Mets were 14-18 when Degrom started for them

[familytoad]

Ya, I wasn't saying that deGrom was a bad pitcher or was worse than someone 21-5 with a 5.00 ERA.
I'm just saying that its obvious that wins don't matter for individual pitchers and I'm indifferent.

Nothing was ever wrong with winning before. But those days are gone.
If a team decides to use a new pitcher every inning then no starting pitcher will ever earn a win ( Frank posted about this previously)
I think its foolish. But whatever...

There were plenty of pitchers winning Cy Young awards by winning games. And plenty of batters winning MVP awards by having high batting average and driving in a lot of runs. Suddenly that doesn't apply anymore.

Please consider removing thine self from my lawn.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by familytoad

Ya, I wasn't saying that deGrom was a bad pitcher or was worse than someone 21-5 with a 5.00 ERA.
I'm just saying that its obvious that wins don't matter for individual pitchers and I'm indifferent.

Nothing was ever wrong with winning before. But those days are gone.
If a team decides to use a new pitcher every inning then no starting pitcher will ever earn a win ( Frank posted about this previously)
I think its foolish. But whatever...

There were plenty of pitchers winning Cy Young awards by winning games. And plenty of batters winning MVP awards by having high batting average and driving in a lot of runs. Suddenly that doesn't apply anymore.

Please consider removing thine self from my lawn.

I also not addressing getting the W, whats interesting to me is whether the team gets the W. Afterall thats what you pay your pitcher for...for whatever reason if your team doesnt get wins when a certain pitcher starts and it happens over and over with a cy young winner....just wondering if that should matter

yes if SP is not getting deep into games that could matter, but then why pay them so much money. Running backs in the NFL just arent valued like they used to be pay wise...if Cy Young pitchers dont net their team wins and its more of the bullpen deciding everything..that would be interesting in terms of future value....

[packs]

I don't think the days of winning are gone at all. Look at Eduardo Rodriguez. He went 19-6 last year and finished 6th in Cy Young voting despite having an ERA up near 4.00 (3.81) and leading the league in walks. How else does a pitcher who led the league in walks get any votes unless wins still matter?

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by packs

I don't think the days of winning are gone at all. Look at Eduardo Rodriguez. He went 19-6 last year and finished 6th in Cy Young voting despite having an ERA up near 4.00 (3.81) and leading the league in walks. How else does a pitcher who led the league in walks get any votes unless wins still matter?

I not looking at his stats but what were the hits...walks mean less to me if there are less hits....walks are better to give up then hits imo

also AL era is a different animal than NL era..

[packs]

He gave up almost a hit per inning; 203 innings and 195 hits. None of his stats indicate a Cy Young season other than his win total, which was 3rd in the league. Every pitcher he finished behind had a lower ERA and more strike outs. Obviously less walks.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by packs

He gave up almost a hit per inning; 203 innings and 195 hits. None of his stats indicate a Cy Young season other than his win total, which was 3rd in the league. Every pitcher he finished behind had a lower ERA and more strike outs. Obviously less walks.

how is team do on games he didnt get the decision....

i know if there was a pitcher with his win /loss but his team was say 26-3 on games started by him...obviously didnt happen for him but you see where i am going ...

[MRSPORTSCARDCOLLECTOR]

Originally Posted by packs

He gave up almost a hit per inning; 203 innings and 195 hits. None of his stats indicate a Cy Young season other than his win total, which was 3rd in the league. Every pitcher he finished behind had a lower ERA and more strike outs. Obviously less walks.

His 2019 season reminded me of Rick Porcello`s Cy Young season of 2016. Normal average but not Cy Young. When I think of Cy Young winning seasons I think of Pedro Martinez and Roger Clemens not Erod or Porcello.
Also I think the Degrom season this year was kind of like Sale`s in that the teams lost so many of their starts is because Degrom and Sale go up against other team`top starters.

[nat]

deGrom's opposing starters:

Scherzer
Trevor Richards (?)
Kyle Gibson
Julio Teheran
Chase Anderson
Anthony DiScalfani
Chris Paddack
Sandy Alcantara
Trevor Richards
Max Scherzer
Clayton Kershaw
Zack Greinke
Antonio Senzatela
Jack Flaherty
Julio Teheran
Mike Soroka
Cole Hamels
Vince Valesquez
Sandy Alcantara
Tyler Beede
Eric Lauer
Lucas Giolito
Robert Dugger
Anibal Sanchez
Jakob Junis
Mike Foltywentiz
Jon Lester
Scherzer again
Merrill Kelly
Hyu-Jin Ryu
Luis Castillo
Robert Dugger

Not sure what to expect really, but that does seem like a lot of good pitchers. Matching up with Scherzer three times is tough (for both of them!) It makes sense that aces would match up with aces early in the season, but that as the season progresses you'd see less of it (guys get hurt, somebody gets tired and skips their turn in the rotation, off days don't match up). But for whatever reason deGrom does seem to have faced strong opponents. By my totally subjective "gee I wouldn't want to see him starting for the other team" assessment, I see 13 really strong opposing pitchers. That's just under half of deGrom's starts, so way more than you'd expect if pitchers were matched up randomly. (Or maybe they are matched up randomly and deGrom just got really unlucky.)