Who will be selected to the MLB HOF next Tuesday

[Jim65]

Originally Posted by Nunzio11

MLB just lifted the lifetime ban on deceased players. This could greatly affect the HOF. Haven’t read terms but can’t imagine it in effect this year since voting is almost final but imagine a 2020 induction ceremony with Derek Jeter and Shoeless Joe Jackson??!! For a sport in need of positive headlines that could be huge.

Not sure that putting a player accused of taking bribes to throw games would be viewed as positive.

[Mike D.]

Agree on Rose after he dies. He could be in based on his playing days with a note on his plague about his ban. I just don’t want to see that <insert your favorite 4 letter word here> at the podium in Cooperstown on a nice July day.

Maybe they need a “year of the cheaters” to get it all done at once - Jackson, Rose, other Black Sox, Bonds, Clemens, etc.

Some fans will see this as a long awaited correction, others a travesty (but one that is at least over with all at once).

These guys being IN the HOF would actually get them less attention after induction than being on the outside looking in.

I mean, look at Bert Blylevin.

[cardsagain74]

Originally Posted by Mike D.

Maybe they need a “year of the cheaters” to get it all done at once - Jackson, Rose, other Black Sox, Bonds, Clemens, etc.

That should say "the cheaters who got caught".

Whitey Ford has readily admitted to being Harris from Major League in his later years (doctoring the ball). Mike Schmidt was the incredible hulk from PEDs. And it's hard to imagine what else used to go on. Most of it was just accepted back then, as long as you didn't throw games to spite a backstabbing owner or get caught betting on games that you managed

If the Hall didn't have any cheaters, there'd be a lot of space open there

[mr2686]

Originally Posted by cardsagain74

That should say "the cheaters who got caught".

Whitey Ford has readily admitted to being Harris from Major League in his later years (doctoring the ball). Mike Schmidt was the incredible hulk from PEDs. And it's hard to imagine what else used to go on. Most of it was just accepted back then, as long as you didn't throw games to spite a backstabbing owner or get caught betting on games that you managed

If the Hall didn't have any cheaters, there'd be a lot of space open there

Where did you see that Schmidt used PEDs to bulk up? I've never seen that and I doubt it happened. What he did say was that he took Greenies (amphetamines) later in his career. The only problem with that was that it was common practice in baseball in the 50's - 80's, in fact, the trainer's used to doll them out like candy. Check out Ball Four on that one.

[Mike D.]

I haven’t heard the Schmidt accusation before, either.

I have heard “there is already a PED user in the HOF”
(and have heard so for years).

If I were making baseless guesses, Schmidt wouldn’t be on my short list.

[mr2686]

Originally Posted by Mike D.

I haven’t heard the Schmidt accusation before, either.

I have heard “there is already a PED user in the HOF”
(and have heard so for years).

If I were making baseless guesses, Schmidt wouldn’t be on my short list.

I heard that also, but always thought (but it has never been confirmed) that it might be Reggie Jackson. I base that only on his last year with Oakland and playing with the Roid Boys, as well as it looked to me like he was a bit bigger. Like I said, pure speculation.

[Mike D.]

Originally Posted by mr2686

I heard that also, but always thought (but it has never been confirmed) that it might be Reggie Jackson. I base that only on his last year with Oakland and playing with the Roid Boys, as well as it looked to me like he was a bit bigger. Like I said, pure speculation.

Another very strong player who played a long time and took a physical beating on the base paths AND played with those A’s team is in the HOF. Again...just baseless guessing.

The right answer is probably some scrawny guy we’d never expect!

[steve B]

Originally Posted by mr2686

I heard that also, but always thought (but it has never been confirmed) that it might be Reggie Jackson. I base that only on his last year with Oakland and playing with the Roid Boys, as well as it looked to me like he was a bit bigger. Like I said, pure speculation.

I'm a lot bigger than I was in my 20's and 30's too, and it has nothing to do with PEDs. Unless they've categorized cheeseburgers and donuts as PEDs...

[cardsagain74]

Originally Posted by Mike D.

