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  #1  
Old 09-28-2020, 04:33 PM
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philliesphan philliesphan is offline
Marc S.
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Michael-

The 1938s had a coupon that was not attached to the card - hence you will not find a tabbed example of such. The coupon, IIRC, was inserted alongside the card in the confection
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  #2  
Old 09-28-2020, 04:36 PM
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philliesphan philliesphan is offline
Marc S.
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I reckon that there are probably fewer than ten folks that have the vast majority of tabbed Zeenuts from the 1933-1936 timeframe. I further imagine that at least one or two of them has a fairly robust checklist based upon year of issue. But most of those folks are the series "completists" who are working on the 3,500+ series and for them the delineation is not as important. The variations in the 1933-1936 series are generally widely known (and indicated in the Horne book), and it's mostly from there a question of finding tabbed examples where they exist to get the specific year.

As far as I know, not all of the variations from the 1933-1936 timeframe are known to exist with a tab. Obviously some of the more notable ones are, like Joe D
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  #3  
Old 09-29-2020, 01:33 AM
abctoo abctoo is offline
Michael Fried
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philliesphan View Post
. . . The variations in the 1933-1936 series are generally widely known (and indicated in the Horne book), and it's mostly from there a question of finding tabbed examples where they exist to get the specific year.
Here's the problem, even the grading companies get it wrong or don't address the variation issue. In the three scans below, which is the "large pose" card?







Mike

Last edited by abctoo; 09-29-2020 at 01:34 AM.
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  #4  
Old 09-29-2020, 07:06 AM
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rhettyeakley rhettyeakley is offline
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Last one is the“large” pose. Many of the size variations are very subtle. In this case if you measured the length of Almada’s image top of head to tip of foot I imagine the length would be different than the other two (but you can’t do that in a scan). Also, how much clearance between top of head and top of card (but this is problematic because it can be off if the card is miscut or trimmed).

Generally what I try to do is look at the background of the image and see if there are differences in what is included in the image (ie the cropping). In the case of Almada there is a second ballplayer in the background at far left of the first 2 examples while the 3rd example pictured that player has been cropped out of the image... thus the entire image has been ever so slightly “zoomed in” resulting in a “larger image”
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  #5  
Old 09-29-2020, 11:35 AM
abctoo abctoo is offline
Michael Fried
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhettyeakley View Post
Last one is the “large” pose. Many of the size variations are very subtle. . . .
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCbE..._as=subscriber
rhettyeakley,

You know your Zeenuts. Obviously from the pictures I provided, PSA misidentified the card as a "large pose" and SCG didn't care which year it was issued -- to SCG it's just a generic 1933-36 Zeenut.

You've hit the nail on the head. There are no good picture guides that distinguish the subtle differences of many similar cards by the year in which they were issued from 1933 through 1936.

To All,

While I have a long way to go, over the past couple of weeks I have put together pictures of about 135 different 1933-36 Zeenuts with coupons that expire April 1st 1934 (issued in 1933), April 1st 1935 (issued in 1934), April 1st 1936 (issued in 1935) or Oct 1st 1936 (issued in 1936).

If people are willing to help, perhaps we can put together an on-line guide of each player's card from this period (1933-36) with scans showing each separate date of issue.

I am willing to post a list of the scans by player name and coupon expiry date I have so that net54baseball readers can post scans of cards with coupons not on that list. It can then be all put together.

What do you think? Is it worth a try? At least, we can resolve the dates of issue of the subtle yearly differences in many of these 1933-36 cards. It's a start.

Let me know what you think.

To rhettyeakley,

I found your video on-line a couple of days ago while looking for more info on Zeenuts and enjoyed it. Nice cards, tough set. Still looking for a 1911 Western Playground Association card.

Mike
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  #6  
Old 09-29-2020, 07:14 PM
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philliesphan philliesphan is offline
Marc S.
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Default Hi Mike

Mike-

I have over fifty tabbed Zeenuts from 1933-1937 and would be willing to help with. your project should you receive interest from a few other collectors
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  #7  
Old 09-29-2020, 09:39 PM
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Below is a list of the 1933-36 cards that were confirmed with coupons, and thus year of issue, in the late 1970's by Jim Horne in his published Zeenut listing. I have transferred that information in a different format as seen on the list, which shows each subject and has four columns, one for each year 1933 through 1936, and indicated within that column whether card had been confirmed. I have it by year, and then sorted by team (as it is the Horne list).

