who lost between $500 and $10,000 due to PSA incompetence would be willing to pay a lawyer to sue PSA, knowing they can't join up in a class?

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by calvindog

I'm saying that the lawsuit issue is meaningless. That the lack of them does not mean people are happy. My point by noting that statutes of limits exist is to explain that not everyone who can sue MUST sue immediately as you are suggesting. How you, allegedly a lawyer who may have one client, cannot see this is stunning. I scored a $4.35 million settlement on a claim recently with a single letter. No lawsuit. Does that mean my client was thrilled because she didn't file a lawsuit? Do you not understand how this works? Ask Mastro's co-conspirators who paid my clients six figures if they felt a lawsuit was necessary to get them to pay back money they stole.

And if you don't mind me calling you an idiot, then I will again. You're an idiot. And yeah, I always have time for pointing this out, although, again, that no one from here hires a crack civil litigator like yourself surely makes clear I'm not alone in my opinion.

Thanks for calling me an idiot again Peter C. So now its school yard who is bigger than the other. Bullys dont care how people are treated in the world. Another school yard tactic So again you proved my point, the fact that only time is cited by you as a reason why lawsuits have not been filed shows that lawsuits are indeed an important factor. You are just saying its too soon.

My view is enough time has passed that people seem to be happy with the outcome or great lawyers like you write one terrific letter so no lawsuit is needed. I think we can all name instances in which a lawsuit did more than a letter .

I dont think filing a lawsuit now would be immediate as well. How long as it been? It appears 'victims' are happy how things are proceeding where they are happy or not worth filing a lawsuit at this point. There are problems in the world in which lawsuits are filed and there problems where none are, thus far this falls in the later category