If I were making baseless guesses, Schmidt wouldn’t be on my short list.

If I were making baseless guesses about "baseless guesses", it wouldn't be about a guy who (while having Pete Rose make funny quotes about how amazing Schmidt's body was) hit basically 700 HRs for the era he played in and scooped up everything near third base like a vacuum.... all while admitting how easily available greenies and other forms of PEDs were available in the past, and while saying that he would've taken steroids had he played in the '90s, among other statements where he basically infers that he didn't have the willpower to avoid those temptations at a younger age. Quotes from his book and HBO interview, btw

[Mike D.]

Originally Posted by cardsagain74

If I were making baseless guesses about "baseless guesses", it wouldn't be about a guy who (while having Pete Rose make funny quotes about how amazing Schmidt's body was) hit basically 700 HRs for the era he played in and scooped up everything near third base like a vacuum.... all while admitting how easily available greenies and other forms of PEDs were available in the past, and while saying that he would've taken steroids had he played in the '90s, among other statements where he basically infers that he didn't have the willpower to avoid those temptations at a younger age. Quotes from his book and HBO interview, btw

See, to me the guy who admitted to using other things and saying he'd consider using strikes me as a guy who probably would admit to using if he used, not saying he might if he did.

But I'm far from an expert on such things...the one thing the whole steroid thing has taught me is that you never know. I mean, for example, everyone thinks of the sluggers as users, but once testing was put in place, more pitchers got popped than hitters.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by cardsagain74

That should say "the cheaters who got caught".

Whitey Ford has readily admitted to being Harris from Major League in his later years (doctoring the ball). Mike Schmidt was the incredible hulk from PEDs. And it's hard to imagine what else used to go on. Most of it was just accepted back then, as long as you didn't throw games to spite a backstabbing owner or get caught betting on games that you managed

If the Hall didn't have any cheaters, there'd be a lot of space open there

Without cheaters in there it would be more like the closet of fame. Soon you will have all the Ford and Schmidt fans saying they are innocent. At least you didn't call out Nolan Ryan and Tony Gwynn.

[Nunzio11]

Originally Posted by Jim65

Not sure that putting a player accused of taking bribes to throw games would be viewed as positive.

You’re right. I was originally thinking about Jackson with a collectors popularity bias. It would definitely raise debate both positive and negative and given whats currently going on it would probably be quite negative.

[Snapolit1]

Most recent numbers I saw earlier today look very good for Walker.

[nat]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

Most recent numbers I saw earlier today look very good for Walker.

The deal with Walker is that he usually gets more support from the writers who release their ballots than those who keep them private. Based on the degree to which his support has dropped (between public and private ballots) in the past, Walker should be right on the line. Nate Rakich, over at 538, has developed an algorithm to model this and he predicts that Walker gets 73% of the vote. Which is obviously close enough to fall within any reasonable margin of error. One way or the other, it's going to be close.

But also, if he doesn't get in, it would be unprecedented for a player who gets this much support from the BBWAA to not get elected by the VC (or the Era Committees, as they're calling it now). So Walker might get in this year, but will almost certainly get in eventually.

[rats60]

Originally Posted by nat

The deal with Walker is that he usually gets more support from the writers who release their ballots than those who keep them private. Based on the degree to which his support has dropped (between public and private ballots) in the past, Walker should be right on the line. Nate Rakich, over at 538, has developed an algorithm to model this and he predicts that Walker gets 73% of the vote. Which is obviously close enough to fall within any reasonable margin of error. One way or the other, it's going to be close.

But also, if he doesn't get in, it would be unprecedented for a player who gets this much support from the BBWAA to not get elected by the VC (or the Era Committees, as they're calling it now). So Walker might get in this year, but will almost certainly get in eventually.

Gil Hodges received over 50% 11 times. Over 60% 3 times with a high of 63.4%. Walker has only received over 50% one time, last year and most likely again this year. These are different times, but Hodges is still waiting for his call. With Joe Torre and Phil Rizzuto getting in, you would think that it is time for Hodges with his combination of playing career and managerial career to get elected.