There are bound to be numerous additions to this list since then...please let us know if you have any coupon cards not seen on the list. As you can see, very few had been found for the 1933 Black & White issue at the time, and beside for three Oakland players, all 1936 found were either from the Missions or the Seals. The astericks seen below are for those cards that have been confirmed after Horne's list by an advanced collector. The ones that indicate 'possibly small or large' are ones that size variations have been discovered after Horne's list was published, so size variation of confirmed coupon is not known, at least not to me.

Brian


1933 - coupon states "This offer expires April 1st, 1934."

-Mission-
Coscarart
Hafey (small)*

-Portland-
Blackerby
A.E. Jacobs

-Seals-
Cavaney, Mgr.
Davis


1934 - coupon states "This offer expires April 1st, 1935."

-Hollywood-
Carlyle
Durst
Haney
Johns
Page
Vitt

-Los Angeles-
Dittmar
Oglesby
Reese (large)
Stitzel

-Mission-
Chelini
Eckhardt (large)
Fitzpatrick
Hafey (large)
T. Pillette (possibly small or large)

-Oakland-
DeViveiros
Glaister
Joiner
Kintana (small)
McEvoy (small)
McIsaacs
Mailho
Mulligan (hands cut off)
Phebus
Pool (possibly small or large)
Salinsen

-Portland-
Cox
Kallio
Palmisano
Sheely (large)

-Sacramento-
Borja (possibly small or large)
Donovan
Hartwig (large)
Horne
House
Kampouris
Lahman
Ostenberg
Salvo
Steinbacker (large)

-Seals-
Backer
Ballou (socks with band - large)
J. Dimaggio (batting)
Douglas
Fenton
Henderson
Herrmann
Mails (large)
Sever
Stutz (bag visible)
Sulik
Woodall (throwing - large)

-Seattle-
Biongovanni
Coscarart
Holland
E. Kelly
Muller
Radonitz


1935 - coupon states "This offer expires April 1st, 1936."

-Hollywood-
Carlyle
Jolly

-Los Angeles-
Reese (small)
Statz (possibly small or large)

-Mission-
Almada (large)
Beck
Duggan (probably large)
Eckhardt (small)
Hafey (medium)
Mitchell
Mort (throwing)
Nicholas
Outen (throwing)
Street, Mgr.
Thurston (Mission)
Wright (facing forward)

-Oakland-
Anton (large)
Connors
Douglas (small)
Haid
E.Kelly
Kintana (large)
Ludolph
McEvoy (large)
McMullen
Mailho (possibly small or large)
Muller (large)
Mulligan (hands visible)
Ramondi (small)
Rego
Vitt, Mgr.
Walsh

-Sacramento-
Borja (possibly small or large)
Ellsworth
Hartwig (small)
Salvo
Steinbacker (small)
Stroner
Wirts (small)

-Seals-
Ballou (socks w/band -small)
Becker
Cole (glove on hand)
J. Dimaggio (throwing)
Densmore
Garibaldi (large)
Gibson (white sleeves)
Mails (large)
Marty (white sleeves)
Masucci
Monzo (small)
Newkirk
Norbert (large)
O'Doul (white sleeves)
Powers
Rhyne (side view - foot high)*
Sheehan (white sleeves)
Stitzel
Stutz (no bag in background)
Zinn


1936 - coupon states "This offer expires October 1st, 1936."

-Missions (this year only year designated as "Missions")-
Almada (small)
C.Beck
W.Beck
Francovich
D.Johnson
L.Johnson
Joost
Kamm, Mgr.
Mort (batting)
Nitcholas
Outen (batting)
Rosenberg
Sprinz
Stewart
Stitzel
Stoneham
Thurston (Missions)
West
Wright (looking left)

-Oakland-
Anton (small)
Douglas (large)
Muller (small)

-Seals-
Ballou (socks all black)
Barath
Borja
Cole (no glove)
Gibson (black sleeves)
Gira
Graves
B.Holder
Jorgensen
Mails (small)
Marty (black sleeves)
Masucci
Monzo (large)
Norbert (small)
O'Doul (black sleeves)
Rhyne (side view - foot low)
Salkeld
Sheehan (black sleeves)
Starritt
Woodall (batting)
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  #8  
Old 09-29-2020, 01:19 AM
abctoo abctoo is offline
Michael Fried
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philliesphan View Post
Michael-

The 1938s had a coupon that was not attached to the card - hence you will not find a tabbed example of such. The coupon, IIRC, was inserted alongside the card in the confection
If this is the coupon you are referring to, then it is a help. Once the 1933 through 1937 cards are identified by date on a coupon, the distinction of the 1938 cards wil become apparent.



Mike
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