Slightly OT - 2020 Modern Baseball Era HOF Ballot

AGuinness · #1 11-06-2019, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JollyElm

OMG, you are hilarious!!!!! Your dumb analogy doesn't even come close to what I was saying.

Well, my use of the word funny wasn't meant in the comedic sense. It was in the strange/perplexing sense. And I certainly didn't mean anything personally against you, specifically, when I posted. That's why it is funny (strange) to me that you would seem to take it that way.

Peter_Spaeth · #2 11-06-2019, 06:24 PM

Personal observation tends to be both anecdotal and biased which is why stats are very helpful. Now what stats you think matter is a subject for debate.

hysell · #3 11-06-2019, 06:43 PM

I like to KNOW {WHY } we hold catchers to such HIGH stats as a 1b, 3b or a of player ? Lets put Mantle, Schimdt , Gehrig behind the plate for most of there careers & lets see , how less stats , they would have ! To me if you hit 225 to 300 HRS, drive in around 1100 runs, or get 2,000 hits or 400 doubles , add catch a good game & can throw a little, that is GOOD ENOUGH ? HOFer catchers are Munson ,Simmons , L.Parrish ....Munson was well on his way, Simmons was a{SH } & the better hitter on this list .Parrish won gold gloves , went to ALL*STAR games in the 1980's & like Gary Carter , both had 324 career HRS, top 5 ALL - time at the catcher spot ?

JollyElm · #4 11-06-2019, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AGuinness

Well, my use of the word funny wasn't meant in the comedic sense. It was in the strange/perplexing sense. And I certainly didn't mean anything personally against you, specifically, when I posted. That's why it is funny (strange) to me that you would seem to take it that way.

My point was clearly that we saw these people play throughout most or all of their careers. We experienced these players directly. So with regard to your Albert Einstein analogy, in this case he DID travel at the speed of light. He (analogous to us rating these players) is talking through direct knowledge and not theoretics.

Mike D. · #5 11-06-2019, 07:26 PM

Two things I find interesting:

1. If you line up the players on the ballot by career WAR and highest % of the vote they received from the BBWAA, you get almost a perfect inverse. Sometimes we forget how bad the HOF voting used to be...historically they run about 3-4 �Baines� per decade!

2. Ted Simmons missed last time he was on the ballot (�veterans�, not BBWAA) by 1 vote

AGuinness · #6 11-06-2019, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike D.

Two things I find interesting:

1. If you line up the players on the ballot by career WAR and highest % of the vote they received from the BBWAA, you get almost a perfect inverse. Sometimes we forget how bad the HOF voting used to be...historically they run about 3-4 �Baines� per decade!

2. Ted Simmons missed last time he was on the ballot (�veterans�, not BBWAA) by 1 vote

Ted came sooo close last time, and all the candidates on this ballot have a legit case to be made to get enshrined.
Too bad the voters are limited to four votes each. This nugget about the odds that the four vote limit creates came from the Fangraphs story (which was originally from a Joe Posnanski article and is detailed by Tom Tango):

Well, if a player has a 40% chance of being on one ballot, his chances on making 12 of 16 is � get ready for it, less than 0.5%. That�s not 5% � it is less than one-half of one-percent. 995 times out of a 1,000, the player would NOT get elected. And remember, that�s assuming every voter uses all four of his votes.

Mike D. · #7 11-06-2019, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AGuinness

Ted came sooo close last time, and all the candidates on this ballot have a legit case to be made to get enshrined.
Too bad the voters are limited to four votes each. This nugget about the odds that the four vote limit creates came from the Fangraphs story (which was originally from a Joe Posnanski article and is detailed by Tom Tango):

Well, if a player has a 40% chance of being on one ballot, his chances on making 12 of 16 is � get ready for it, less than 0.5%. That�s not 5% � it is less than one-half of one-percent. 995 times out of a 1,000, the player would NOT get elected. And remember, that�s assuming every voter uses all four of his votes.

Yes, when you have a number of good candidates, the chances of any one of them getting the required votes is so tiny. I wonder if like with the Baines vote the voters will "discuss" beforehand and have a better chance of reaching consensus.

AGuinness · #8 11-06-2019, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike D.

Yes, when you have a number of good candidates, the chances of any one of them getting the required votes is so tiny. I wonder if like with the Baines vote the voters will "discuss" beforehand and have a better chance of reaching consensus.

That�s the big question, I haven�t seen anybody answer it in an article. Anybody know that answer? Do the voters make deals or arrangements on the candidates?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Peter_Spaeth · #9 11-06-2019, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AGuinness

That�s the big question, I haven�t seen anybody answer it in an article. Anybody know that answer? Do the voters make deals or arrangements on the candidates?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I don't know, but I question whether a group of voters this small should have the power to decide these issues.

glynparson · #10 12-14-2019, 08:46 AM

Parker was considered the best player in baseball or in the conversation from 1977-79. When was Edgar ever in that conversation? And Parker has one of the top arms of any right fielder ever. Up there with Evans and Clemente. I saw him throw out a guy on a ball hit to right field. He had a cannon. I have no problem with putting either in. Parker gets docked for his coke years or his numbers would crush Edgar�s. I know he doesn�t deserve any sympathy for that but it still exists in reality.

View Poll Results: Who should be voted into the Hall?
Dwight Evans	18	21.95%
Steve Garvey	13	15.85%
Tommy John	24	29.27%
Don Mattingly	17	20.73%
Marvin Miller	25	30.49%
Thurmon Munson	16	19.51%
Dale Murphy	25	30.49%
Dave Parker	11	13.41%
Ted Simmons	32	39.02%
Lou Whitaker	50	60.98%
NON of the above	9	10.98%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 82. You may not vote on this poll

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